Anyone else out there not see their baby as soon as they were born?

[NellyBluth]

I'm probably being a glutton for punishment by watching programmes about childbirth, so feel free to slap me for doing so and making myself feel bad. But every time I see a baby being born I get a real, gut upset reaction to seeing mums holding their gunky, wrinkly newborns, and its actually getting worse as time goes by.

As background, DD was born 6mo by emcs. She was term + 8 but my waters were very infected and so as soon as she was born she was rushed off to NICU. I was 'shown' her in theatre - they dangled her about five feet away from me - but I didn't have my glasses on so I couldn't actually see her, and I was too out of it from tiredness, G&A etc to say so. Obviously as she was poorly I didn't get to hold her, and didn't see her until 12 hours later. The first sight of my baby was when someone pointed her out in an incubator and said 'that one is yours'.

Now I know this isn't a bad delivery by any stretch of the imagination (and I have no problems with having had a cs) and I also know I am incredibly lucky that DD got well very quickly, was discharged after 5 days and has no lasting health problems. But I can't help it, I feel really awful that I never got to have that first cuddle, that first skin-to-skin contact. It hasn't had any long-term effects but I know that in the first few days DP bonded better with DD than I did. I feel like I never had that overwhelming rush of emotions at seeing my first baby, rather that it took a few days for it to sink in.

Did anyone else have this? Does anyone else feel like this still? And how can I let this go?

I didn't cuddle mine until she was 4 days old - I was in west sussex and she was in tooting! And sadly I remember not recognising her face when I made it up to see her on day 3. She was an emcs, heart fading, silent delivery room, me rambling nervously to the nurse who looked as scared as me, husband holding my hand (he never does that!). When delivered at 11pm she was resuscitated twice and then wrapped up so we could only see her face and taken off to the scbu in the same hospital. We had various people coming into the recovery room throughout the night to tell us that she was very poorly, with what they weren't sure, they had an ambulance outside to take her to the children's hospital at 3am. This bed disappeared within minutes and they came in to tell us they were ringing around for another space for her. She spent that night in the same hospital as me but I didn't see her until the paramedics doing the transporting wheeled her in to say goodbye at 8 the next morning. I was in a maternity ward with no baby and I had to stand over her incubator in front of the other mums and talk to her. I felt numb, luckily they moved me to a side room until my discharge. They couldn't get me post natal care in tooting so I had to stay where I was. I ended up staying a night with her in a family room on day 3 - not a good idea on my own but we had a 14 month old at home and exhausted grandparents who needed my husband to take over at some point. I saw her, didn't recognise her and really missed the initial few hours when it all feels worth it. We make up for it now but having had a good experience with my DD1 it felt like I had brought someone else's baby home - weird. She came back to our local scbu after 2 weeks and was released 2 weeks after that, no diagnosis but had made a full recovery. I love her to bits!

It's not the same at all, I know, but I can understand where you're coming from.

I had an EMCS and wasn't allowed to hold her in theatre, she was passed to my DH. I found it difficult to even turn and look at her, and I didn't hold her until the recovery room. We then had feeding problems (she just wouldn't / couldn't latch for days, and we struggled for 2 months before a tongue tie was snipped) which led to me being distressed, feeling that everything was out of control, and had those feelings of "It feels like someone has just handed me a baby" that I couldn't look after, and I wasn't really bonding with her. I was anxious, felt like a failure, and had mild pnd, and went to a counsellor for several months to talk things through and try and process what had happened (she also had lots of medical appointments, it's a long story).

www.plus-size-pregnancy.org/CSANDVBAC/csemotionalrecov.htm
When I read on this website that this sort of feeling / trauma could be down to an almost indescribable primal thing that we want to / need to see or feel our babies being born, to know that it's ours, I burst into tears because it summed up what I couldn't put into words.

