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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

Should she stay or should she go? Mumsnet Jury please help me decide....

107 replies

squiffy · 28/10/2008 09:38

OK, I need some opinions on this one. Long long long one I'm afraid...

Our AP has been with us now for 10 weeks and is due to stay until the end of January. BUT BUT BUT I am tempted to let her go early. My DH though says I would be mad to do so.

She is 19, Finnish, clean and tidyish. She drives brilliantly (very important down here in the sticks) and she always gets DS to school on time. She is quiet, always available to babysit even at short notice and is disciplined with the kids. And her English is fluent and she has previous experience so can get to grips with most things I expect of her.

So.. whassup? Well, I simply cannot bear the sight of her. She is morose, dull as dishwater, stares aghast at me if I do anything that she thinks isn't "right" (eg letting my children run down the hallway to meet me - running indoors is a big no-no that she tried to ban the kids from doing until I stopped her), she gets the hump if I ask her to do anything that isn't scheduled (even though we have over 5 hours a week set aside to "help round doing odd things, if she is around" - something she agreed to), and she whinges about the house being too cold (it should be 26 degrees, according to her), and about having to get up early in the morning (6am, usually once, occasionally twice a week, otherwise whenever she wants). She refuses to leave the house for anything despite having a car (not to mention 200 acres of orchards on the doorstep at her disposal. Beaches are too "boring", town centres are too "busy" London is too "scary", buses are too "difficult" car parks are too "confusing". She cannot bear the thought of going to the gym by herself (after I have taken her round to show her everything), nor can she see the point of walking in the orchards around our house "without a dog". She was doing horseriding lessons but that stopped because she would only commit to going every other week and they insisted she sign up for every week (I had already found her extra money from dog-walking in the village if she wanted it, so that she didn?t have to dip into her weekly pocket money). She goes to English class once a week (not that she really needs to but I insisted because she was not doing anything) but doesn't 'see the point' of making friends with any of the other AP's in her class, because she already has 3 friends from home that she skypes and MSNs with every day. So she is indoors all the time, curled up in sofa hugging her jumper, watching Friends (which she tapes 4 times a day so that she doesn't miss any episodes). She slouches off if I ever dare to ask to turn the TV over in the evening (she does have sky in her room , and she could of course watch TV all day long). If I ask her how she is she will look at me as if I am mad and say "Exhausted of course. I got up at 6 yesterday and am still tired" And then she makes this huge song and dance about going to bed at 7pm the night before her early shift, as if I am in some way cruelly torturing her (and, yes, I DID agree the hours with her before she came...)

Beyond all of this though, she loathes my almost 5YO DS and he, in turn, loathes her. She is completely unable to relate to him (eg I made her sit down and play 'frustration' with him. All I could hear from her was "No, it's not your turn", "No, you can't do that", "NO! DS, NO! that's not how you play" and "You're cheating!", until DS gave up and wandered off?.). Fortunately he doesn't have to spend much time with her - one morning getting ready for school, and a couple of bath/bed routines each week (I had planned much much more, but BOTH of them refuse)

I have sat down with her 3 times and had 'those' chats with her, but I get the impression that (a) she just won't ever 'get' 5 YO boys, no matter how much she tries (which isn't much, by the way), and (b) she actually quite likes letting life drift by and feeling sorry for herself, as is much easier than getting off her butt and living her life. It definately isn't that she is too shy, she is bold as brass, she just has no interest whatsoever in anything.

My DH reckons we should just put up with her because she IS always there and so she CAN always cover if we get stuck at work (although she does of course get the hump at being asked - even though I am scrupulous at making sure she doesn't go over her set number of hours a week), and we are both working our socks off at the moment so that is useful. And we do have a babysitter available for Fridays, Saturdays and so on. And we do need extra help in the holidays. But I am at screaming point and ready to get rid, and my nanny also finds her fairly difficult (I had hoped that au pair would take DS off swimming and stuff, so that nanny could give DD (2) some one-on-one but it just doesn't happen because AP refuses to take him).

I have had AP's before and am not a complete newbie, and I have asked her if she is unhappy and wants to move to another family and she is genuinely shocked that I could think this - says she is happy with role and workload and salary etc etc, and then the next day I get all the black looks and so on...I know in my heart she is just being a moody teenager, but it is like having your very own 'Dementer' drifting round the house.

