111 guy told me to give DD Ibuprofen with chickenpox wtf??

[ARRGHHHHHxxxxx]

Cut a long story short.

DD has severe chickenpox. Has temp, needed advice so called 111. Spots started showing Wednesday 2 days ago.

Spoke to a lady, who took details said another person was gonna call me. Another lady called and said my DD needs to be seen as she requested photos so I sent them. She said someone will call me to be seen. A guy rung and this part of the convo went like this.

111 guy: Have you given Calpol
Me: yes
111 guy: what about Ibuprofen
Me: ibuprofen?
111 guy: yes
Me: you can't give that to a child with chicken pox
111 guy: erm yes you can depends on the stage
Me: I'm not giving her ibuprofen I know not to give a child it for chickenpox, it states it on the NHS website.

Imagine if this was a first time mum not knowing what was right and what isn't. I'm fuming.

Where did you get this from?? Nurse here that has direct line to 111 for OOH as no drs on site and they triage you to the appropriate practioner.

The Scottish NHS website doesn’t mention ibuprofen as far as I can see. The CDC website language is “recommends avoiding treatment with ibuprofen if possible”. So clearly the takes vary. This feels reminiscent of the oversimplified pregnancy advice.

This

The amount of times I’ve been given advice by an NHS profesional that was against guidelines / opposite to what the NHS website states is outrageous. I’m almost certain that the 111 person didn’t know about Ibuprofen and chickenpox. My daughter was hospitalised with it, and a junior doctor tried to give it to her - another doctor stopped it. It’s the stuff of nightmares

I asked him to view previous photos I sent the other person. He said he can't see them.

He will have been a doctor.

The first person you speak to is not a properly trained healthcare professional. The second/third people you speak to are doctors/healthcare professionals.

If he phoned you from 111 saying he was a doctor, then he was a doctor. They don't hand over callers' details to any bod who happens to be passing by.

If you uploaded the photos then they would have been passed on to the doctor.

Errrm, they were being sarcastic.

That's what they said. 111 is a Canadian run call centre that does triage by rote, then connects you with who they decide is an appropriate contact.

This

You actually don’t know if they are a doctor or not. Most of the time drs aren’tt there and a nurse gives advice when they are not paediatric trained.

Anyone that has kids should never use 111. The questions the call handlers who have no medical background are there to divert ambulances away. They deliberately press different answers to your questions to stop the pathways from automatically triggering an ambulance.

Look up 111 and how many poor babies and young children have been killed because of their incompetence, deliberate misdiagnoses and how many times coroners in these cases have said what 111 need to do to prevent future deaths but they ignore it or if it is implemented in one area, it isn’t in another.

I’ve got screenshots of call handlers who have been on a night out (19yr old), getting in at 4, in work for 7 on twitter complaining about having to work there, tweeting how hungover they were, how bored. Why are they on their phone all day updating fb, twitter when they should be taken calls. I took this to senior directors who said all staff should put phones in a locker when they start work - clearly not.

I’m saying this as someone directly affected by the failures of 111. I know people will say it’s been fine for them. I’m pleased for you but don’t put your children at any future risk using this service. It is not fit for purpose.

Please don't give sensible advice, we are all supposed to be outraged and...well not sure what this thread is meant to achieve really, surely making a complaint if it feels necessary so this can be addressed would be more fruitful. I suspect if someone is calling 111 for chicken pox the doctor reasonably assumes the balance has tipped. It isn't global guidance not to give it anyway, the NHS is pretty dated in its advice on many things.

111 is often the way to access out of hours appointments for children. Surely the advice is to push to be seen or take your child to be seen rather than take the advice as gospel rather than never phone?

This.

THIS, this- a thousand times this!

The UK is utterly bizarre in its 'look look someone did something wrong' attitude alongside 'please help me with everything' requests... Live somewhere without free healthcare and phone lines dedicated to support you and then you'll become very respectful of people who actually know their shit. Also get your children vaccinated against Chicken Pox because why not..?! All of mine were because I had severe side effects of childhood CP and they've swanned through the regular outbreaks so well worth it. But they were born in a country where you had no free healthcare so had to think for yourselves.

Don’t be daft. The virus lives in the body, not on the skin!!!

When my grandson was hospitalised with severe chicken pox and a fever that wouldn’t subside with Calpol, the first thing the doctor did was give him ibuprofen. Once his temp went down, he was put on a 4 hourly does of Calpol then 2 hours later a dose of ibuprofen. He said that she was more at risk of febrile convulsions due to the high temperature than having a minuscule risk of a side effect.

I'm 100% certain that the 111 operator will know about ibuprofen and chickenpox. If the assessment picks up a chance of chickenpox (ie a blistering rash) at the end of it in big huge bold letters it will say 'do not use ibuprofen if chickenpox is suspected'

Just to clarify.. why did you ring 111..what advice exactly were you looking for ? Chickenpox in the UK is a common childhood illness.. was your child particularly ill with it ? This is the usual advice... what is the problem ?

Can you post a link that shows it's a Canadian run call centre please. Google has nothing

Do you have any medical qualifications?

Ibuprofen didn’t cause that reaction though

"Why shouldn t you give ibuprofen to children with chickenpox?
"Please remember NOT to give your children nurofen/ibuprofen if you think your child has it. "This type of medicine is an anti-inflammatory. It reacts with the chickenpox making them go deeper into the skin tissue, potentially causing a more severe secondary infection."10 Jan 2020"

From Google