Support thread for those of us who are requesting an ELCS after a previous traumatic delivery

[withorwithoutyou]

Hello everyone.

I have noticed a lot of threads regarding requesting ELCS lately, probably because I am in the process of trying to request one myself!

I just wondered if it might be useful for us to have a support thread where we can talk this all through as I know it can be a challenging process to go through.

Can I please also ask in the nicest possible way that anybody contributing to this thread can respect our desire for ELCS over VB? Thank you!

Anyway, I'll start - I have one DD, born 20 months ago by forceps after failed ventouse. She weighed 9 pounds 11 and I am concerned this one will be heavier! I am 30 weeks and have my first consultants appt tomorrow where I will be requesting an ELCS!

Hi Thandeka - that's great news about your letter, that must be so reassuring for when you ttc again. I'm glad you've seen someone for counselling too, hope that went ok.

Onebabyplease - your recovery sounds amazing, well done on the breastfeeding too, putting on weight is amazing. And at the sleeping too!

Well, this time next week I'll have a new little girl to love. Very exciting but scary too. I started to have a few doubts earlier, about whether I'm doing the right thing. Will teach me for listening to people harp on about why c-sections are 'wrong' I guess.

However, I was just looking at a birth story on another board I belong to from someone I know over there who had their DD at the same time as I had mine (Lovethsea you might know her).

She had a really straightforward delivery with her first and we briefly chatted about our plans for our second. I've just read her birth story in which her poor baby got shoulder dystocia and was born with cord round his neck and only 3 minutes to live apparently. She also got a third degree tear.

It sounds absolutely awful and I'm hoping she's ok. She was one of those people I would have put money on having a straightforward birth again this time around. It just goes to show that you never can tell.

She and the baby are ok thankfully but for her having to experience that.

Onebaby - I know lots of people do drive before 6 weeks. I think they phone the insurance company to check and most say as long as the GP is happy its fine. Others may just base it on your own assessment of your fitness to drive so just call and hopefully you'll be on the road again in no time

I think the main criteria is that you could brake hard in an emergency and change gears/clutch etc without any problem. I know people have driven after 3 weeks.

withor - I had seen that birth story and was also shuddering at what might have been. I am having a good recovery, but I hope that even if I had had a tough one I would have been comforted that DS got a safe exit via the sunroof. I know there is a risk of injury to the baby in a c-sec but very low in an elcs and when you've had a traumatic birth you already know the vb risks are very real.

I can totally understand feeling wobbly on the best choice for you and your new DD to be - but you have been thorough at researching the options, you have very good reasons for your choice and while neither option is ideal the elcs offers a more certain path for you. [offers chocolate]

withor - DD visited me the day after my elcs. The day of it I wasn't taken up to the postnatal ward until nearly 7pm so too close to her bedtime for DH to drive home and fetch her (and the ward closes to visitors at 8pm anyway). She is 19 months and took it all in her stride. 'BABY!' when she saw the cot's occupant, then gave me a cursory kiss but was mostly interested in exploring the rest of the hosptial. DH brought her and Granny for the 7pm visiting slot, I made sure that DS was in his cot not my arms/feeding when she arrived, and we gave a present to DD from DS. We took some photos and they were about for maybe 25mins then DD started off down the corridor with purpose so I just waved them bye and they headed off with no big fanfare. DD seemed totally unphased by Granny doing her care rather than me so they didn't visit Saturday and then Sunday I was home.

Withorwithoutyou - I think that story defo keeps me on the ELCS path too. Biggest fear is having two traumatic births in a row (yes may be unlikely- but was reading somewhere on here about a woman who had THREE bad births!)

I also think alot about Riven- her daughter has HIE grade 2 (My DD has grade 1) and has serious special needs and was her 4th baby I believe. I would be so so scared about having another HIE baby (Hypoxic ischemic encepalopathy) and having an ELCS reduces that risk massively. I am a member of a yahoo group for HIE parents and there are a few on there who have a two HIE babies- yikes! (But theirs were due to placental abruptions both times).

Pregnancy and birth are just plain evil and scary if you ask me now! Babies are awesome though!

oh and PS my counsellor got me to write a list with ELCS on one side and VB on the other (as I am wavering too about what I want but wanted to be more definite before we even think of TTC again). Anyhow for me a VB would have a long long list of requirements in order for me to be able to do it.
eg. Doula/independent midwife who I trust and will help me and hold my hand, pat my hair and keep me calm throughout and to be assertive on my behalf.
epidural but not too many top ups and being able to squat to push.
Not being left on my own at all
being able to eat and drink during labour for energy.

