Rearfacing Car Seats for 9 months to 4 years- Please read and spread the word

[Carseatcrazy]

Please please spread the word about rear facing car seats for 9 months to 4 years.

?In Sweden between July 2006 and November 2007 not one child under the age of six was killed in a car crash. Children in Sweden sit rear facing until the age of four.

205 children under 5 are seriously injured in the UK every year and a further 21 are killed, while in cars (the AA).

Two thirds of child fatalities in the under?four age group in the UK occur in cars (the AA).?

Rear facing car seats for this age group have now been proven to be 5 TIMES SAFER than forward facing.

If this isn't enough have a look at these:

http://www.youtube.com/watch ?v=Y2DVfqFhseo&feature=fvw

The other day I walked past a mum having her car fitted outside a well known retailer, and I felt so sad for her that the staff would be giving her the standard "no seat is safer than any other", when that is total rubbish There is a vast vast difference in the safety of these seats.

I just really want to spread the word to other mums and let them see the facts for themselves. (The government and retailers are of the view that UK parents don't want to buy these seats - and therefore don't tell us about them - incidentally there are places across the country now starting to stock them...)

I've done the research, and there is no way in this world I would now get a forward facing car seat. Yes they can be slightly more pricey- but generally about the same price as the higher end forward facing ones- and to be honest, I'm of the view that if you can possibly afford it, safety is the one thing you should skimp on

Anyway, if anyone wants more info, please just give me a shout, also there is loads of great info on: www.rearfacing.co.uk

happy car seat hunting

I dont have time to read all posts so sorry if i'm repeating. My experience of car seat use in sweden is very different to the stats and stated laws. Hire car companies there have not been bothered about even providing a seat until i've insisted, none of the 3 i've been provided with have been rear facing and have all been in poor condition and when i've borrowed one off friends w kids its been rear facing but about third hand and very battered. I think you can actually hire the stage 1 seats from baby shops. My interpretation of the stats is that there aint much traffic so there's less to hit!

Wow - glad I found this thread. I had no idea about this issue, and was about to go to Halfords and buy a front-facing seat for dd. I will definitely be heading to Milton Keynes asap

There is plenty of traffic in Sweden too, jollyma. We don't only ride around on reindeers....

It's up to each person renting a car to ask for a car seat. No one knows if you are bringing one with you or if you even have children.

Some companies, such as Avis, provide top of the line Swedish rear facing car seats for FREE for anyone who needs them. These seats are not old or worn aout and retail for around €300

The most important thing for safety is for kids to stay rear facing. Older sits provide great protection as well, Swedish car seats don't expire, as long as they re not broken.

There are of course examples of misuse in Sweden as well which are are trying to improve. Despite misuse car seat safety is 30 years ahead of other countries so you can just image how poor it is in UK and other countries.....

Adventuredad, I really wish my experience in Sweden was different but despite booking online and phoning ahead to confirm i needed a car seat i was left sat in a small airport car park after they tried to fob me off w a broken seat! After i kicked up a fuss and said i wouldn't wedge the seat in with the passenger seat they went and got a decent one from another depot. My point really is that hire car companies in sweden are no different to anywhere else i've experienced. I really did find the attitude of the hire car companies i've used there unhelpful about supplying child seats.

I love Sweden btw and visit regularly as my dad lives there. I just tend to get the train now though instead of hiring a car!

If anyone is looking for a great rf seat you're more than welcome to have a look / try of my Acto Graco Duologic II(small and fits most cars with good leg room in front)- I absolutely love it!!! It can be belt of isofixed in place, with no tether straps, so very easy to transfer between cars. I've also got a Besafe Isi combi, which I also love, which again, people are more than welcome to try.

If you're going on holiday to the west country, we're just off the M5 at Exeter

Goodness I totally agree I have been researching RF car seats for a year now and there is absolutely no way that my little girl (14mths) is going to get a fwd face car seat. Its RF for as long as possible. She still fits her Britax SHR infant seat.
I also went to a very well known retailer who actually told me that an isofix FF car seat is just as safe - I nearly blew my top but he was early twenty's and clearly had no idea!!!!!
It also saddens me to see 9mth old babies in FF car seats knowing how badley injured they could be and I just want to tell their parents that RF car seats are so much safer. But I cant in case they couldnt afford one.
One of my oldest friends has a 17mth old boy who went into a FF car seat when he was 13mths!! I did inform her how much safer her son would be in a RF car seat. But she pooh poohed the advice saying 'We were ok in them as kids and my nephews have been ok in them' Considering she is an intelligent woman I was shocked to hear her say that!!!!

