Rearfacing Car Seats for 9 months to 4 years- Please read and spread the word

[Carseatcrazy]

Please please spread the word about rear facing car seats for 9 months to 4 years.

?In Sweden between July 2006 and November 2007 not one child under the age of six was killed in a car crash. Children in Sweden sit rear facing until the age of four.

205 children under 5 are seriously injured in the UK every year and a further 21 are killed, while in cars (the AA).

Two thirds of child fatalities in the under?four age group in the UK occur in cars (the AA).?

Rear facing car seats for this age group have now been proven to be 5 TIMES SAFER than forward facing.

If this isn't enough have a look at these:

http://www.youtube.com/watch ?v=Y2DVfqFhseo&feature=fvw

The other day I walked past a mum having her car fitted outside a well known retailer, and I felt so sad for her that the staff would be giving her the standard "no seat is safer than any other", when that is total rubbish There is a vast vast difference in the safety of these seats.

I just really want to spread the word to other mums and let them see the facts for themselves. (The government and retailers are of the view that UK parents don't want to buy these seats - and therefore don't tell us about them - incidentally there are places across the country now starting to stock them...)

I've done the research, and there is no way in this world I would now get a forward facing car seat. Yes they can be slightly more pricey- but generally about the same price as the higher end forward facing ones- and to be honest, I'm of the view that if you can possibly afford it, safety is the one thing you should skimp on

Anyway, if anyone wants more info, please just give me a shout, also there is loads of great info on: www.rearfacing.co.uk

happy car seat hunting

just got an email to say that the rf car stickers are out! apparently you can order them on www.rearfacing.co.uk

I'm with you, ScarySpicemonster. . Everything you've said I could echo.

I bought a new carseat not long back for my under 2yo, and didn't even think of RF... I guess my risk tolerance threshold is above that of some people. Taking into account the amount we drive and the way I drive, etc.

Out of curiousity, how wide are the rear-facing seats (in cm)? Could you ever squeeze 3 of them into the back of an ordinary car?

Do any of them work with lap-belt only (no Isofix or tether strap or whatever extra)?

Could you safely squeeze in a RF seat for up to age 4yrs, in the back of an Estate, along with a slim boosterseat and a Britax Adventure (or similar seat?)

I assume answers are "No" to last few questions??

And presumably like other carseats you should get the seat fitted carefully before you buy (not just buy online). Which makes sense if you're forking out 250 quid to get the very best.

So I wonder How FAR I'd have to drive to find a place that could fit to our car. AND, what do you do if you don't own a car but only hire them when needed (which we did until we had 3 DC, the eldest already 6yo)? Do most RF seats fit in most cars the way most FF carseats do?

Oooh, that must be why I didn't even think about RF.

And why are they so expensive, is it just a matter of sales numbers? I can't see why they have to cost so far over 200 quid, down to 100 quid should be quite possible.

Come to think of it, if I did have 3 RF seats in the car, they would together exceed the value of the actual vehicle itself, heehehe. No, I tell a lie. If I had ONE RF seat in the car, it would exceed the scrap value of our vehicle (not allowing for Scrappage scheme, mind).

In the interests of consumer choice, for those folk for whom it is a practical choice, I list a load of places selling RF seats (let's hope that they do become standard and therefore available in Argos for a fraction of today's prices):

Babyandco.
Babysmart.
Babyworld (having a sale, I think).
Securatot.

hi pbk, the seat width varies obviously but one i looked at was 43cm wide, not sure how wide mine is! haven't measured it.

i can get 3 into the back of a vw golf and a leon. so i would say they are 'ordinary' cars?

a good few do work with a lap only belt, but all need tether straps apart from 1 which is isofix.

i have had a mc priori, a mc rodi sps and the britax twe in a laguna estate.

you should have the seat checked in your car or at least find out if the retailer has fitted it in a car like yours(we were close enough that we could go to the store) but i did ring to ask which seats were suitable for my car so i could read online reviews before i went there.

if you are hiring a car the ff seats may not fit just like the rf seats unless you got the same type of car all the time.

some are not anymore expensive then the ff seats. before i found out about rf seats i assumed i would get the maxi cosi priorifix (£235) as i'd had the mc baby seat and was happy with it, but mc are v reluctant to sell their rf seat in the uk. apparently british aprents are too stupid to read instructions compared to swedish ones!! but got my rf seat for £185. hopefully if they do become common then the price will come down. but the problems with argos etc. selling any car seat is that they can't check it fits for you.

there are many retailers now around the uk stocking them the rf website lists loads so there is probably somewhere closer than you think!

