DH doesn't want to 'do Santa'

[DoubleCarrick]

Morning all,

This almost feels like an anti-Christmas thread but I couldn't think of an appropriate place to post!

DH was brought up in a religion that doesn't celebrate Christmas. He left when he was about 14 but has never until he met me celebrated Christmas.

For me, the important things about Christmas are family, food, having a stocking and a couple of prezzies under the tree, a tree, crackers, etc. Nothing expensive or extravagant - Christmas is always low key when it comes to expenses.

DH is pretty happy with this and enjoys celebrating Christmas with my family. He's obviously been having a think now though. Our first baby is due just after new year and he mentioned yesterday that he doesn't think we should "do Santa". He said he's happy with everything else but isn't comfortable telling our children that Father Christmas exists and will bring them presents.

I'm as of yet unsure how I feel so have told him I'll think for a few days and discuss with him later.

My thoughts - how can we do stockings if there is no Santa? Both me and DH still get stockings from "Santa." How do we broach it with family members, especially those with kids? Will our baby be the one four year old in school who ruins it for everyone else?

How do we come up with something that isn't telling our child that Santa exists but will match with my traditions also?

Is anyone able to share what they do if they've never done Santa?

Thankyou!

I think it's lovely that you and your DH are building your own Christmas traditions, I'm sure Christmas can still be magical without the idea of Santa.

However, I know a little boy through a friend who is 6, his parents have always told him the truth which has never been a problem until this year as his friends are talking more and more about Santa, he is really struggling with who to believe, his parents or his friends. For example he hasn't written a letter to Santa as the others have and this week he asked one of his friends to include what he wants for Christmas on their letter as he was worried he wouldn't get anything! Of course, this might just be his experience, I'm sure other children are fine with it!

I'm not rubbishing other people's 'traditions' Geretrude - I'm giving my own explanation of what happened to me. Santa has nothing to do with what Christmas is supposed to represent anyway. It's a religious festival after all.

We don't use Santa as a behaviour tool. But, dd's face when she sees 'santa' is magical. This idea that you write him a letter and he brings you a gift fascinates and enthrals her. It's a little part of Christmas for us, but a magical one. I don't see it as lying either. It's like a secret that they eventually suss out and then get to become part of the secret. We have lots of lovely traditions that dd enjoys. She saves money in her charity jar and we buy a present for a children's charity (usually our local tesco run a toy drive for either poorly children or children living in poverty). We make special cards for family and have an 'activity' advent calendar where we do different crafts/activities and baking. It's lovely.

For those of you who say that presents are from Father Christmas though, how do you explain to your DC why FC doesn't bring poor children many presents?

I'm always bemused at the idea that it has to be all or nothing with Father Christmas (although this thread has been lovely and balanced). We never believed when we were children, but always did father Christmas things as a game. We'd still write 'Father Christmas' a letter, and leave out a mince pie and whiskey (until mum pointed out that 'Mrs Christmas' did all the work and she'd probably prefer wine!). We'd then try to stay up and listen for 'father Christmas' bringing our stockings. Our Christmases were no less magical for it being a game rather than real, and we're planning to take a similar approach with our DC.

For me Father Christmas was a magic postman.

Mum and Dad would either put our orders in with FC, or 'help him out' by doing some shopping for him. All the presents would go to the North Pole for wrapping. Then, he'd come on Xmas eve.

Worked very well. Presents were labelled from family, but FC had 'brought' them all.

I do the same with my DC.

I cant say right for saying wrong , I thought Helena's post was implying that all of who do FC are raising grabby brats who don't have realistic expectations of money and dont understand the value of things and indeed fail to be polite.
This is so far from the reality of my own DC and most DC I know I felt perturbed by this. But then Helena made it clear it was perhaps her own dc who she feels may err to this behaviour had she done FC I understood. Ie her own dc may ask for un realistic items, think there is a never ending pot of money and never learn how to thank people...

However if neither the majority of DC are not materialistic and grabby due to xmas, and Helena's are not at risk of it - what are we talking about - who was Helena talking about?

I really like the idea of telling him about my childhood christmas experiences because he literally has no concept of the idea of the magic of Christmas

There you go, he simply doesn't know.

You need to explain to him its nothing to do with religion at all, its just a bonus, add on for children thats all.

Its also not about loosing christmas magic, or not having a good christmas without him, of course you can, who doesnt love to get presents, the tree and all the rest.

FC is however an incredible cherry on top of all of it. The whole north pole thing etc..the elves...

I also suppose its whats going to give the maximum enjoyment for the children.

Will they love christmas without FC - YES, of course.

But the whole FC thing adds that extra - and why not give them that extra!

I'm giving my own explanation of what happened to me. Santa has nothing to do with what Christmas is supposed to represent anyway. It's a religious festival after all

But Lottie, your own dc are not you, you said your dd is sort of all by herself trying to believe in it, all their friends will be doing it - at school, asking what santa is bringing etc.

Its a religious festival?Not according to many people it was pagan and before that....and before that...

what date does something happen that makes it the one we are all supposed to do?