DD is almost 2 and i'm fine. We're fine. It's in the past now, and while I'm sometimes still a bit sad about how my daughter came into this world (when hearing other people's birth stories, or watching OBEM, for example) and how I felt in the days afterwards, I realise that those first few weeks were such a tiny part of her life. I mean, she's walking and talking and everything now! and we have a great bond

I recommend talking about it, even if it's just on here

"It feels like someone has just handed me a baby". Yes, I think that is exactly how I felt. I remember being in SCBU and being shown DD and thinking, "oh, ok, if you say this one is mine..." I know within minutes I recognised features in her that were very clearly those of me and my DP. But borrower I think you've hit the nail on the head, its that primal idea of seeing your baby as soon as they are born. Sometimes I feel as though there is this disconnect between being pregnant and then having DD, because there was this break, because I didn't see her at once. And that is such a big thing to miss. Plus of course the shock of being full-term and everything being fine and then suddenly everything is not fine and your first sight of your baby is them all tubed and wired up.

I should probably just stop watching shows like OBEM, it makes me sad and makes me think about it (though I always forget and start watching the show, its when a little gunky baby appears that I go... oh...)

Littleover, that must have been horrible, I'm glad your DD is fine now.

Similar, but not as serious happened to me - EMCS, they dangled DS next to me (also without glasses, so couldn't see properly), but I actually told them to take him further away as I was uncontrollably shaking (side-effect of the epidural) and was worried I would hit him (I'd actually asked them to strap my arms because they were twitching so badly, but they were reluctant to do it)

Simultaneously going through my head was that they'd think I was a terrible mother who didn't love my baby because I didn't want to see him, terror that he was already too close and my arm would twitch and I would whack him, and a tiny voice of reason telling me it was OK, DP was there, DP would look after him (oh, and the nurses of course).

I was lucky, DS was fine and I was let down from recovery an hour later to find DP and DS tucked away in a warm little room together and I could hold the little wrinkly thing - that hour in recovery was a very long hour though (and a brilliant nurse in recovery who made sure I was OK, and let me know what needed to happen before I could go down - plus he had a familiar British accent which was somehow comforting as I was abroad giving birth so a bit of home was welcome)

If you go to the 'Bonding with babies' section on that link I supplied, it makes for really emotional reading. There's too much to paste here, but -

^For many women, one of the most difficult parts of cesarean birth is the lack of bonding time with their newborn. Many women worry deeply about the newborn while separated because they usually cannot physically see and touch the baby for some time.

Many also deeply grieve that while they should have been the first to hold their babies, they were actually among the last to snuggle their baby; that virtually every staff member and family member got to hold and know their baby intimately before they did.

This is a deep and very primal loss, and should not be underestimated by others. Biologically and emotionally, women are strongly programmed to interact with their children right after birth, to make sure baby is all right, and to cement their prenatal bond in a new and special way. Losing this period after birth is a deep emotional wound, one which is difficult to heal. Bonding can of course take place later, but that doesn't replace the precious time right after birth that can never be restored^

and

Some women also feel disconnected from their cesarean babies, which often causes great guilt. Since most c-section moms do not get to see the baby emerging from their bodies, to some the baby may seem unreal or as if it's the wrong baby. The lack of that primal knowledge of feeling and seeing that baby emerge from your body, of holding it right away afterwards, of knowing that this is your baby, can be devastating to the bonding process.

These were the passages that summed up for me what I had found impossible to describe or explain to anyone. It doesn't need an explanation further than 'it's just a primal need'. I had tried explaining this to someone and I don't think they got it. But they had a vaginal birth, and no pain relief or complications, so they very much experienced their baby coming out.

I think what you are feeling is understandable. Rightly or wrongly, we often have a picture of what birth will be like, especially since some aspects of birth seem so set and unshakeable. That moment when a baby gets lifted out of you and lies on your abdomen and chest all gunky and blood-covered. If you want an olympic analogy, it's crossing the finishing line.

