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Children's health

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Original poster

DS sleeping from 1-2pm in afternoon until 7am next day...

184 replies

getyourfingeroutyournose · 25/04/2016 17:59

Been going on for about 2 weeks now where he just sleeps and sleeps and sometimes complains of a headache.
I've booked him in for doctors on wednesday but what else can I do? Should I be worried about this excessive tiredness?

OP posts:
mustnotwait · 27/04/2016 14:12

Hi,

Just seen your post and would like to offer my experience. No solutions though!

My son at 18 months would sleep from 7pm at night through to 1pm get up and eat constantly until 3pm then go for a nap for an hour wake up and continue eating and running about until he dropped again at 7pm. This went on for a month then he snapped out of it.

The HV insisted it was because he didn't have a routine (even though before this he definitely did).

Never did get to the bottom of it.

mustnotwait · 27/04/2016 14:12

Hi,

Just seen your post and would like to offer my experience. No solutions though!

My son at 18 months would sleep from 7pm at night through to 1pm get up and eat constantly until 3pm then go for a nap for an hour wake up and continue eating and running about until he dropped again at 7pm. This went on for a month then he snapped out of it.

The HV insisted it was because he didn't have a routine (even though before this he definitely did).

Never did get to the bottom of it.

Ouch44 · 27/04/2016 14:14

I think if it was me I'd take him to A&E.

Onsera3 · 27/04/2016 14:17

Sorry I haven't read every post.

Did they do bloods and check iron?

Could he have worms?

They can cause anaemia which could cause tiredness. And sore stomach.

I suspect DS3 had recently. Something was off. Had hives like rash on legs. Then a few days later a mouth ulcer (I get when anaemic). Then was weeing ALL the time all of a sudden. It wasn't til after I thought worms that he mentioned itchy bum.

gruffalocake2 · 27/04/2016 14:24

If it is diabetes won't it be type 1? It's really quite different from type 2, it's an auto immune disease, you stop making any insulin. It's very dangerous if you don't treat it quickly. Please do a blood test at the pharmacy or ask any diabetic as they will have clean strips to test the blood, clean needles to prick the finger and the little machine you need to read the blood sugar level. It's easy to do.

t1mum · 27/04/2016 16:03

Ok, so the initial blood test they do is a finger prick to get a smear of blood to put on a testing strip. It's a bit sore but no big needles or anything. Plenty of 4 year olds do their own several times a day.

As I said upthread, it could be a number of things and it may be nothing. However, the symptoms as you describe them warrant a closer look.

If you can manage it, chemists sell blood glucose testing kits. You need to test 2 hours after a meal to get a proper reading (BG levels can go high after a meal in non-diabetics so you have to wait until the time it should be back in normal range).

Or push again with the GP or go to a walk-in centre. As gruffalocake says, if it is Type 1 it is very, very dangerous to leave it undiagnosed. It is nothing like Type 2 in that respect. Seriously critically life threateningly dangerous.

The worst that can happen if you pursue this is 2 minutes of discomfort for your child and slight embarassment about use of the doctor's time.

Original poster
getyourfingeroutyournose · 27/04/2016 16:57

I've been told by the doctor that if he were to have diabetes, it is more likely to be type 2 and we would be able to control with diet. Unlike my dad who has type 1 and needs insulin, special diet and many other meds.
I'm also aware that they tested my dads blood sugars with the finger prick test and completely missed his diabetes for months until he had a heart attack... obviously I know that is drastic but I would rather they did a blood test than get the sugar level test done and give anyone an excuse not to explore it any further iyswim.

I had worms as a kid and I'm pretty sure it's not that. I'm an ex carer and I check poop way more than most people would be comfortable with too. I will try and find out properly though. We have a cat but she is indoor with no fleas and has been dewormed monthly by the vet since we got her.

OP posts:
gamerchick · 27/04/2016 17:21

I thought it ws very rare for a child to develop type 2. If your dad is diabetic why haven't you tested his sugars yourself?