South East

----------------
In Car Safety Centre
Milton Keynes
Website
01908 220909
Britax Nordic range

Babyworld
Wallingford, Oxfordshire
Website
01491 821290
Recaro Polaric, Brio Zento

Olivers Babycare
Winchester
Website
01962 840491
Recaro Polaric

MT Carbox
Windsor
Website
01753 833442
Bimbofix

Baby Lady
Canterbury/Ashford
Website
01227 787400 (Canterbury)
01233 636346 (Ashford)
Brio Zento, Recaro Polaric

Baby Bluebird
Leigh-on-Sea
Website
01702 470727
BeSafe range

Babycare
Orpington
Website
01689 896665
BeSafe range

Kiddicare
Peterborough
Website
01733 201873
Recaro Polaric

Baby Nest
Croydon
020 8684 3930
Britax Multi-Tech

South West

----------------
Snowflak es
Weymouth
Website
01305 777345
Brio Zento, Recaro Polaric, BeSafe Combi

Securatot
Brinkworth, Wiltshire
Website
01666 510623
01666 824306
Recaro Polaric, BeSafe Izi Combi Isofix, BeSafe Izi Combi, Brio Zento

Baby & Co
Keynsham, Bristol
Website
0117 986 8184
Recaro Polaric, BeSafe Izi Combi Isofix, BeSafe Izi Combi, Brio Zento, Britax Multi-Tech

That's My Baby
Swindon
Website
01793 432111
BeSafe range

Trendy Baby
Clevedon
Website
01275 342111
BeSafe range

Devon Pram Centre
Honiton
Website
01404 43334
Recaro Polaric, BeSafe range

Adeba Nurseryworld
St Austell
Website
01726 73125
Britax Multitech, Brio Zento

North East

----------------
Paul Stride
York
Website
01904 674800
Recaro Polaric, BeSafe Izi Kid, Brio Zento

Just Baby
Hessle
Website
01482 644117
Brio Zento

North West

----------------
Bumps, Babies and Beyond
Burnage, Manchester
Website
0161 442 7373
Recaro Polaric

K300 Ltd
Stockport
Website
0161 355 1275
Recaro Polaric

Prams and Cots Galore
Chester
Website
01244 329 899
BeSafe range

Babylicious
Hoylake, Wirral
Website
0151 633 2717
Brio Zento, BeSafe range, Recaro Polaric

Scotland

----------------
Stirling Pram Centre
Stirling
Website
01786 472 392
Recaro Polaric

Jan Stewart
East Kilbride
Website
01355 222 064
Recaro Polaric

Online only retailers

----------------
Bab y's Mart
Website
0870 7878 978
Brio Zento, Recaro Polaric, BeSafe Izi Combi Isofix

northern ireland also has the www.incarsafetycentre.co.uk in belfast which stocks them.

peanutbutterkid

Do any of them work with lap-belt only (no Isofix or tether strap or whatever extra)?

yes lap belt only but then tethering straps that fit to the driver/passenger seats or they just wouldn't work (can buy addition seat for more than one car use IYSWIM) Main reason I bought it because then I had a car seat that I could use with a lap belt only until dd was 6.

Could you safely squeeze in a RF seat for up to age 4yrs, in the back of an Estate, along with a slim boosterseat and a Britax Adventure (or similar seat?)

Yes I would think so, we certainly did because the wide part of the 2 way elite goes where the narrowest part of the other seats are IYSWIM

I assume answers are "No" to last few questions??

And presumably like other carseats you should get the seat fitted carefully before you buy (not just buy online). Which makes sense if you're forking out 250 quid to get the very best.

Loads of "trained" staff can't fit car seats properly, I've always fitted my own......idea is that they have no forward backward movement and virtual no sideways movement - not rocket science, then check for buckle crunch.

So I wonder How FAR I'd have to drive to find a place that could fit to our car. AND, what do you do if you don't own a car but only hire them when needed (which we did until we had 3 DC, the eldest already 6yo)? Do most RF seats fit in most cars the way most FF carseats do?

Yeah, I was right, nearest stockist to us is Peterborough and that's a 2 hour drive each way (and no, there isn't any other reason at all why I would ever need to go over there).

You can't even find a swimming pool with a diving board in it in Norfolk, we are SO FAR away from everything .

I'll make sure to put Norfolk on my places to never move to list if it's that barren of facilities!

I have just done a Britax car seat fitting course for my job, and the Britax man told me about this Sweedish (& I think Norweigen) law about rear facing car seats till they are 4 years old.
However, most cars in the UK are not big enough to hold a rear facing car seat that big.

