How much do childminders roughly earn?

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Wonder if anyone can help me, I'm thinking of giving up nursing to do childminding. I have 2 dc ( 13 & 2.10) I dropped my hours from 37.5 to 22 as couldn't afford full time childcare. I'm no better off with part -time as all relative but I'm happier & less exhausted so that counts.
After tax & childcare I'm basicly earning about £5.50 per hour and wondered if I would be better off doing childcare.
Wonder if anyone would be able to give me some actual earnings about what they take home every month as childminder as pro's & cons.
I trained as nursery nurse before nursing so have relevant qualifications & last year trained as health visitor which I think would be helpful.
We are currently ttc and I know I couldn't afford childcare for 2 under 5.
Tia ??

I only do full days (8-6) and charge £50 per day (so £5 per hour which is top whack for around here and of course that's pre-tax/NI). However I can only take one in the early years age group (up to Aug 31 after child's 5th birthday) because my DCs are 3 and 2. The same would be true for you, of course, after you have your third. You would also be able to take up to 3 in the 5-8 age group but then you're into school runs etc.

It would be worth finding out from the council what the demand and supply is like in your area as that will have a huge bearing on what you can charge and how easy you will find it to get clients.

I agree - it depends hugely on your area. I charge £5 per hour and can have 3 little ones as my own children are 7 and 5 and at school. I work term time only and part-time, as it suits me better so am not really maximising my earnings. I make about £250-280 per week, gross, for 2 1/2 days work.

One thing which may be worth considering, is offering after school/wrap around care, as you won't be able to make much money in the daytime with 2 little ones of your own. If I wanted to, I could have up to 6 x 5-8 yr olds including my own, or up to 12 over 8 year olds, which would make very decent money for a small amount of hours....I don't do it because it would affect my own children's after school activities too much, but it is an option.

Thanks ZuleikaD and Runoutofideas both your comments are so helpful and thanks for being honest about salaries. I think it's definitely a great way to earn money and be there for your children. I pay my childminder £5 ph and have to pay when I'm on holiday and things and more often than not I feel she seems to have a really good work/life balance.

Do you both enjoy your work (be honest) When I've spoke to people I've met a lot of negativity about wanting to do childminding and lot's of people have said "oh, it'll be really hard" I do appreciate that being with children is hard work but I am generally quite a patient person and do like doing kids things, like arts and crafts, parks, outings etc and always find I'm much more patient with other peoples dc than my own!
In my job I work with children with challenging behaviour and can quite often be hit, punched, kicked, verbally abused, spat at and without seeming naive about childminding I don't think I'd have to look after kids who were like that I hope Thanks again

From my perspective the best thing about it is being at home with my own children - I wouldn't be in childcare if it wasn't for that. I find the mix of my own DCs plus other people's to be a bit stormy sometimes, probably because they're all little and my DCs want me there for them. It is hard work, but pretty rewarding, not least because you're there for those crucial early years with your own.

It's worth noting that you might not fill up straight away and that even when you do you might not! I cant tell you the number of time wasters I've had - all saying 'yeah we want you to start in January, in June etc' and then when it comes to sorting out the nitty gritty, they back off.

It took me about 7 months to get my first customer! So I wouldn't give up your day job until you are sure you're in business.

I earn about £100 a day on a Monday and Tuesday, (I am full to busting) and then less Wednesday, Thursday Friday as I only provide wrap around.

In a week I should take about £310 (but have to take food costs etc off this - but don't use my car in term time)
Mon & Tues - 1 EYs all day, 5 x 4-9's wrap around
Wed - 4 x 5-10's wrap around.
Thurs - 2 x 5-8'a wrap around.
Fri - 1 x after school.
Obviously I could earn more the rest of the week but I like that I have room to breath towards end of week. And that I might even get a day off on a Thursday if my parents shift pattern falls right.
I charge £3.50 per hour (based in Yorkshire)
£5 before school and £10 after.

Good Luck OP

And don't forget that the amount you get in fees is not what you actually earn. after expenses its nearer to half to 2/3 less.
According to NCMA & Daycare trust surveys last year the average childminder's annual profit (ie earnings before tax & NI) was approximately £7500...