I've never 'crossed the finishing line'. My twins were born by EMCS under GA so the first view I got of them was a few hours after surgery when two tiny, swaddled bundles were shown to me as I retched in agony from the morphine. Honestly, they could have been anyone's babies. It was a rough, rubbish day and so far from the 'best day of my life' ideal I had been hoping for. I'd set a lot of store, foolishly it turned out, in seeing my babies being born. I'd spent five weeks in hospital on bedrest with bleeding and complications and seeing my magic IVF babies being lifted out of me and finding out their sex was going to be my 'reward'. It didn't feel like too much of an expectation, although people will probably trip over themselves to tell me how I should have had NO expectations at all; that expectations just mean disappointment. Well, not for most people. In Real Life I'm the only person I know who has not seen their babies being born. Even now it feels like something people take for granted. No one expects to miss that moment. Plus, it's a very important moment. If you speak to mothers about the first time they saw their baby it's very emotive and intense.

Second time around was going to be different. I was going to try for a VBAC and had all these worse case scenarios lined up in case things went awry and I had another EMCS under GA (my husband was going to get to hold the baby first, someone in theatre was going to take photos of the baby coming out....). Even then, I didn't get it this time either. My baby was born very poorly due to sepsis and inhaled meconium and was born not breathing. He was worked on frantically by a crash team for 8 minutes and then rushed off to NICU. It was pandemonium in the theatre and the moment of the baby being lifted over the cloth, and finding out the sex and holding that baby (that was going to be the balm for the first time that went so awry) was not to be. I got a glimpse of an incubator being whizzed past me whilst I tried not to vomit.

For me, this time, it's okay. I set up so many 'what ifs/worse case scenarios' that I was actually prepared. And I also know, from first time around, that not seeing your babies being born makes no difference with how you bond with them long term. I had awful PND after the birth of my twins and not seeing them being born didn't help with that, but it was only a tiny part of the picture. And once I was through and over that PND I realised the love I had for my daughters was manifest and beyond the universe; there really is no end to it. Perhaps it is even more acute because of the difficulties I went through? Perhaps it burns brighter and sharper because I was so lost in the beginning?

It doesn't mean it doesn't affect you - it can hurt you acutely, can feel a piercing loss. Even now, when I think about it, it makes me sad; in a very happy life it's a true and real sadness. However, it's only a micro part of my life as a mother. As time passes it does become a mere heartbeat in terms of experiences and the sharpness of the disappointment and grief do fade. You just need to allow yourself to feel sad about it. I found writing down a detailed birth story and showing it to a friend really helped as it gave me an understanding of that day and my feelings about it. I allowed myself to feel disappointed, robbed, upset. All those feelings that people would rather we didn't feel as mothers.

I'll never have the moment of my children's birth. That will always be a sadness to me, however much people will say "get over it" or it doesn't matter. But I can promise you in the great scheme of your being a mother, it will only be an atom of sadness. And perhaps we love our babies a little bit sharper for that small piercing loss. I know I do.

I was handed my already cleaned, wrapped and hat wearing preemie for 30 seconds before he was whipped off to SCBU. I was out of it as well so tried to give him to DH. There was no skin to skin or putting to the breast. I then went into theatre for a manual removal of the placenta so didn't see him for a further 12 hours till the following morning. DH had to tell me which one he was.

I had no idea that this had affected me until much, much later. In the following days I threw myself into the SCBU routine, coping admirably. It's only now looking back that I realise how detached I was from it all and that some of my actions were probably a bit weird to people at the time.

Our relationship has grown and I am enjoying motherhood now he's a toddler. I think that was partly our shaky start, partly that I am more attuned to a communicative toddler than a baby. We'll see what happens with DC2 if the circumstances are different.

You're not alone.

theborrower - your last post has made me cry - it is explains it so well. I felt exactly the same after my crash cs. I was exhausted after a 20 hour labour and drugged up to the eyeballs. I don.t even remember holdng dd for the first time. I struggled with the idea that this was MY baby and felt cheated, really cheated. It made me feel very sad for a long time and I did find it hard to bond. I never managed to establish bf either- and was offered no help. 8 years on I don.t really think of it much, but like OP I get very emotional seeing babies being born.

Oh, flosshilde, your post has just rung such a bell with me. I know exactly what you mean about the SCBU routine. I don't think I went down and saw DD that much while she was there, and when I was there I had a cuddle and fed her and then didn't really know what else to do. I must have seemed quite detached too, I remember sitting there holding her and texting people at the same time.