Jury, please vote. Do I put up with the convenience of having all the flexibility and responsibility I could ever need, or do I get rid and replace her with someone more fun and cheerful, but inevitably more haphazard and less 'available'?

OP posts:
MarmadukeScarletbloodstains · 28/10/2008 13:02

No problem, me also tbh as have been iiiiill! So makes a change to be more alert than someone!

stealthsquiggle · 28/10/2008 13:10

Squiffy what does your Nanny say - would she rather cope alone than with AP? If so, how much harder would getting rid of her make your collective lives?

squiffy · 28/10/2008 13:20

We can sort-of cope without an AP - I only got her really so that my current nanny wouldn't feel too stressed out during the holidays, but TBH I think my nanny will agree with me. Actually scrap that. I know the nanny will agree with me, and will also step in to help if necc. So, decision made. I will double-check with nanny and take it from there.

DH I can deal with by just telling him if he wants to keep her, then he is in charge of hours, salary, chores, babysitting rota etc etc etc.

Am sure he will see it my way

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spicemonster · 28/10/2008 13:20

Ugh. I would have to have someone in the house who was a vortex of negativity. And if they didn't like my DS? Total dealbreaker. i don't even have friends over unless they think he's utterly adorable

I think the cons outweigh the pros. Why don't you do a list with your DH and see where it gets you?

themildmanneredaxemurderer · 28/10/2008 13:24

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Kewcumber · 28/10/2008 13:28

tmmj - no but she wants one.

I don't need a TV or a microwave or a dishwasher but I like them they make my life easier and I'm luck y that I can afford one. I don;t need an AP as well as having a childminder but if I could afford one I would - life would be much easier.

Bink · 28/10/2008 14:01

Oh, I too missed that you had a nanny as well. I was thinking your whole childcare set-up was AP-based, so dismissing her => that awful facing the abyss childcare meltdown thing.

If, in fact, what she is is a [theoretical, hmm] 'nice-to-have' rather than 'life-depends-on' then your gloom/benefit analysis is a different one.

AtheneNoctua · 28/10/2008 14:30

How can she not like that fantastic boy of yours? We love him. Send him round to our any time. I have to agree that two months is a long time in the life of a five year old.

And if I may be blunt, the reason that keeping her appeals to your DH is probably because he is not the one who fields all the gloom and doom of day to day au pair management.

Also, the au pair / nanny market is swinging over to favour the employer these days. I would think you'll have an easier time of hiring another than you had in the last recruitment phase.

Does anyone know if the new tier visas are in effect? Can Americans come in?

mummypoppins · 28/10/2008 20:41

hi squiffy....waves....overall get rid . I sympathise with the dh issue mine is the same.......always looking at the bigger issue because they dont have to deal with the day to day crap.

I am still with nanny and since our big bust up at the beginning of Sept things are better. Its very difficult to amke a good call, seeit through and make sure you get someone beter next time.

I remember one of our AP's ( in fact our last ) who nevre left teh annexe or even drew the curtains form Friday evening until Monday am. In fact the first weekend I sent my DD out to knock on the door on Sunday pm because I thought she may have died ! It so wound me up. She had a paid for car and plenty of money ( we paid 100 a week ) and she never went anywhere.

On a sep note im in london on 6th nov.............anyone around for lunch ???

squiffy · 29/10/2008 08:55

Yay! We finally get a chance to meet the MP.

I am working that day - where abouts in London will you be?

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AtheneNoctua · 29/10/2008 10:49

I'm at work too. I will probably miss it as I'm out in Chswick.

Although I'm free the day before when I will be quitely recovering from my night of watching election results into the wee hours of the morning.

mummypoppins · 29/10/2008 13:12

My meeting is at 11am just by the Ritz.........will be an hour I expect so I can travel...........dont know London really very well so you tell me where I need to be and I will grab a cab...........

jura · 29/10/2008 13:28

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

mummypoppins · 29/10/2008 14:37

I love an impromptu party.........where shall we meet........

BoffinMum · 29/10/2008 15:00

AthenaNoctua, I think you're absolutely spot on about DH's not really understanding the ins and outs of managing au pairs on a daily basis, and it's something not often discussed. I would be very interested to know what other mums think.