Although I took approximately £20k, after expenses and costs my taxable income was less than £7k. I don't work fridays.

Childminding can be stressful and I found it very isolating at first but it is my only way of earning a living while being at home for my own dc's (5yo and 5wo).

I'm the same as you positive My earnings for 2011-2012 were approx 17k but after all expenses I actually came out with about 7k.

I have 23 children on my books and the expenses you have to factor in include food, petrol, crafts and resources. It all adds up!

The down sides I find are:
isolating
your house is never your own
more cleaning / tidying up
dealing with parents
paperwork

I work Monday-Friday, 7.30am-6pm but spend many more hours on top of that doing paperwork etc.

On the up side:
I am there for my own children
I can potter round at home (doing dinner, washing etc)

You can earn a decent living out of childminding but you need to decide how much you want to take on. My Dh is also very good and will take the children out for a few hours at the weekend to give me a break. 24/7 with children is exhausting and you do need 'me' time.

HTH

For those with such high expenses, I have a query..... (I have only been registered 6 months so haven't had a years worth of accounts yet.) Are your profits such a low proportion of your turnover because you are claiming everything you can back out of your business, which gives a slightly unrealistically low amount....?

For example I understand I can claim a proportion of my household running costs, gas, electricity etc. The bills have not gone up through childminding as I would have been at home anyway so therefore some of the things you have claimed have lowered your overall household costs so you gain it back, effectively? Not sure if that made any sense to anyone!

Another example - I pay about £100 per year for my family's zoo membership. The fact that I can take childminding children on it too is a bonus, but I wouldn't say this was a childminding expense, even though i could claim it as such... My petrol usage is not much higher as the school run is the school run whatever but a proportion of it can be claimed.

Does anyone see what I'm getting at here? In reality we need our profits to look as low as possible to pay as little tax as possible, but I'm not sure that that figure represents what money we actually make out of childminding....

Runoutofideas - I see what you mean, but my gas and electricity have gone up, as I never heated/cooled the house during the day before minding. Membership for animal parks etc in my area is for each individual child. My DD takes herself to school, so any school runs are extra for me.

I can see how it could be like you said, but expenses claimed should really only reflect extra expenses only incurred due to Childminding.

My expenses are about 1/3 of my turnover.

Expenses are also different for different CMs - Do you provide nappies, food, etc? Do you go on loads of outings, toddler groups, or stay home?

For me by far the biggest draw back was having my house constantly open to other people both mindees and parents.. Never calling our family space private and always being on show...

But loved all other aspects of it.

Not sure op if you can make a good living out of cming as you will have to take account of your own children in your numbers.

I didn't and worked full time 8 till 6 and earned a really good second wage, 20 grand plus, but you have to be ruthless with claiming back ALL expenses.

HSMM, your expenses (for tax purposes) don't have to be just specifically cm-ing ones - you are permitted to claim a proportion of your council tax, for example.

Yes I know, but if I was taking my DD on school run and dropping mindees at the same place, I would not expense mileage. I know some people would.

Thanks everyone for being so open and honest, could imagine ZuleikaD that my own ds could be a bit jealous which could create trouble as he is such a mummy's boy, but he hates me leaving him 3 days a week atm so sure he'd rather share me and be at home than not have me at all iyswim? Good point MaryPoppinsBag if I am lucky enough to get bfp then after mat leave I could negotiate going back for 2 days and trying to set up childminding for other 3 then if it doesn't take off I'll still have 2 days wage coming in and if it does can hand notice in to own work think this may make sense?
Thanks for being honest ChildrenAtHeart it seems such a big difference to what you earn to what you actually end up with but then does it make up for it in what you can claim? All seems a little scary atm!