Maybe you should see a doctor

Original poster
getyourfingeroutyournose · 27/04/2016 17:48

I have seen the doctor. I'm relaying what she said yesterday. She said it's extremely common for type 2 (which is normally controlled with diet etc). I'm nowhere near my dad to steal his testing kit either. We don't like in the same county as them. I sometimes go back to visit but I don't think it'd be worth the trip considering checking his sugar levels might not actually tell me anything. A blood test would. I've called the doctors again today and explained about him being funny about weeing in a pot and someone reminded me that he knows how to go in a potty so I'll be getting the potty back out temporarily until there is some wee to go in the little pot.
In the meantime, he is still awake right now... he did sleep in this morning until about 10am but it's nearly six and he's awake and eating his dinner... I think something is improving. He's still peeing for England though.

OP posts:
t1mum · 27/04/2016 17:48

WTAF? There are NO Type 2 children aged 4 in this country. If this is what the GP actually said then they are talking complete and utter rubbish. Is your dad definitely type 1? Can you not get him round to test your son's bloods?

I'm starting to get frustrated with this thread. I cannot understand why, with a history of Type 1 in your family and your little child showing symptoms, you would not insist on a test.

I can't actually believe that you would find excuses not to get your child properly tested, so I am going to hope for your child's sake that it is not something serious or that you have been mis-communicating symptoms.

AnyFucker · 27/04/2016 17:51

A child aged 4 with type 2 diabetes ?

No

Cel982 · 27/04/2016 17:59

OP, Type 2 diabetes in young children is extremely rare, and would only tend to occur in a child who's morbidly obese. I'm a GP and I've never seen a case of Type 2 in a young child.

I would share the concern of others here that a blood or urine glucose needs to be checked ASAP. From what you've said he's been showing fatigue, increased appetite and excessive urination, which are classic symptoms of diabetes. Unless there was some other reason why your GP felt this diagnosis was unlikely, I don't think it's something that should be put on the long finger.

FlyingScotsman · 27/04/2016 18:03

Agree too. I would be massive like surprised to see a child that young with type 2 diabetes.

Tbf, the OP is only following what the GP told her (and if she didn't understand well, then I believe this is the GP responsibility).

I would really make a clear list of this symptoms and actually check on the NHS website what are the symptoms of diabetes in children.
The go in and give the list to the GP and demand a proper test (I've blood test). One of the reason GPs don't want to do bloods on a child that age is that they don't always have a nurse who can do them so you have t go to hospital etc...
Not a reason good enough not to do it IMO.

Nandocushion · 27/04/2016 18:07

T2 is being diagnosed in young children a lot more often here these days (USA). AFAIK it is usually overweight children though, or those with appalling diets.

bloodyteenagers · 27/04/2016 18:09

Am I reading this correctly?
Two weeks ago you took your child to the gp and told if no improvement come back in two weeks.
Two weeks, no improvement so you take him back. To be told come back in two weeks of no improvement because they don't want to stress him doing tests?
Wtaf? Get the a walk in or if there are no walk ins, a&e and get tests done today.

If it's nothing awesome. But another two weeks is a hell of a long time if there is something wrong.

Zucker · 27/04/2016 18:28

For all the doctor is saying it sounds as if he/she isn't actually taking you seriously. I'd go for a second opinion.

Original poster
getyourfingeroutyournose · 27/04/2016 20:07

I am literally writing what the doctor has said to me. I may have misunderstood what she said but I'm pretty sure she said type 2 was far more common in kids than people realise. He's not overweight at all. If anything he's a bit skinny.

I've told the doctor everything I can and I think she is of the opinion that it is viral and that as his sleeping is improving that he could be getting over a viral infection. She's one of the better doctors. I refuse to go to the other one I saw as he definitely palms me off any time I go there. Sadly my favourite one doesn't work for them any more... If I could find him I'd follow him!

OP posts:
Original poster
getyourfingeroutyournose · 27/04/2016 20:09

"Type 2 diabetes (formerly called adult-onset or non-insulin-dependent diabetes) can develop at any age. It most commonly becomes apparent during adulthood. But type 2 diabetes in children is rising." I think this is what the GP was referring to.