It is so good to hear other people talk about this and say they feel the same way. I also feel that other people, other mums who had a relatively 'good' birth don't understand either, and also that they don't understand why it is an issue afterwards. It feels like something you can't talk about as you are just 'harping on' about something 'unimportant' in the wide scheme of things. Even DP doesn't understand, as he at least went with DD to NICU.

'Robbed' and 'cheated' are definitely the word for it. I hope that next time will be better but because I had such a rubbish birth and firmly believe that my treatment on the pre-labour ward caused a lot of the problems, and sadly where I live I have to go back to the same hospital to have any future DCs, I will be fighting tooth and nail for an elcs. I am not risking them fucking up again and making another baby ill (I was completely unmonitored for the 12 hours I was on the pre-labour ward, if I hadn't asked for a epidural god knows how long it would have taken someone to realise DD was poorly and god knows how much more poorly she would have been). At least I have learnt from this first experience how to manage things for another cs - wearing contact lenses, for one! And making sure DP has the camera, as we have no picture of DD for those first 12 hours.

Kits, thank you for sharing. That must have been horrible second time around as well. And thanks for those posts, borrower, they explain so much.

My DH doesn't get it either, Nelly. I tried to talk to him a number of times about not feeling like I'd bonded properly and he brushed it off saying I was talking rubbish. I have never even tried to speak to anyone else about it for fear they would think less of me as a mother.

We merrily went and registered his birth, did some Christmas shopping. I went and got completely shit faced at my works Christmas do which I was expecting to be extremely pregnant at. All this with a baby in SCBU. When I was in SCBU I never asked for a cuddle as I thought I wasn't allowed. It horrifies me now and probably horrified people who saw me do it, but they were too polite to say.

I've had delays seeing both of mine and didn't have skin to skin either time. DD was an EMCS and had trouble breathing at first so they had to call a paediatrician to assess her before I could see her and then I had to wait a little while to hold her.

With DS it was all going to be so different. I was going to have a VBAC but I had made contingency plans as to how to manage to have skin to skin even if I had a CS. In the end I did have a VBAC but eight weeks prematurely. I had emergency surgery the day before he was born and that sent me into premature labour. I didn't see him until he was three days old and then not much at all for the next month I had a quick glimpse of him before they whisked him up to neonatal. I was in intensive care for the first week so it wasn't until he was three days old that I was able to be taken to see him. He weighed less than 5lbs but I was too weak to manage to hold him for more than a couple of minutes and was then taken back to ITU.

I was in hospital for a month and would try to get to see him most days but it was normally only for a few minutes as I couldn't manage more than that. I felt terrible that some days he didn't get a visit but I was so ill and had to have a further five hours of surgery when he was a couple of weeks old that sent me straight back to square one. Ironically despite being premature he was ready to be discharged before I was!

He never felt like my baby until we were both discharged. Despite all this we have bonded brilliantly but I feel enormous guilt over those first few weeks and feel dreadful that my body just didn't produce any milk for him. I felt like the other mothers in the neonatal must have thought I just didn't care as I was never with him and never did anything in SCBU whereas I would see them changing their babies nappies and changing sheets etc. We hardly have any photos of him as DH was too worried about me to think about taking photos. I'm not able to have any more children so I am never going to be able to aim for third time lucky. I am sobbing writing this as it is bringing it all back. I think that the feelings we all have are normal and they do fade (until a thread like this brings them all back!) We just have to be thankful that we are here and our babies are here safe and well. It is only us that tortures ourselves. The babies are blissfully unaware!

No one will think less of you as a mother . If this thread is showing anything it is that it is such a massive shock to the system when you don't get to see your baby at once.