Trouble is there is no guarantee of me getting these things and also no guarantee I wouldn't struggle to get another baby out.

Whereas with ELCS- there are no requirements that need to met (other than it being agreed in the first place!)- I could have a lovely calm birth experience and pretty much guaranteed not to have another oxygen starved baby all being well.

The only thing I lose is the potential to have a good VB experience but like I decided with my counsellor- it may be for the third birth I decide to VBAC- it's not out of the question.

Thanks lovethesea - glad your DD took the hospital visit in her stride. I thought you may have seen that birth story, it really shocked me as I remember how straightforward and quick her first birth was.

Thandeka - I think about Riven too. I will never forget the things she has said about her DD's birth. Also, how awful for you to know someone who has experienced HIE twice.

The baby being starved of oxygen is probably my number one top fear when it comes to natural birth. They ran tests on DD and her cord blood after she was delivered and I was so relieved she was ok, but I really don't think I could face risking that for another child.

I'm glad your DD is doing so well now, despite her start, you must be so proud of her.

I had my pre op appt today. Which was fine except for the hospital scales weighed me at more than a stone more than I thought I was! Just weighed myself again on both of our sets of scales at home and they both say I am a stone less than the hospital does, as do the scales in Boots!! Don't know what to think really but the hospital did weigh me twice as I said it didn't sound right. Lets hope I don't get too much anaesthetic!

I've found out we're currently first on the list to go in on Tuesday so hopefully it will stay that way. Hopefully that way DD can visit the same day as their visiting hours are 5-7 and I should be out of recovery by then hopefully.

Hope everyone else is doing well. Mookle - just over a week for you to go now!

withor - Tuesday! Wow nearly there now. You can always ask them to weigh you again when you get in Tuesday perhaps? Or if you see a mw before then or a drop in clinic? I'd mention it to the anaethetist on the day too just in case. If it's niggling at you get someone to recheck it - it's an easy check and after all the planning it would be so annoying to be accidently more dopey on the day than necessary!

The oxygen deprivation was on my reason list too; DD was also thought to be low and her cord tests showed low levels, though thankfully it didn't have a longterm impact on her. Birth just becomes a means to an end then doesn't it? Suddenly all that antenatal class chat on the experience is shoved away into 'would have been nice' and the health of the baby and you become the bottom line.

Thandeka - it's great you are finding the energy to be so proactive on a potential second birth. I got my consultant to agree to an elcs two months after DD's birth and eight months before I was pregnant again. It made a huge difference to my confidence when we ttc, and even though I went through a stage of thinking I might go for a vb again I always had that letter in my drawer ready.

Onebabyplease - I drove 4 wks after em c/s with dd - and I could have driven earlier, I only waited that long because I thought I had to wait 6 weeks, I got so fed up by 4 wks I checked with my dr and she said it was fine if insurance co were happy, which they were. I only drove locally to start with. I never felt any probs with braking etc. Glad your recovery going so well.

Good luck to everyone about to have their c/s es, 2 weeks tomorrow for me!

Hello everyone.

I have my pre-caesarian meeting today, where they will go through the procedure, take swabs for mrsa, measure me for stockings (they have said I will have to have fragmin injections for a week after - did anyone else have this?) I am hugely nervous about it all, because of the mixup with the consultant signing off the cs for me, I keep think she will change her mind (I won't let her!)

Last night I woke up in a cold sweat, because I remembered that I was supposed to be thinking about whether I want to be sterilised during the caesarian - I had put it away in a corner of my mind, and now realise I have to make a decision.

I have googled and can't see any big negatives/side effects of being sterilised, although some people said it made their periods heavier.

In its favour, I know I don't want any more children, I will be 41, if they do the corrective surgery they have suggested then I have been advised that having any further children would be a very bad idea indeed, and apparantly doing it during a c-section means it is quite a simple procedure. I would welcome anyones opinion -has anyone else been offered the same?

Hi Hazeyhane,

I had my pre-op yesterday, there was no mention of injections for a week after for me. I didn't get measured for stockings either!! But had all the rest.

Wrt being sterilised, I think for me it would depend on whether a sterilisation was something I was going to go ahead and do anyway - if it was then I'd def have it done at the same time, if only to save on being opened up twice.

It's not something I would go into lightly though, so I can see your dilemma.

