Population overload.

[chaosmaker]

Just wondering if anyone else thinks that we are at a stage where we should incentivise/reward people who choose not to breed. We're on a finitely resourced planet and I've just read a thread where people were talking about some celebrity having a 4th kid via a surrogate.
Should we talk about how the more kids you have, the more competition you are making for them in adult life?

AI is already being used to take over previously human staffed jobs. It's been creeping into jobs like journalism for ages.
There have been famines in various countries for ever and yet we are at a point in evolution where we have more power over our fertility than ever.
Interested in what other people think about this.

Unless to upset people.

I always laugh when people critics others for driving cars. I walk to work when I can, and I’m not young. There is a huge problem with traffic where I work. However, the alternative, public transport don’t make me laugh. There isn’t a bus near me until after 8am so no, I can’t get the bus to work. I can’t get the bus to anywhere unless I want to travel at about 10 am and return about 3pm. When ds was at school I had to drive him to another town to get a bus from there. As for the railway station, I live over 2 miles away and the police advise not to leave your car at the station, not if you don’t want it broken into.
So I will continue to run a car. We don’t all have the luxury of frequent, affordable public transport.
As for the declining population, no, not where I live. I’d be happy to lose quite a lot of the local population. Unpopular opinion but I see plenty of non working adults and just think they are a drain on the tax payer. That needs dealing with other political policies though.

I always laugh when people critics others for driving cars

I was in Devon a couple of months ago. Two buses an hour to some places, others one an hour or one every two hours. Helluva shock after London. Of course people drive, what's the alternative?

Check the user name out. 😉

Sorry you've experienced those comments. They are truly awful.

I have heard the terms breeder or breeding usually from young males in reference to mothers. I've rolled my eyes but first time I've seen it here.

Likewise, I've had some very unpleasant comments from child free family members and acquaintances when I got pregnant and had my child. And from wider society.

Society shits on women, but the very least we can do is remain somewhat respectful of each other (whatever choices we make).

Plus, cars are frigging amazing (if you can afford one) - unparalleled freedom and convenience. But they do bugger the environment and it's not just about fossil fuels.

Modern engines are so clean that more pollution is generated by the particles from tyres than exhausts, and electric vehicles make this worse, are they are heavier (more weight = more particles from tyres). Electric vehicles do have other advantages, so I'm not wanting to start an EV vs fossil fuel fight - my point is that having clean fuels will not erase the environmental harms of cars. So we need to make it easier for people to use alternatives to cars, when possible. Hopefully, in time, technology will find a way of eliminating the pollution from tyres.

Building them and scrapping them both have high environmental cost. It's why I keep mine running for as long as possible.

Don’t get me wrong, I walk wherever possible but if I have have to be somewhere at a certain time then public transports not often an option for me.
We don’t all live with this luxury.

I've read that unless you're regularly doing long distances, keeping a car running for as long as possible is the most eco friendly option. Mine's an EvilDiesel but it's an eco model. Not sure what that means exactly but the emissions are low enough that I get free road tax.

Whilst the birth rate in the UK and other developed countries are declining it looks like the global population will continue to grow for many years to come:

@Judgyjudgy - he was very po faced! DH was not popular. It was a fair question though.

Having not had kids is reproductively perfect for me and in no way lesser.

Thanks for all the responses, I did check back a couple of times but hadn't seen many replies. The question wasn't meant to upset people any more than the reality of an overpopulated world should. I've been a poster on MN for years now and not namechanged. My opinions are not always popular but one thing I don't understand is why we need a replacement rate (or why that terminology is any worse than breeding) when 8 billion is what too many of our species.
I agree that education is a good start to tackle this issue but we also need to try and change cultures that treat women solely as breeding stock and ones that use rape as tools of war. Traditional patriarchy is a big driver of population growth. Quite a few of my friends' children (adult) have said they never want any themselves. Maybe attitudes are changing?

I agree that education is a good start to tackle this issue but we also need to try and change cultures that treat women solely as breeding stock and ones that use rape as tools of war.

Women being treated as breeding stock and rape as a tool of war are issues that should be dealt with regardless of any connection to population growth.

Rising mortgages, unavailability of rental properties, the horrendous price of childcare and the CoL are probably doing a pretty good job of putting young people off having kids. Never mind world populations.

I do think it's weird you've put this thread onto the child free board though. It's a global issue- did you only want the perspective of child free posters?

Reproduction is a primal urge, driven by hormones with the intent to keep the human race alive. To me, this thread has shown me that there are people on the internet who I'd describe as psychopaths. If you don't want kids, just say you don't want kids. Nobody will care. Instead of advocating for people to shut their legs because you think the earth is going to turn into a giant fireball.

Just thought it may be a more appropriate area on this forum to post but clearly not as there is always at least one person who takes it as if you are talking to them personally.
Religions also need to change their tune when it comes to making future worshippers. See Monty Python's 'Every sperm is sacred'....

It’s YOUR children we are advocating for. You are just in denial

well and all the children in my life I love even though I have zero desire for my own

I don't know if it's been mentioned but the PD. James' book "the children on men" is an absolutely brilliant thought provoking book, where the reader constantly swings between 'does it matter if humans all stop breeding' to 'oh shit we're all stuffed if the human population just stops'. The film really, really doesn't do the book justice, it's a very thought provoking read.

'Children of men' sigh

To me, this thread has shown me that there are people on the internet who I'd describe as psychopaths

This thread has shown me that there are people on the internet I'd describe as needing to calm the hell down and stop throwing around terms they don't understand.

The Economist had an in-depth article on global fertility rates last month and what amazed me is that fertility rates are declining literally everywhere. Outside Africa, the world’s population is forecast to peak during the 2050’s and even in Africa, fertility rates are falling fast.

If these forecasts are accurate, the answer to the OP’s question is no, we don’t need to incentivize people to stop breeding, because it’s already happening globally.

One point the article made is that the increasing lack of “youthful dynamism” will probably slow the world’s rate of innovation, because truly ground-breaking discoveries tend to be made by younger people.
Perhaps that won’t be a huge issue with smaller populations/fewer people to provide for.

My theory is that all animal populations stop being fertile when their species is too great. We are the only species that are trying to fight nature on that and all fronts.

Capitalism doesn't have to be the system we live under either which demands constant growth despite sense knowing that you can't have infinite growth.

The growing elderly population may be less of a burden if they can remain fitter but that's probably true of all ages given just obesity levels without what health issues they lead to.

You clearly don't know what "psychopath" means.

From that article
-Impulsivity
-Irresponsibility
-Failure to accept responsibility for one's own actions
We on this thread are the opposite. We have considered carefully whether to have children and decided not to have them, the opposite of impulsive. We have looked at whether having more children is wise with 8bn+ people already on earth and decided that it would be irresponsible. We have taken responsibility for our reproductive decisions.

And you are wrong about reproduction being a primal urge. Shagging is a primal urge and reproduction is the consequence of shagging.

My theory is that all animal populations stop being fertile when their species is too great.

Nope. They either run out of food, or their predator population explodes. There's no inbuilt fertility control. Some species have a degree of breeding control (won't mate if they can't find a suitable nesting site), but that's a different thing - and even that is rare.