I dont care who made it - did it - where it comes from, I am just extremely grateful at this dark miserable and depressing time of year someone somewhere has evolved a festival that means lots of lights, decorations and fun.

I also adore the nativity story, and think its perfect and compliments FC well. I am not religious.

Lottie by the age when they start to notice the "flaws" in the story they tend to be at the age to start having suspicions/stop believing.

Paganism is a religion btw!

I'm reading all of your posts with great interest, thank you all so much for such considered answers.

I don't think Santa will ever be extravagant and we will stick to stockings. I know that for me, stockings are non-negotiable and I make sure DH has a stocking and he also does one for me. So in a way, I guess he's already doing the Santa thing but without the kids!

I wonder whether any future kids could help me pick out "santa prezzies" for DH and to wrap them. That way they could know that it's in the spirit of Santa but he's not an actual person.

I dunno.

I guess I just need to chat to DH and see. Def think it'll be worth showing him this thread when I get chance

My own dc are not me that is true but I can't bring myself to make something up. Dd3 is allowed to believe what she likes but if she asks me a question about Santa I tell her the truth - i.e. It's a fun story about Christmas.

Non-existence of FC is a bit of an open secret in our house- we do hang out stockings for him etc but it's all done with a big wink. You can enjoy the tradition without trying to convince children it's true.

Some people genuinely try to convince their kids with footprints etc- to me that seems odd but that's only because it's not what I had growing up. No biggie.

In your shoes, I think I'd still hang stockings up etc but talk to your child when big enough about FC as a lovely folk story that it's nice to celebrate.

Now, what I do find really odd is people who use FC to influence behaviour- it seems to take a lovely story of kindness and generosity and turn it into a transaction (good behaviour = presents) and thus take all the fun and magic out. And frankly do people ever not give their children presents because they've behaved badly??

My dc never believed in Santa. They always knew it was just imagination and we had fantastic Christmas s when they were young. I often hear people say how disappointing it is when they grow out of all the santa stuff but that never happened here as still had the same excitement. They never once told anyone in school and fully enjoyed all the excitement. We have a gd now and her dm is all into Santa and of course we play along. But she is no more excited than ours were at that age.

It was more the assertion that it was about the parents than the children Lottie. I do the easter bunny and the tooth fairy too.

People have lied to their children about god existing for millenia and all sorts of other mythical gods and creatures. I don't think it's a massive deal. And I really don't remember being devastated when I found out he wasn't real - like tangerino said, it's all done with a wink in our house, much like the aforementioned easter bunny and tooth fairy

Op you have attracted a disproportionate amount of non participators to your thread.
It seems very early to be agonizing about this issue to me, odd even that your DH is thinking about it now!

I always think of the interviews I have seen with the now adult dc of people like Roald Dhal and Spike Milligan.

I bet they are on U Tube.
Look at their faces whilst they talk about their Fathers. Spikes daughter talking about the fairy letters he used to write her, from the fairys at the bottom of the garden, or Dhals, talking about this dream blowing thing he put up against their windows just as they were falling asleep when he was developing the BFG.

My ds still thinks Justin Fletcher and Mr Tumble are separate people. I have not felt it my duty to expose the 'lie', by the time he realises he will be old enough not to care so much. Children's ability to suspend disbelief is a fine thing.

No DC yet but my good childhood memories involve the magic of Santa, listening for the sleigh bells, leaving out a mincepie and carrot for Rudolph. The sheer unbearable excitement that he would be delivering presents. It all seemed so magical.

It's lovely that you and DH are able to discuss it and form your own traditions.

Not read all the thread but do consider as they age in particular the local area and kids they'll mix with

My DDs go to a very catholic school with no other religions there at all. Every single person I know does Santa. I'm sure in some schools not doing Santa would be fine but in our school you'd stick out like a sore thumb and the child would be almost excluded? Throughout December there's breakfast with Santa, Santa calendars, Santa visits, Santa tho shop etc all in school hours.

Why would they be excluded? My kids did all those things, and as far as I am aware enjoyed them. I'm not sure why schools feel the need to be so OTT, but just because you don't take the story seriously doesn't mean your children can't enjoy the Santa events. I'm surprised that at a Catholic school there is such whole scale buy in to the Santa myth. I always rather assumed that I had so little exposure to Santa as a child because I went to a Catholic primary school.

The religious members of my family don't lie to their children about god. They share their heartfelt beliefs. That's totally different to Santa, when parents tell their children about Santa they are telling a story which they know isn't the truth. I think talking about lying is probably a bit unfair, but no parent thinks Santa genuinely exists. Religious families don't think that god is a bit of fun, which surely is how most Santa endorsing families think of Father Christmas?

Out of interest, does anybody have kids who you tried to teach about Father Christmas but that just won't buy it?

My sister is all up for the story but her 5 year old son tells her (and has always shown this much scepticism) that reindeer don't fly and that there is no way one man could deliver to the whole world in 24 hours.

He does know an awful lot about planes and their speeds though - this must be guiding his judgement somewhat.