Holiday with chickenpox

[monkey117]

Hi, I'm wondering what everyone else would do in my situation as I am finding it so hard to make a decision. My family are due to go on holiday to Menorca next Monday. My 3 year old DD1 came down with chickenpox last Thursday so by Monday she will be on Day 12 since the rash started. We are currently on Day 7 and most of the spots seem to be scabbing over so I am hopeful that by next Monday she will no longer be contagious and safe to fly. I plan to go to the doctors this Friday to ask whether he can give us a 'safe to fly' letter just in case we experience any problems. However, I am assuming that it will be highly likely that DD2 (18 months old) has caught chickenpox from her sister and will currently be at the incubating stage. Therefore it is very likely that she will come out with the rash while we are on holiday, most likely during the first week of our 2 week holiday. I am finding it so difficult to make a decision as to whether we should try to cancel the holiday, however if my DD1 is no longer contagious and DD2 doesnt yet have chickenpox at the time of our flight then we may not get our holiday paid for by insurance if we cancel. But the thought of travelling abroad with my 18 month old highly likely to come out with chickenpox is also not very appealing! Any opinions would be greatly received as I am so stressed right now and dont know what to do for the best! Thank you.

I would probably grin and bear it on holiday, tbh. You've paid for it all, and it would be very complicated to claim through the insurance if you cancelled your holiday plans due to chicken pox. That's just my own opinion. Take all the supplies you need with you.

My two had chicken pox in February this year. DS1 caught it first from nursery, and then DS2 had the spots exactly two weeks later.

Contact your travel insurer. You may find it's cheaper for them to refund the holiday cost even if DD2 isn't spotty yet, than to have DD2 go down with it on holiday and then you get stuck out there and claim for new flights and extra accommodation at inflated prices.

The other thing - talk to your GP about blood tests. There is definitely one that checks if you are already immune to chickenpox (it's unlikely, but possible, that DD2 has been exposed in the past and built up immunity without the symptoms - so won't get it now). There is also a test for the virus itself but I don't think that's a blood test so would be difficult before the spots appear.

A friend had to stay on her own in (DH had to go home) Spain with her DCs as her DS got the pox two days before due to return home. This was just the other week and sounds a nightmare...

My three DCs just had it, as did lots of classmates. Seems siblings commonly get it ten days after the first day of the first affected getting spots. My twin DSs both got spots 10 days after Ds1s first spots. This because pox most infectious day before first spots. If its any help they both had low fevers for several days before spots, so I was pretty sure it was imminent.

Also, there is a vaccine if you're in a spot...

Thank you all for your comments. I am still undecided as to what we should do. DD1's spots have all scabbed over now (i think), so I am sure she will be safe to fly by next Monday.
I am sure that DD2 will have caught it as they play with each other all the time, and particularly before the rash started when it is really contagious. I still breastfeed DD2 but obviously not much now and I am really hoping that she may get a milder dose of chicken pox than DD1, but I know this is probably just wishful thinking!
I had heard that there is most often a 14 day gap between siblings which was making me think that DD2 may come out in spots around Thursday of our holiday and it is then fairly likely that the spots may be all scabbed over by the time we come home.
As long as the chicken pox that DD2 gets is straightforward with no nasty infections or anything like that then the actual holiday doesnt worry me too much as we are staying in a villa self catering and my husband and I can take it in turns to get out with DD1, plus we plan to hire a car so we wont be stuck in all the time, hopefully we could find some very quiet areas with no other people so that we can all get out!
But obviously DD2 could come out in spots earlier in the holiday which would be awful as we may infect other people on the plane, or she could come out with them later or have particularly bad chicken pox and we may be stuck there. But then again there is always the small possibility that she may not get it at all and if we cancelled our holiday and then this happened, we would be really kicking ourselves!
I will ask the Dr what he thinks when I see him tomorrow about a 'safe to fly' letter for DD1. I would think it will be too late to obtain results for any sort of blood test.
Also, urbanproserpine why did your friend have to stay on her own with the children? Was this because the Insurers would only pay for one person to stay or just because her husband had to get back for work or something?
This is all so confusing, holidays are not meant to be this stressful!!