Things to think about SurfandTurf as I ma generally quite a chatty and outgoing person so could imagine finding feeling isolated quite hard. My own ds's childminder has her week very structured and she takes the children to playgroups or softplay every morning with other childminders then quite often they all meet up for lunch, I quite like the idea of this set-up and would hope to structure my days like this. Also your positive and negatives are things I have thought about and dh has said he will take dc out at the weekend to give me some time away from children hope he remembers that he has said this! I see what you mean RunOutOfIdeas about outgoings needing to stay low in order to pay less tax but my fil has own business and he was saying when you claim expenses it's something to do with the Vat, not sure I fully get this bit? Thanks HSMM for comments, my dh was saying you should definitely claim mileage for journeys you do with extra children because although you would do the journey anyway if you have extra kids in the car you use up morepetrol iyswim?
Thanks again everyone for comments...really really helpful. I had such a crap day at work today that I think I am putting childminding on pedastal as place where I really want to be but have to first get bfp so no pressure!

Sorry to butt in on conversation...c/ms run own businesses.
We turn over an annual income which, after deduction of allowable expenses, is classified as withdrawals...we are not salaried!
Your annual turnover minus expenses equal your profit !

Any accountants will confirm that...that is the beauty of being your own boss...so apart from wanting to work with children you also need to acquire skills in understanding what running a business is all about
I enjoy the care of children and also the independence to manage my business

You won't be a VAT registered business so it's not that. It's just

Turnover - expenses = profit.

You pay (or not as they case might be!) tax and NI based on your profit. As lovely as it is to keep these nice and low to reduce tax etc, remember that if you ever want to prove your income for a mortgage or similar then it will look very paltry. :)

Yes ...confirms what I have said before...learn how to run a business and know what you can deduct and make a decent living

Yes I wasn't contradicting you italiana .

Agree about learning some business skills, things like invoicing, accounts, tax returns, receipt logging, mileage counting is all tedious but necessaries.

Sorry didn't mean to be harsh...makes me mad we are so undervalued and last in priority.....never felt so strongly about raising c/ms profile ...AARRGGHH!!!

When I first started minding for various reasons I never actually earnt enough gross before deductions to pay tax at all so I was a bit blase about my expenses but 12 years down the line I am much more focused. HMRC has issued a detailed guidance on what CM's can offset against tax, a lot of which includes special arrangements negotiated by NCMA such as 10% earnings against wear & tear, not having to produce receipts for expenditure below £10. If I can find the link I'll post it but hopefully someone else will find it first as I'm not good at that lol. Re mileage the HMRC line is that you can only claim mileage if you are only using the car due to childminding so if dropping your own children off or picking them up plus mindies it doesn't count. Having said that, if you would normally walk your own children but decide to drive due the the logistics of having extra children/safety issues then you could claim.
Before childminding I was working a 5 day week, leaving at 7.30am & getting home around 7.00pm. I was earning £20k & Dh was doing the same job but in a different area. I worked out I would lose half my salary on childcare plus would barely see my ds. Childminding seemed like a no-brainer as I calculated that 2 under 5-s 5 days a week 8-6 would easily cover my loss of salary. How naive I was! It took 2 months to get my first child - a whole 2 hours a day, 2 days a week, and 6 moths to get a full timer. There was none of the support in terms of a local CM group, or the various forums available now & I made a lot of mistakes BUT it was the best decision I ever made.
Last year I earnt £12k working a 3 day week with a bit of consulting/tutoring on the side. My net was £8500, one of my best years lol, but I paid a lot more tax as a result.

What you can claim for:
www.sccma.org.uk/images/stories/HMRC%20Childminders%20%202011%202012pdf.pdf

It is good to exchange info on how we all ...differently...run our businesses.

Some do their own accounts some use accountants (I would highly recommend this as they are the experts)...some c/ms understand expenses others less so ....but a word of warning...I don't hink you should be giving precise details of your earnings here and statements like it is worth keeping our earnings down...what does it mean?
Why would you keep your earnings down and not earn at your full potential if your business allows you to do that?

Not a cm but keeping your earnings below certain levels means less tax to pay. You may find earning just over a tax threshold means a lot of work/time for little return. Is balance, you need to determine is right for you. No point, in my view, working hard and at expense of family if your return is not worth it. You are your own boss.

I think it's reasonable to want to stay under the tax threshold if you can afford to.

It also Obv depends on area. Areas with high need for childcare will more likely to be profitable.
London based, if you are near commuter areas or central I would think you would fill up quickly. Also central London is full of 101 free things for children so your expenses can stay minimal