In my experience, it often works as follows (but not always). First of all, they tend to gravitate naturally in the first instance to the mum, which can even mean them being a bit clingy and demanding at times, particularly when they are feeling homesick or shy. I think this is understandable because they are young, but it is draining when this ends up polluting all your evenings and weekends.

Secondly, some of them get very confused that the lady of the house isn't in fact their mum and therefore happy to deal endlessly and selflessly with their adolescent moods and whinges. I put this down to a lack of work experience a lot of the time.

Thirdly, most of them seem to have mums who don't work or only work very part time in order to look after the home, husband and family. Many of their families don't have au pairs or cleaners, or indeed any domestic help at all. They therefore get genuinely confused about the role of working mums and the nature of British professional jobs and the long hours culture, and the fact a lot of us are now in what I would describe as 'bloke' jobs with a lot of responsibility, etc, paying half the mortgage and so on.

Fourthly, some of them are pretty clever at doing a subtle 'poor me' act when they want sympathy from dh's, and to be fair, sometimes it seems as though they don't even realise they're doing it. I wonder if that bit is a gender or quasi father/daughter thing.

Anyway ladies, do any of you share these views on the situation?

BTW happy to report that I have finally just managed to get rid of melancholic Swede who haunted me silently from doorways and expressed extreme dislike of my youngest. Jolly Hungarian on the way instead. Fingers crossed this time!

BoffinMum · 29/10/2008 15:05

PS Very sorry I won't be in London on Thursday as would have really loved to meet everyone.

squiffy · 29/10/2008 15:53

How about St Pauls, maybe? Then MP if you walk into Paternoster Square (facing main steps to st pauls you will see archway to the left - that is Paternoster square) If we want 'proper' lunch we can go to the Chophouse, otherwise we can grab sandwiches at Corney & Barrow?

But am happy to go with alternative suggestions....

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Blondeshavemorefun · 29/10/2008 17:26

tricky squiffy!!

one part of me says gets rid of her NOW as she obv doesnt want to do the role of the AP and both her and your dc detesting each other isnt good

but

on the other hand, as your dh says, jan isnt long, is it worth waiting it out,you are in the sticks and she can cover/help out when you/your nanny needs help

maybe have a hunt about, see what/who is about and then if you find someone who can start asap then get rid of her

echt · 29/10/2008 18:21

I'd get rid f her, she sounds awful. Something I found was that the younger the child, the older the au pair seemed to work. Nineteen is rather young - go for the upper end of the age range allowed.

Totallyfloaty35 · 29/10/2008 19:29

Get rid,i had a "suicidal swede" never went anywhere,wouldnt even come to dinner with us,she didnt like my eldest and for the first 2 weeks wouldnt unpack.When she told me she was leaving as we never invited her anywhere(she refused about 4 offers a day everyday)my eldest cheered and it saved me asking her to leave.But the atmosphere was so much better after she left.It was a struggle but my dd was so pleased,do your ds a favour,no child should have to share their home with someone who dislikes them,goodluck with your decision.

Kewcumber · 29/10/2008 20:32

ooh ooh I work near St Paul and if its a sandwich Ican prbably makeit (IF not perhaps will join you for a drink) Is it next Thursday?

princesspeahead · 29/10/2008 20:39

get rid
you CAN'T have someone so depressing in your house. you will feel a huge relief when she is gone.

Quattrocento · 29/10/2008 20:51

This is difficult - because as you say, January is not far away is it? On the other hand "loathes your DS" acting like a Dementor. On balance I'd get rid of her - better for everyone all round I think.

Good luck with your next one. I have one going spare ...

Blondeshavemorefun · 29/10/2008 21:38

bugger - just read you are in london thursday - and I have said I would work

ahhhhhhhhhhhh

better luck next time - we will meet one day - pref in the summer round your pool with pimms

squiff what are you going to do?

would your nanny be happy to do more hours etc till new AP could come if you did get rid of now?

squiffy · 29/10/2008 22:15

Somehow, Quattro, I think your AP and mine are soul sisters....

Well, DH was woirking from home today and when I walked in he announced "You're right. She has to go". Turns out she yelled at top of voice at DD, aged 2.

Will check out flights tomorrow...

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