I know someone who recently gave birth and their baby was rushed to Great Ormond Street. The attention the staff there seemed to pay to ensuring that the parents bonded with the baby was completely different to that at my hospital, and probably most hospitals. I feel bad saying that as the SCBU staff were wonderful but, still, there is a difference. The other staff were shocking, however. 24 hours after DD was born I was (baby-less) on a general maternity ward, in the middle of surrounded by other mums and babies, and it was too much, I went to the midwife station in floods of tears because I couldn't cope with other mus being with their babies when I wasn't, and I just wanted to go somewhere else to sleep. They reluctantly moved me to the SCBU ward(!), and when I saw my notes later that had written 'mum was emotional and irrational'...!

Even 6 months on I'm aware that I can leave DD far more happily than any of the other mums I know. I have already been away overnight twice, and am planning other nights where she will go to my parents. I went to a baby shower for a long afternoon without her when she was 3 weeks old, I think the other mums there were quite shocked. I don't think this is a bad thing, but I'm certain that being apart from her right from the start has made it far easier for me to leave her now. I don't have separation issues when I'm apart, though I adore her and she is the centre of my world.

Oh, marrow, you poor thing. I'm so sorry I've brought this all back to you and made you cry x

It's ok Nelly

I can completely relate to being able to leave your baby more easily. I could never bear to be separated from DD and would feel like I was missing a limb even if I just left her with DH or my mum for a short time. With DS I never really thought about him when I was out without him

My DTs were delivered at 31+2, EMCS in a silent delivery room, there was no noise from either baby, all we heard was one of the team saying ?its your call if we stop or not? to another member of the team. They were whisked off to be worked on and we didn't see them at all. DH was allowed to see them about an hour later and he came back to tell me they were doing well. The SCBU nurses took pictures and they were sent down to me. They were born at 2209 and 2210 and I didn't see them until about 2pm the next day. I could have done but didn't want to go by myself and waited for DH to arrive back at the hospital (long story but I got transferred quite a long way to a different hospital that could deal with sub 32 weekers) before I did. We were lucky, they didn't have any problems and were home after 7 weeks in SCBU.

BUT I do think the whole experience meant I didn't bond with them for quite a long time and Nelly, I totally agree, I have no issues leaving them over night. I'm start work again on Monday and everyone keeps saying 'are you emotional about leaving them' and I'm not and they expect me to be.

They were one yesterday so I have been over thinking things a bit and it does make me sad that I will never have that experience of holding new baby straight away or have the photos everyone else seems to have of holding brand new baby in the hospital room (we're not having any more aftewr twins!).

So glad to hear your DTs are all well, silver.

So it seems we all have one thing in common: finding it quite easy to leave our babies. It surely has to be linked. I suspect it has something to do with other mums having never been apart from their babies from the moment they were born, so it is a bigger issue once they hit that point weeks or even months on. For those of us who were parted right from the start, being apart from our children is a core part of how our relationship with that child/ren is.

I've never understood the whole 'feeling like a limb is missing' sensation about leaving your child, I feel confused when other mums I know struggle to even leave their baby with their husband for a few hours, especially when the baby can feed from a bottle. I hope this will be a good thing in the long run, as baby's dad can feel an equal parent, the grandparents get to have quality time alone etc.

Yes, I can leave DS quite easily too, though I did get panicky when other people held him in the early days. I skipped off back to work after maternity leave. I go out to the hairdressers and my hobby without a backward glance. He didn't stay overnight with GPs till he was over 2 but that was because I was concerned that he couldn't communicate his needs, not that I would be bereft without him.

I also get bored playing with him very easily and I'm much happier when we are amusing ourselves in the same space. I feel awful about this and have never admitted it to anyone.

You're right about the advantages of equal parenting though. DH can and does do everything I do and his relationship with DS is fabulous as a result.

Its ok. Don't feel awful about it. We're not all going to find every age brilliant. I found the newborn stage awful (relentless, tiring, you know the score) but 4-6 months were great. However now she if 6mo she is exercising her temper, getting more clingy and grabby and needing more entertaining and I'm finding it hard again. Just because you want children and you love them doesn't mean you are going to find every stage of their life wonderful, or that you're going to be good at it.

I also worry when she is with her GPs and phone to check more in case she is playing up and giving them a hard time than if she is upset. Though tbf I do know that my parents care for her how I would like them to and understand her needs well.