The Sweedish car market have taken this into consideration though, Saab & Volvo have more room in the back to accomodate them.

Another interesting car seat fact I found out was that from 2012 it will be a legal requirement for children under 135cm to be in not just a booster seat, but a high backed booster seat.

The footage which we were shown from crash testing on car seats was truly terrifying. I think you can find it easily enough on either You Tube, or via Which or the German Which equivilant.

Another intersesting fact (sorry - am a bit obsessed about car seats at present) is that all car seats conform to the European standard RD44. HOWEVER this standard is incredibly low, and if you use it as a baseline, the more expensive & respected car seats are way way way higher than this and offer 100% more protection.

this isn't necessarily true about volvos. my dad has just bought one and there is less room for ds' britax twe than there is in my mil's seat ibiza and this is in the back passenger seat!! have also had it in a clio, fiesta, megane and it now lives in a golf or leon. good to hear about the hbb thing though.

We had a RF seat for dd which was fantastic. If you compare it to a FF seat it feels so much more solid - probably because it is not only secured by the rear passenger seat belt but it is also anchored to the front passenger seat. They are rock solid in fact.

I stupidly donated mine to a local charity (I'd bought it for dd as she has CP and had little head control at the time - I thought it'd be useful for other parents) - now expecting dc2 and CP or no CP I wouldn't choose anything else .

I can also recommened the In Car Safety Centre in MK - they are fab.

Last I heard Britax RF Grp1 car seats were so expensive in the UK because they refused to sell them direct to UK retailers - if you buy one in the UK it's more than likely been exported (they're still made in Britain) and re-imported which will up the cost significantly. Given some of the other reasons I've heard for not selling RF car seats ("UK parents prefer the colour options on our FF seats" being my personal favourite) I tend to take the word of car seat manufacturers with a large dose of salt on these matters .

We have a BeSafe IziKid in the back of an A3, with room for a 5'11 adult to sit in front of them. DD is 2 1/2 and still happy. The only permanent fixing to the car is the rear 3-point seat belt - its then also supported with a leg and tied to the front passenger seat with tether straps. We've had two adults in the back as well although they weren't particularly comfortable.

If you're really interested in getting a RF seat and can't get to a retailer its well worth calling the ladies in Essex - we found them incredibly knowledgeable and very helpful. They don't sell seats so have no vested interest in pushing any particular model and may be able to check the fit for you (they do a lot of the free car seat safety checks at firestations around the country - we rang at the right time and they were coming within 10 miles of us the next weekend!)

We had a Fair Bimbofix (stupid name), rear facing seat for DD. We have a Volvo and a Saab, Volvo's own rear-facing seat (made by Britax), fitted so badly in our S60, that there was no room for my legs in the front passenger seat (I'm 5' 10).

At the time the only other option was the Fair seat. We were v. happy with it and it had good reviews.

I love a rear facing thread because i am very passionate about rear facing, I was lucky enough to find out about it from some junk mail from Volvo, which had a few simple facts, which was enough to convince me.

This is about giving people the facts, all the facts, then you can make an informed choice.

I feel was sad when i see a very young baby in a ff seat, and wonder if they would have turn them if they know the facts.

I have writen to my local MP (Greg Clark) and he is writing to Paul Clark The Parlimentary Under Secretary of state for transport.

This is a great time to write to MPs as they are thinking about their votes at the moment.

"Carseatcrazy is correct, the accident statistics in Sweden are simply amazing due to rear facing until age 4. Someone mentioned above that the law is stricter here which is incorrect. The law is the same in Uk as in Sweden. Parents are simply better informed about the huge benefits and keep kids rear facing. It's unusual to see kids under 3 forward facing

In case you want to find photos of older (and younger) kids rear facing you can take a look at the gallery over at www.carseat.se/gallery/. At the site www.CarSeat.se you will also find out pretty much everything you need to know about rear facing (Disclaimer:This site is run by me)

Unfortunately i think RF is about to be thought as of unsafe! Which? has just said you shouldn't buy four of the leading rear facing seat!!!!

It says they are unsafe because parents can't install them safely.

It also gives them all really low front on crash scores - how is that possible?

I've just been speaking to a local supplier in Dorset and they're setting up a car safety centre with all the seats in, so that people can go and have them fitted in an easy, fully accessible spot fab news very exciting

Re. Which? and RF car seats - they tested seats in all manufacturer configurations and report the lowest score. So for the Brio Zento they used the score resulting from its use as a booster seat... I found this out from the ladies in Essex - but unless you know the configuration for which they have reported safety data it makes the entire comparison pretty meaningless if you're planning to use the seat RF.

