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Children's health

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Original poster

Flu vaccine and MMR at the same time - is this Ok?

17 replies

Anastasie · 22/10/2015 12:18

I held off on the MMR when ds3 was little as I was put off by the high pressure to have it, and didn't feel I knew enough to make a decision either way.

He is nearly 3 now and I think I'm Ok with him having it. He is having his flu vaccine on Monday, and I have booked for him to have the MMR at the same time.

Does this sound like it will be alright or am I making it more likely he will have a bad reaction to one or both? I don't want a very poorly toddler next week and could do it separately if that would make a difference but I'm not sure if it will.

TIA

OP posts:

QOD · 22/10/2015 12:20

Personally I went separate. But this was 16 odd yrs ago.
I don't like the multiple jabs but a gazillion people will tell you it's fine.
it's a personal choice and you need to feel comfortable

Original poster

Anastasie · 22/10/2015 12:26

Thank you

I've been trying to read up but can't work out the differences, there are things about giving two live vaccines at the same time, and it's all really confusing - I think the injected flu vaccine is a dead one? So would that be better?

I don't particularly know if I trust our practice nurse to get it right. Or would just like some reassurance really.

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Sidge · 22/10/2015 13:54

You can give two live vaccines together, and because the flu vaccine is intranasal rather than injectable then there is absolutely no issue with having them together. The old advice was to either have live vaccines on the same day or wait 4 weeks between them, but that was revised in 2014 and is no longer necessary for most live vaccines.

Conversely if you'd rather wait then you could do his flu vaccine Monday and then have the MMR at any other time. The flu vaccine for children is up the nose so you won't get a choice to have the injectable one without specific reason.

ScienceBased · 22/10/2015 14:51

I would strongly advise against this - both vaccines contain aluminium, and the research is out on just how safe this ingredient is to be injected into the human body (see Professor Chris Exley's ongoing work at Keele University). Aluminium is linked to various health complaints and until we know more it is very important to minimise aluminium exposure as far as possible, and especially to space out aluminium-containing vaccines (virtually all of them) as they give a very concentrated amount.

I commend your waiting until you child is three for the MMR, very sensible, and vastly reduces chances of adverse effects. But I would strongly advise not to have the flu vaccine at the same time, if at all. It has a very high failure rate and is linked to a number of side effects (including "flu like symptoms). Flu is not a serious disease in otherwise healthy, well nourished children, so on balance it is not worth the risk. But if you really must have it, please do leave a good gap after MMR.

Sidge · 22/10/2015 15:12

Fluenz Tetra, the nasal spray used in the UK, does not contain aluminium.

Neither do either of the MMR vaccines used in the UK. Aluminium adjuvants aren't generally used in live vaccines.

If you're going to advise against certain vaccines ScienceBased then maybe ensure you're giving accurate information.

Original poster

Anastasie · 22/10/2015 17:05

Thank you both for taking the time. I am relieved to hear that neither contains aluminium.

I did read that two live vaccines should either be given o nthe same day or four weeks min. apart, not sure if this stands?

Also if he has side effects from either are they likely to be multiplied by having both together?

Sorry, bit ignorant about all this

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Original poster

Anastasie · 22/10/2015 17:09

Also - I want him to have the flu one as he had a very bad chest infection last year and it was hellish, so if I can do anything to try and avoid something similar this year I'll do it.

The MMR thing is more that I want the very vulnerable children who can't have it to be protected.

Ds2 had what we think was measles at 10 months and I remember feeling quite resentful that he had picked it up from another child probably, who may not have been vaccinated though knowing more about failure rates now I don't feel that way.

I didn't give him the MMR as I read it wasn't a good idea if he had had measles, and it wouldn't confer added protection for other children if he was already immune, and also he had some red flags for ASD and I was still quite unsure about all that hoo ha.

He is about to be assessed now - so probably autistic - and I know, at least, that it can't have been caused by the MMR, anyway. I'll get him the single mumps vaccine if I can manage it before he is a teenager, though I've no idea if it is even available.