Hi Hazeyjane- the only thing I had heard on sterilisation was that it might not be so effective if done with birth - something about the physical and hormonal difference in your body after a pregnancy making it more likely to fail. Not sure of any details so maybe ask them? I can see the reason for getting it done all in one operation, so perhaps it depends on the type of sterilisation done/method used?

I had blood thinning injections for 5 days after my elcs. I hadn't known about them until the first one was given! The first 3 in hospital and then the community mw did the last two that I was sent home with. I had impressive green bruising on my upper arm from them but it was reassuring they were taking the dvt risk so seriously given how much lazing about breastfeeding I was planning on doing.

Hi everyone - I have a really embarrasing thing going on and its recently got worse so I thought mayybe someone on here might be able to help me as we all have similar experiences.

Basically, where my episotomy scar runs, when I have a bowel movement, a large bulge (about the size of a walnut) appears there. It goes away some time later and in its place is a indentation. Is this a rectocele?? I am so embarrased I cant tell doctor or DH or anyone and I dont know what to do. Recently pelvic floor issues have got worse, hard to control wind, not able to strain for Bowel movement and needing toilet a lot which I put down to increasing weight of baby. Do you think i should mention this to midwife or see doctor.

Sorry if TMI - am so embarrasd

LOvethsea that's interesting about the blood thinning injections - good to be warned about these things. I think you're right about the anaesthetic, I'm going to get them to weigh me again on Tuesday as I really don't want too much. My friend had an EMCS and they didn't weigh her and when she went through her birth notes the m/w said she probably had too much anaesthetic because she couldn't actually lift her arms to hold her baby for a few hours

Hi Mookle, that sounds awful. I don't really know what it could be but I think it would probably be a good idea to speak to someone about it. At least you are very near the end of the pregnancy now and there shouldn't be too much longer of the added strain of the baby. Hopefully someone else will know what it could be, for you, it sounds like the last thing you need.

I would mention this to your MW, Mookle. It is issues similar to yours that has prompted me to urge for a c-section this time around. The consultant has booked me in for a scan etc 3 months post birth, and seems to think I would probably need an operation. The MW has also referred me to a physio to see as soon as possible to discuss pelvic floor issues.

It is so difficult to discuss these things with anyone, and I find myself getting hugely embarrassed and tearful when talking about any of this stuff - it just feels like I should be worrying about this when I am 70, not 40.

My MW was great when I spoke to her about it, she is a woman who has had 4 kids, and is in her 50s. I think because I was obviously so distressed about it, she knew not to make any 'jokes' (I have overheard some women at schoolgates making 'Tenalady jokes' - I'm not the sort who can do this!)

You might also want to have a look at the Ragged Bits threadhere

By the way, the MW said that re the injections, it has only been inrtroduced in the last few weeks, and the guidelines are that if you have 2 markers (eg with me, I have varicose veins and am having a c-section) for a possible dvt then they should automatically give you the injections for a week. I had to have them when I was pregnant with dd2, and was allowed to do them myself at home, in my thigh. I guess other markers might be a family history of thrombosis and ...I can't think of anything else!

Thanks for the thoughts about sterilisation, I will ask about the failure post pregnancy risk, this afternoon.

Next embarrassing question, has anyone here had to do their own perineal swab?!

Thanks for the replies - I actually have my MW appointment today and so I might mention it if I can build up the courage.

Hazeyjane I know exactly what you mean, I cant joke about this stuff either I just get really really embarrased. And I never thought Id be dealing with this at the age of 34

mookle - I'll be interested in what they say. I also have what I think is an external pile that runs from a scar line and bulges when I have a bowel movement. I plan on getting it checked out in the future if it doesn't settle. Does yours bleed at all? I get pain and some fresh blood sometimes if I am a little bunged up so figured external pile or possibly a small fissure.

I mentioned it before but the GP wasn't that bothered and presumed pile I think. I decided to wait until after this pregnancy before getting it looked at again as so much else was shifting about. It's not that much of a bother to me but sometimes I wet some loo roll with cold water and press it on which makes the bulge go down. We just embrace TMI these days don't we

I had the injections for a week as while, they were fine.

Sorry about your problem Mookie. Please don't feel embarrassed about talking to the doc/midwife about it, they will have seen it a million times before. So many new (and young) mums I know have various problems down below, I really don't think it's unusual.