CharlyR I know what you mean!! I've found myself talking to people as they've been outside large retailers, trying out FF carseats People must think I'm bonkers!! Just feel so sad when I see little ones going FF

I think the one that makes me saddest is the logic of "We turned DC1 FF at 9 months so we'll do the same with DC2." even though they'd come to realise that RF was safer

I was a big fan of rearfacing until I saw the latest post on the website of the Essex in car Safety Centre. This is what they say..........now I am very confused. By the way this is not my own opinion and I am just quoting so don't shoot the messenger!!!!

Eurotest crash test results confirm that these seats are no safer than the better front facing seats.
In consequence claims that these seats are "5 times safer" appear to be totaly unfounded.
It can be argued with some justification that Scandinavian accident statistics are better than ours purely because of the size & brands of cars that they drive.
Retailers find it significantly more difficult to fit a rear facing stage 2 seats than a forward facing seats.
If sold second hand the risks of these seats being fitted in a dangerous manner are considerable.
Unless you have a very large car these seats are likely to impact on either the drivers seat or the front passengers seat.
Reports suggest that children do not enjoy traveling in these type of seats.
They are expensive.
As far as we can find out, these seats are NOT tested in high speed rear impact crash tests. A rear impact in these seats is the same as a head on accident in a front facing seat.
Only "specialist fitters" are trained to fit these seats and research clearly shows that parents are not specialists.
They are incredibly difficult to move from car to car.
Is that not enough reasons why you should not buy one?

Suzyszoo

Bertiebots has written a reply on your other thread (Concord Ultimax)

The information you have just posted here IS NOT from the Essex In Car Saftey Centre!

Bertiebots elaborates more!

SuzysZoo I have a feeling looking at your other thread that you have now just purchased 2 rear facing seats. I think it would be great for everyone on here, for you to re-post your thoughts / comments on the thread you found on the other forum

I'm definitely not meaning this negatively I think it could really help all those people who are undecided - it does strike me that whoever wrote the post you found has not actually done their research or even used or owned, or even fitted one- as I could personally argue against the majority of the points

My KISS is easy to fit, easy to move between cars, my son loves travelling in it (and he's 25 months old), has a great view out the back and side windows and can also look at me driving through the "windows" in the headrest, my car is a standard focus, and we are significantly more likely to have frontal impacts, which also tend to have much greater force because you'd be hitting someone who is also moving in the opposite direction (the old physics lessons come in here!) Yes, it is fairly expensive, but as someone said to me - it's an extra two tanks of fuel to the cheapest seats, and the same price as many of the FF seats....
Hope that helps

Hi there Carseatcrazy. Yes I agree with you that it would be good for me to update you all. Firstly, the Essex In Car Safety people did not comment as I originally stated above. This was my mistake as I was led to a rogue website when I googled Essex In Car Safety Centre. It was a website operated by a retailer called Kidex who originally recommended rear facing but seem to not do so now, for reasons that I guess are to do with volume sales of forward facing seats...... I understand that Essex Council may take legal action against this website as I was not the only one to be confused into thinking this website was something to do with the Essex In Car Safety Centre. I have now bought two Britax Two Way Elites, having visited the ladies at the Essex in Car Safety Centre and been convinced of the huge benefits of rear-facing. If you are reading this, I would urge you to phone or visit the Essex In Car Safety Centre before you make your choice. Then you can be sure that you are making an informed choice. I love the Two Way Elites, and they are easy to get my babies in and out of.

I've just bought a britax two way elite for my 15mo ds, only found out about RF seats on MN so thank you very much everyone, I'm totally converted having looked at the stats/info/videos. I actually found it quite easy to fit and it's quite light so so far very pleased. I bought it online form the incarsafetycentre.co.uk and they were really helpful and delivered promptly.

Hi, I just bought a Britax Multi-Tech rearfacer today and my 19 month old DD seems to like it. Thanks to all on this thread for letting me know about rear facing car seats. Keep up the good work!