Based on hpa guidance your dd1 is not contagious today. They are not contagious after day5 of rash (although airlines may have there own more expansive rules).

As for what to do about dd2 - tricky decision. I would probably look for advice from.travel insurer. Ask them about the what if scenario with regards to her being infectious when due to fly back which will at least settle your mind so you know what to expect.

I would also take calamine lotion, piriton etc so you are prepared if you do go.

You could be in contact with anyone who is highly contagious with chicken pox but you don't know as there are no visible symptoms at that stage. It is daft, IMO, to cancel your holiday (no one has a crystal ball). You should take the supplies you need with you for the trip and carry on as normal.

I have heard of people staying indoors at all times with their DC whilst they have the chicken pox but let's face it, how realistic is this?? If you need food shopping you have to take them with you, you can't just expect them to be kept indoors when you need bread and milk, etc. Life isn't as straightforward as this.

I took my DC out for fresh air at quiet times of the day to take them to the local park. It is good for them. Chances of affecting others is very slim. Same would apply on holiday. Hope you get the answer you need from the GP.

she had to stay as DH needed to get back for work.

hope you don't have to cancel holiday. We couldn't go out as they were v ill, but I know this is largely not the case

Sorry, Lovechoc, but you are wrong.There is a very good reason why the nhs advice is to keep infected children away from people (including shops), because you don't know who around you is vulnerable to the disease. It is an inconvenience, but it is for a short time and there are usually ways around it.

If your younger child is incubating chickenpox when you are on the plane, this could be very hazardous to other passengers who happen to be either immuno-suppressed or pregnant. They could suffer real harm.

I appreciate how much you are looking forward to the holiday, but is it worth putting others at risk?

Ok, let's look at this another way...There's an outbreak at nursery, and every child is now getting it as the weeks go on. By the time your child has it, he/she has probably already spread it on to other children whilst he/she is off sick anyway. It's at it's most contagious before symptoms show (fever, spots, etc), so how on earth can you possibly police it? Impossible! You cannot stop siblings from catching it either and if someone in the family is immuno-suppressed then you are truly stuffed are you not.

You will probably find people have to leave their house to take their DC to the GP surgery anyway when they have contagious diseases. Oh wait a minute, will there not be immuno-suppressed patients sitting in the waiting room??? Probably. You cannot be a mind-reader, yet at the same time, you need to have it confirmed that your child has chicken pox, or you may just need to nip to the shops (what if you are a single parent) to buy essentials, or even medical supplies for your child (Calpol).

Yes, hazeyjane in an ideal world, all ill people should never leave the house, but sadly it is not always possible to do this. Granted, a holiday is a luxury and is not a necessity but the OP has already paid for it. It's a difficult one.

I do agree with others though, you will want some medical advice before you take your next steps. Please let us know the outcome to all of this. I doubt I will ever be in this situation, but it's always good to know incase it happens to someone else I know.

There is a huge difference between that which you do without knowledge and that which you do knowing that your child is almost certainly a danger to a significant proportion of the population.

Getting on a plane with a child that is almost certainly contagious is selfish.

Very well put, Sara.

Lovechoc, just because it is most contagious before the spots come out dos not make it ok to knowingly spread it about.

Most drs advise you not to come in with a child with chiken pox, but if you have to, they will tell you to wait in a separate room, precisely because there is a higher likelihood of someone with suppressed immunity in the waiting room.

I realise that a lot of people may struggle, but there are often ways around the problems - online shopping, friends helping out, putting child in buggy with a raincover if completely desperate. The op's situation is very difficult, and I don't know what the best solution is, but I am often surprised at how blase some people seem to be about chicken pox and potential risk to vulnerable people.

I took my ds to a trial morning at nursery the other day, and there was a boy there with full blown, unscabbed chicken pox, the staff were waiting for a parent to come and pick him up!

It's also worth remembering that an airplane is a very good environment for the transmission of germs - it's enclosed and the air is simply recirculated, and you are all cooped up together on there for the length of the flight plus all the time on the ground too - which is probably worse than 15 minutes waiting in a doctor's surgery, or being in the same supermarket as someone with chickenpox.