To continue with the TMI, I've had piles since being pregnant with DC1, and the 2.5 hours pushing didn't help! They've never completely gone away, and got worse again during the last pregnancy. I had my 6 week check today and asked my doc about them. She gave me some prescription ointment and suppositories which I've used before and which helped a lot. She also said to give it around 6 months to see how much better they got, and that if they were still bothering me then, then it would be possible to be referred for injections that shrink them. So don't suffer in silence!

Lovethesea - I am not sure if piles or not (i already have them) it doesnt look like anything I have had as a pile before?? Its kind of in the perineal area at the side of the anal opening rather than coming from the anal opening IYSWIM my piles that I def know are piles bleed but this lump thing doesnt bleed - could this be piles?? I think I maight just wait then until after birth and see if it goes away on its own

ealey - I feel your pain too my 3.5 hours pushing left me with horrible piles and fissures.

Ealey, I remember having piles with dd1 (but strangely not with the other 2 pregnancies), and my very old school MW told me that when she had them, she put an ice cube up her bum for relief!!!

It was a remedy I never, ever tried by the way

God, who'd be a woman eh? Seriously, how much of a toll does pregnancy and childbirth take on our bodies? I worry about how much worse it will be in later life too. I hope you get everything sorted out mookle, lovethesea and ealey.

I seem to be in an over-sensitive mood this week. Mainly I think because the c-section is playing on my mind. When the m/w was running through the procedure with me yesterday all I could think was "I don't want to do thi". I'd still far rather do that than give birth naturally though, so just got to suck it up!

Oh, didn't help my mood this morning either when I took DD to a group we go to and was asked "so why are you electing for a caesarean then?" by someone I have never even told I'm having a section! Someone else obviously told her. It was asked in such a judgey way I really felt like walking out of there!

withor I am so sorry you had a judgy tone to deal with

I'm now beyond shame about my damage so I have given the grim reasons a few times, but I can totally understand you wanting to be respectfully given privacy and the basic trust that you had good reason.

I just have to hope these are very naive people who have seriously never known of anyone with longterm birth damage, and who don't have the imagination to consider how fortunate many of our DC's were to make it through previous births at all.

You are nearly on the other side of all this with your new wee one - not long to be anxious now.

I am still doing well - doing a bit more around the house now and am off the volterol (finished the course). Feeling a little bruised in my tummy probably because of both those things but no pain still.

Withorwithoutyou - How can people be so rude.

TMI- When speaking to consultant last week about my concerns to second VB she asked why I had never been to a gp with my post birth physical problems. Well firstly I wasn't aware that not everyone suffered the same problems. I don't go round asking other mums, "So passing wind through your vagina is really embarassing isn't it!" Or "How often do you get thrush since having your last kid?"

Didn't know my symptoms could be corrected or that not everyone goes through a hellish disturbing birth.

She still just looked at me like i was mental. Is it just me or are personal problems just that "personal" not to be discussed at school gates.

Now I know that it is not normal i can hopefully try and get things sorted after this next birth.

Thanks both, I know I shouldn't let it get to me but sometimes I just get really fed up, it's like first you have to deal with a traumatic birth, then you have to deal with making a decision about what to do next time, then you have to deal with the hospital to arrange the section and finally you have to deal with idiots poking around in your business and making stupid comments. As if I would have it this way out of choice or something!

Anyway, glad you are still recovering well Lovethesea. Mumtoblaire, I know exactly what you mean, people don't talk about this stuff and compare notes so how are you really supposed to know what's normal. I hope you do get everything sorted once the birth it out of the way.

On the subject of embarassing questions - the m/w at the pre op told me to use immac before I go in, I just wondered how much you're supposed to take off? Is it the top inch or the whole lot? Was too to ask.

Just the top inch would be fine - I was shaved by a mw on the day as I hadn't been told before what to do and didn't want DH anywhere near me with a razor! (I just trimmed and am not that hairy naturally so felt ok, wasn't going to risk a cut from trying it myself either). Do you normally use Immac? I used it once years ago on my leg and it irritated my skin badly so I've avoided it since - wouldn't want a rash/itch down there.

As it is I think my scar will be just above the hairline as I am lightly haired. (Consults scar with handmirror ... yup, just above the hair regrowth). Personally I am happy to still be able to see it given how pleased I am with the whole birth experience this time round. War wounds are fine with me and I never wore bikinis anyway

Thanks lovethesea, I don't normally use immac although have in the past - never there though! Maybe I'll take my chances with a razor...