The parents that have visited my fitting station, have all been to a babystore and been told the exact thing that carseatcrazy is saying.

Shop assistance simply don´t know enough about chil car seat safety.

I read somewhere that Sweden had seen only 9 injuries to children in RF seats over a period of 5 years. I think that was what i read.

Someone in Australia tried to tell me and some others that there was somewhat less traffic in Sweden due to a smaller population there than in Australia. But she completely forgot that in that case Australia should have had only 22 injuries to children in car seats over the same number of years. They have over 2500 dead children each year.

Eurotest crash test results confirm that these seats are no safer than the better front facing seats.
In consequence claims that these seats are "5 times safer" appear to be totaly unfounded.
It can be argued with some justification that Scandinavian accident statistics are better than ours purely because of the size & brands of cars that they drive.
Retailers find it significantly more difficult to fit a rear facing stage 2 seats than a forward facing seats.
If sold second hand the risks of these seats being fitted in a dangerous manner are considerable.
Unless you have a very large car these seats are likely to impact on either the drivers seat or the front passengers seat.
Reports suggest that children do not enjoy traveling in these type of seats.
They are expensive.
As far as we can find out, these seats are NOT tested in high speed rear impact crash tests. A rear impact in these seats is the same as a head on accident in a front facing seat.
Only "specialist fitters" are trained to fit these seats and research clearly shows that parents are not specialists.
They are incredibly difficult to move from car to car.
Is that not enough reasons why you should not buy one?

There is SO MUCH wrong with this, that I don´t know where to start. it wasn´t the In car safety centre by the way. it was the carseatsafety link someone-else posted. they have no clue.

I have time to mention a few things.

You don´t need a large car for one thing.
there is no need to test the seats in high speed rearimpacts at all. the seats are tethered unlike the best FF seats. Cars are travelling in the same direction as opposed to in opposite directions. So the cars won´t come to a stop in a split sec. instead they´ll go forward thus reducing the impact forces greatly.

If these people really did have a clue about car seat safety they would not have written all this crap. Also, you´d be hardpressed to find a car seat manufactorer and an expert in the field of child safety in cars who would tell you that FF is just as safe or safer than RF.

This is a statement from one such expert. The site is mine. I am in Denmark, so nort advertising here.

www.sikkerautostol.dk/2010/09/isofix-vs-bilseleseatbelt/

Lena

Until they make the rear facing ones smaller (or we get a bigger car) I don't think we're going to be able to get one. I'm convinced on the safety aspect and even don't mind the extra money but I just don't see how it could work for us.

For now we're leaving her in her existing seat and we'll reconsider when she's bigger.

There are over 15 different RF seats available in Europe - espeially in Sweden.

I have succesfully fitted RF seats into the backseat of cars like Peuegot 107, Citroén C1, Toyota Aygo. I´m 5 ft.11" tall and could sit in front of them comfortably.

there is a at least one RF seat for every car in Europe.

Which one that fits into a car has absolutely nothing to do with the size of car you own. it has a lot to do with YOU as a parent, who has to sit in front of it, and the car interiror such as dashboard design.

You just had the misfortune of not finding the right RF seat for YOU and your cars.

By the way. The seats that fit well in those small cars are:

KISS
Fair G 0/1

Both isofix seats.

Lena

Just wondering if any other RF seat users could do some more reviews - We still don't have many on there :(
thank you

Hi,

If anyone spots my post here I could do with some reassurance please. DD is currently in a stage 1 rear-facer (she is 8 months) and now needs to move up to the next stage. I have a 3-door VW with front airbag (cannot be switched off). I already find it v. difficult to get her in and out of the back as it is. Does anyone here use a 9 months+ rear facing seat in a 3 door vehicle and if so how do you manage it? I'm all for safety but not sure if it's feasible .

Cheers for the tips Loopy. Always worth the hassle, although I do worry about taking a topple with DD in my arms!

Thank you for this thread, i'd never even thought that a standard front facing seat could be considered more dangerous, and have hardly seen any rear facing ones at all. It's changed my whole view on this subject, thank you.
This definitely needs more awareness...

I go by the laws of physics only when I teach parents how to use the RF seats and about car seats in general.

My 3 year-old is rearfacing for the simple reason that if something happens it is the laws of physics that come into effect and nothing else.