Oh - I have never thought about the leaving the baby thing. I did this too. I went with the girls after about 4 weeks. Went to London to see Duran Duran at about 3 months leaving dd with dh. First babysitter about 4 months. Left her with my bf overnight at about 5 months. Back to work after 6. I never remember stressing unduly about any of these, and always express surprise at people who haven't been out for years as they couldn't possibly leave them.

Dd is fiercely independant too and went off aged 5 for 3 nights at the seaside, leaving me sobbing in the car. In Belgium these things are popular and she has done numerous trips, happy as larry, since - she's done a couple of week long ones. She is 8. This year she was most excited as she was at Brownie camp for her birthday. I was less keen, but there you go

I have never thought about this connection though, amazingly.

I think we should all take it as one good positive from that massive negative!

I got to hold my baby skin to skin a couple of minutes after he was born. I don't remember a rush of emotion other than huge self pity (emcs was basically my worst nightmare). My feelings for him kind of crept up on me. Love him to pieces now as I bet you love your little girl.

My baby is also 6mo. Have big hugs of solidarity and a big wallop to stop you watching birth programmes. Find a nice crime drama or something xxx

Huh. Should have read the rest of the posts before my deliberately lighthearted contribution. I don't want to talk about it right now, but I know where you're all coming from and it makes me so sad sometimes

Wow, Nellybluth your post has touched a nerve with me too. Something I forget about most of the time but sometimes it creeps back into my conscious and I wonder if I have dealt with the feelings properly or if they have been brushed under the carpet for another day. I guess only time will tell.

My DD was born by crash section after a hideous 3 day on off labour extravaganza. She was quite poorly when she was born and whisked off the SBCU where I met her later. I don't remember that first meeting with her, that first snuggle, I don't even know how much later it was that I met her. Next morning I also had the "your baby is in that cot over there" experience and she didn't feel like mine. I remember asking the nurse if I was allowed to change her nappy.

I couldn't walk for the first day after the section so had to wait for staff to wheel me up to see her and for the 3 days she was in I was an emotional mess. The midwives had no time for my hysterics and I was also on a ward with other mums and their babies. I remember lying there at night listening to the phone go at the nurses station and wondering if it was SBCU calling to say that my daughter hadn't made it. Happily, 3 days after her birth she was discharged from SBCU and was back with me on the ward but I do feel that the experience (and I feel a right old drama queen for using this word) traumatised me. I don't look back at those early days with any kind of romantic "awww" memories. I just remember how utterly shit I felt and how ill equipped I felt to deal with it all.

Fast forward 3.5 years and the bond that I worried we wouldn't have is so, so strong. I don't dwell on those early days anymore, I will forever regret that I didn't hold her and have skin to skin while she was only minutes and hours old but I don't feel that it has affected our relationship which I worried it may.

But I can promise you in the great scheme of your being a mother, it will only be an atom of sadness. And perhaps we love our babies a little bit sharper for that small piercing loss. I know I do

Kitstwins, you've summed it up perfectly and I couldn't agree more.

S'alright, cakes, and you are so right about stopping watching birth programmes, I swear they are the only time I get upset! A friend of mine, after a similar 3 day labour and horrible forceps delivery, remembers not giving a toss about her baby when it was finally born - too exhausted, traumatised and in pain to be able to process it all. There are so many reasons why the birth can be so upsetting for people.

Mardarse, traumatised is probably the right word for it. That sounds awful. I agree that there is a slightly lack of care for parents whose babies are in SCBU etc. (though I don't mean that comment to have a go at anyone who works in SCBU or post-labour wards) especially if they all know that baby is really fine, just a bit poorly for a few days. I imagine the situation is very different for mums of very premature or very poorly babies. Did you find that seeing nurses look after your baby made you feel even less equipped to care for her, as they all knew what they were doing? (I know I did)

At times I feel quite disappointed with myself for being upset about this, as I went into birth so open minded, so prepared for an epidural, forceps, an emcs - labour and birth was going to be what it was, and nothing was going to upset or surprise me. But I never imagined DD being poorly, because she was overdue.