Just to put this in context, if a woman who is either 13-20 weeks pregnant, or 36+ weeks pregnant catches chicken pox there is a small chance that the baby can develop foetal varicella syndrome, meaning the baby is born with serious abnormalities such as scars, eye problems, and shortened limbs, and may also have neurological problems causing bowel and bladder problems and also possible developmental delays.

The thing is that you know that it's highly likely that your child will be incubating chickenpox when you take them on the plane, so you know that will be a risk to anyone immunosuppressed or pregnant who happens to be on that flight - and whilst you have a choice as to whether to take your child on the plane or not, they will have no choice as to whether they have to spend a couple of hours shut up in a metal box with your child's very contagious germs.

It might be fine, there might be no-one immunosuppressed or pregnant on the flight, but even then you could blight someone else's holiday by giving them chickenpox - and if it's an adult, believe me, chickenpox is a nasty disease to get when you're grown up - I should know, I got it when I was 25, and was quite poorly with it.

I don't think it is right to take these sorts of risks with other people's health.

The OP does not know her child will be infectious when she flies. If the parents of young children are going to stay in the house every time their child might^ be incubating CP then nobody would ever go anywhere. OP - go on holiday and forget about it. If dd2 comes out with chicken pox at an inconvenient time in your holiday then contact your insurers and deal with it then.
I would also suggest that you don't ask anything about CP on mumsnet again. It doesn't tend to end well unless you promise to wall yourself and your child up for at least 6 weeks.

Here's the facts:

www.nhs.uk/Conditions/Chickenpox/Pages/Prevention.aspx

For the OP ^

Seems I'm not the only one thinking along those lines, northernlurker.

If DC have a cold next time then we will not, under no circumstances, be leaving the house.....

If DC catch a cold and we leave the house, it means that someone who is immuno-suppressed may be directly affected, or another child may catch a cold, or the elderly, or someone pregnant, etc etc etc.

lovechoc what a charmlessly arrogant post.

The OP may not know her DC is infectious but she has very strong grounds to suspect it likely.

You know I can't even be bothered to argue with people who think it is ok to endanger other people so recklessly.

Who on earth goes on a plane when they are immuno-suppressed anyway? Very few people I'd imagine....who would put their health at risk incase they even catch the common cold...

Come on Sara - by that logic no parent with a child at nursery should be taking them on a plane. Chicken pox is infectious when invisible. Any child who hasn't had it, could be hatching it. You can get it more than once. I've had it but should I have isolated myself when dd3 got it in case I got it again? You cannot live like that. Any bus or plane could have an infectious child or adult on it.

A cold is not highly contagious in the way that chicken pox is, Northernlurker - hence it is far less of a risk to go out and about with a cold.

And even the site that lovechoc links to, says that you should stay home from nursery/school/work if you have chicken pox, until 6 days after the last spot appears, and that you should avoid contact with pregnant women, newborn babies and those with immunosuppression.

And the person with immunosuppression might be a child recovering from chemotherapy for leukaemia, going on the holiday of a lifetime (in case there isn't much lifetime left). And even if you utterly discount the idea of immunosuppressed people travelling anywhere, anytime, you can't discount the possibility that there might be pregnant women on the flight.

As Sara says, the OP has very good reason to suspect that her dd2 is infectious, but given that chickenpox is a highly contagious disease, and that the dd will have been in prolonged contact with her sister who has cp, then the odds that she's been infected are pretty high. My ds3 caught chickenpox when both his brothers had it - and he was still fully breastfed at that point, and I am immune to chickenpox because I had it when I was 25 - it didn't save ds3, though.

I don't understand Lovechoc, the page you have linked to states exactly what I said, that the medical advice is to stay away from the public when your child is infectious, whereas you said this was unrealistic, and that it was ok to go to the supermarket.

The fact is that cp can be extremely dangerous for some people and although it is awkward and inconvenient, it is advised that you keep an infected child away from the public for the 5-7 days that you child has the spots. No-one is talking about colds, because unfortunately colds are far more frequent and it would be very difficult to avoid people when you or your children have a cold.