As a thought... If Which? consider the ability of parents to install a car seat correctly should be taken into consideration in their ratings then, given something liked 80% of car seats are installed incorrectly, shoudn't they rate ALL car seats as "Do Not Buy".

We have a RF Grp 1 car seat and don't find it hard to install at all - its a bit more fiddly, but not particularly difficult and very obvious if you've got it wrong

The biggest problem we have is getting car seats that fit in cars we have. We have classic (or just plain old) cars and so seat belts are different. The volvo 340 has very long seat belt stems and so suffer from buckle crunch or just can't tighten them up enough at all.

We are going to be getting an old volvo 340 that is built like a tank. So far all I can come up with is Britax Eclipse (which we do have) that fits in all 3 places in the back.

We were in a car crash when DS was 3 weeks old. He was in a mamas & papas baby car seat and didn't even wake up. His was the side that was hit. All air bags went off including side curtains, tyres ripped off, front of car ripped off - honestly it looked like we'd been in a pile up, we were going 30miles per hour. The other driver had passed out at the wheel and so went full into us. We were all unscathed......apart from mentally and DH's arms burnt from the air bags. I am a wreck on the road, tis a complete nightmare for all of us. It annoys me so mch that if you want safe you have to pay lots for it, as if stating that if you have less money you care less about your child. Bloomin companies

It is really odd why the UK is lagging so behind in this issue. I'm in the US and here the recommendations are for your child to be in a rear facing seat until at least 35 pounds, but ideally up to 60 pounds. We just bought a Britax Marathon for DD (who is a year old and 18lbs), it is a convertible seat. It fits in my Honda Jazz, which isn't exactly a huge car. Wonder why the UK government isn't being more proactive on this issue?

i got a man out form the council a few months ago to check my baby car seat and he said the best seats to buy are the rear facing ones. the said you can mend a leg but not a broken brain and you know he is right. i know they are expensive but you cant put a price on a childs life. unlike some people id rather do without a year of take aways, holidays, clothes etc and put the money towards one. im currently saving hard for one and doing without hair cuts and treats. id never heard of these car seats until the man told me and im glad he did.

We've just got the Britax 2 way elite!

I'm really pleased with it. We went all the way to Milton Keynes (we're near Bath) and back in a day to get it fitted by the people at the in car safety centre. They were really helpful. They knew that we'd had problems with other types and said that if we couldn't get the 2 way elite then wouldn't be able to do rear-facing with any other seat. We have a colour brochure with instructions in Scandiwegian and a black and white translation - it's fairly clear from the pictures what you're supposed to do.

It fits much better than the Britax multitech that we tried from Baby and Co in Keynsham. With the 2 way elite we didn't even have to move the front seats at all. It looks very comfy and doesn't seem to take up any more space than the first stage one that it's replacing. It's rock solid front to back and side to side. My only criticism is that the straps are a bit fiddly to fasten - there seems to be a "half twist" designed into them that you need to get right each time you fasten it.

DD is now almost 17 months old (small and light for her age) and she seems to find it really comfy - always falls asleep in it.

I can't really believe that people are fussy about the colour of car seats - surely it's only because there's a choice of colours offered that it can be an issue? Ours is black (they pointed out that it was a slightly different colour of black than the one we tried initially). I honestly can't say that I'd be bothered - maybe if it was bright pink or something? Even then I'd be more concerned about the safety aspects.

I'm thinking of emailing Britax and suggesting that they sell them in this country properly. There's clearly a demand.

great news CokeFan.

Just found this wonderful thread. My DD is 15 months and outgrowing her Maxi Cosi Cabriofix and I'd really like her to carry on rear facing.

I'm thinking of taking a trip to the Essex people... miles and miles away from me! Anyone know if I have to live in Essex for them to help or will I be ok?

I've got ISOFIX points in my car, does anyone know what rear facing seats take the ISOFIX (am thinking as they are there I'd like to use them!)?

Thank you

They're happy to help people from all over the country - give them a call first as they may be able to answer a lot of your questions that way .

IIRC, there are ISOFIX options on the BeSafe IziKid and IziCombi, the Recaro Polaric and the MaxiCosi Mobi (although that is HUGE!). That said, we'd have liked to use ISOFIX but the only seat that fitted and looked comfortable was the BeSafe IziKid and, at the time, it was only available as a non-ISOFIX model - and its solid as a rock when fitted and not that much hassle to do. Talk to the ladies in Essex and they'll be able to advise