OP posts:

Sidge · 22/10/2015 17:15

No you don't have to wait 4 weeks any more (well not for these vaccines anyway) - have another look at my earlier post of 1354.

The side effects won't be magnified, but you may find he's a bit grot for a few days and again in 7-14 days which is normal for MMR. Have some liquid paracetamol on standby!

Sidge · 22/10/2015 17:17

Oh forgot to say there is no single mumps vaccine available currently in the UK as far as I'm aware.

He would be due another MMR in with his preschool jabs at approx 3 years 4 months and so wouldn't need single mumps later.

AuntieStella · 22/10/2015 17:22

I thought that there was no reason why they shouldn't be given together. A bit like getting an armful of travel jabs at once.

But that if you don't have them together you should leave 4 weeks.

Do remember that the flu immunisation takes two weeks to 'take '(or is that only the jab?) So I'd get on with it and get it all done in a oner.

Original poster

Anastasie · 22/10/2015 17:26

Thank you very much

I just wanted to check, that's all. So much info online yet none of it ever appears to correlate with what the surgery says!

I feel better about it now and will get some calpol in. He is the toddler from hell at the moment and the least compliant, most sensorily challenged child you can imagine so I'm currently trying to work out which way round to do the vaccines - I think nasal spray first then the jab.

It will not be fun.

Btw it's the middle one with probable ASD who is to have the single mumps vaccine, if I can even get it - otherwise he'll have to do without I think. He is 8 now.

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scaevola · 22/10/2015 17:27

"I didn't give him the MMR as I read it wasn't a good idea if he had had measles"

Where did you read that? If someone has had measles (or rubella or mumps), or is immune from earlier vaccination, then the relevant component of the jab is unnecessary, but is not harmful.

Unless confirmed by lab test, you cannot be sure your DC has measles. In UK, nearly all suspected measles cases are tested. Was it done for him?

Original poster

Anastasie · 22/10/2015 17:33

Yes, and it was inconclusive. ie not all the swabs were positive. We weren't sure if it was from my antibodies or if it was really measles.

I can't remember where I read it, it wasn't an anti-vax site or anything like that. I only ever look at medical papers and studies if I can help it.

This was a while ago now - about 7 years ago. And it didn't say the same thing everywhere, and I am interested in medical stuff with fairly good recall but not qualified by any means.

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Original poster

Anastasie · 22/10/2015 17:37

By the way I think it was suggested that it could compromise the immunity his body would be working on from the virus itself, if we gave him a vaccine too soon after it.

I really know nothing about this; I can't remember if I read it online or was advised it by one of my doctors.

OP posts:

M4blues · 22/10/2015 17:42

I am not anti vac in the slightest as mine are fully vaccinated plus extras that we paid for privately (prevenar before it was included and men B as doing sit was available) However, I always read up as much as possible and the flu jab just made me uneasy. Even the paed we spoke to said it wasn't as high a success rate as they'd like and it had more recognised side effects than they would like (albeit mostly mild) and that most healthy children recover well from flu but in his opinion it was still worth it. I took everything on board he said and everything I'd read and I declined it. Only that one though.

Sidge · 22/10/2015 20:01

Anastasie if your middle son never had MMR he could have it now if you like. He would need 2 doses, 3 months apart.

He may have natural immunity to measles if he has had the disease but where results were inconclusive you can't be sure, so giving the vaccine massively increases the likelihood of immunity. Even if he'd had measles you can still give MMR as he will get the benefit of the other components and no adverse effect from the measles component.

Original poster

Anastasie · 22/10/2015 20:04

Thank you, Sidge, I might think about that - he would be pretty scared about it though so will have to weigh it up.

M4 - thank you too. I'm not sure if I should or not, but I think this year I will let him have it. Last January was pretty awful all in. He nearly had to be admitted and I am scared of him being that ill again while he is still kind of pre-verbal and tiny.

Normally I don't bother getting non essential jabs for them but it freaked me out a bit.

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