OP posts:
AnyFucker · 27/04/2016 20:29

I would only go down the "could be a vanishingly rare case of Type 2" route if Type 1 had been ruled out

which it hasn't

gamerchick · 27/04/2016 20:33

I'm gobsmacked that a GP is going on about diabetes and hasn't even bothered to check and wants to wait and see. I mean it's not as if it's threatening or anything.

t1mum · 27/04/2016 20:45

No. Your GP is wrong. There are 124 cases of Type 2 Diabetes in under 15s in England and Wales, none of which are in the under 5s. There are roughly 24,000 under 15s living with Type 1 Diabetes and it is on the increase in the under 5s. If your father has Type 1, then you have a family history of the condition and should have a very low threshold for assessment if symptoms are present.

Type 1 Diabetes if untreated is immediately life threatening - it can develop over a few weeks or months but by the time symptoms are noticeable there is a significant risk of coma or death. Type 2 is different.

She either thinks your child has a virus or you are making a fuss about nothing/bad sleeping habits. But if she is seriously trying to tell you that your child might have diabetes but it would be Type 2 then please do not listen to a word she is saying because she is completely wrong.

Original poster
getyourfingeroutyournose · 27/04/2016 20:56

She's asked me to keep a diary and keep an eye on how things are improving. I'm under instruction to tell her the moment things go back downhill. I'll get the pee results tomorrow. I think it's fair to say that over the next two weeks we will be getting tests and having to test my patience to limits i didn't realise it had.

OP posts:
Original poster
getyourfingeroutyournose · 27/04/2016 21:26

I think I'm going to have to ask my dad. I'm not a doctor myself and I've lived with other people having it but never a child. It's quite a bit to take in and I assumed that she wasn't ushering him off for more tests because she wasn't concerned enough to assume it was that. I do realise everyone thinks I'm one horrific mother for not shoving him in a and e right now but they genuinely would send us home. I've already asked if I can just take him and I've been told by 111 that they would send me home as it's not an emergency.

OP posts:
HopelesslydevotedtoGu · 27/04/2016 21:46

111 are not medically trained, they often make errors, they work from algorithms which don't cover all eventualities. 111 do not know what the A&E doctors and nurses will do.

Of course it could be nothing, a virus/ behavioural thing etc.

But if he has symptoms of type 1 diabetes then he really needs a simple blood test (fingerprick or normal blood test) to check his blood sugar, and a urine test. The blood test is imperative, the urine test alone wouldn't be sufficient. It could be done in a GP surgery or hospital. This will tell you if he is becoming severely ill from type 1 diabetes, as his sugar would be high and his body would be making something called ketones which would show in his urine. In this case the child could be drinking and weeing loads, feeling unwell, drowsy, tummy pain, sweet smelling breath, losing weight. Not necessarily all of the above. This is an emergency, people can and do die from this. Not to be overly dramatic, but if your DC seems unwell I would take this seriously and go to A&E/ similar.

If you do decide to go to A&E/ walk in centre or similar, at triage say that your DC has symptoms of type 1 diabetes and list them, don't start by talking about the sleeping.

If you decide to stick with your GP's plan, tbh I would call them back and clarify the type 2 diabetes thing. A normal weight 5 year old will not have type 2 diabetes. If your GP is thinking this I would seek another GP as that is bonkers. Hopefully it is a misunderstanding though.

t1mum · 27/04/2016 21:47

Yep, talk to you dad and see if he can do a bg check on your DS. Hopefully you will find that we [I] are taking 2 and 2 from your posts and making 5.

No-one thinks you are a bad mother at all. I took the GPs advice for weeks (repeat visits) and was just lucky that I decided to put my reticence to one side within a whisker of it becoming potentially fatal.

Chances are it will be ok, but at least you can have some peace of mind once you have ruled this out. If you don't get good news, pm me and I'll point you in the direction of good support groups.