Advice on school Fine

[TurtleBeGiddy]

Dear fellow Mumnetters,

I have 3 boys that go to 3 different schools. My eldest goes to a secondary school and the younger ones (Year 4, and Year 1) go to primary.

Morning drops are managed thanks to breakfast clubs. However, the pick-ups are extremely challenging, well maybe not too much but my Year 4 child's school has gone all pedantic on me. Ive been late, twice in 14 days and as a result theyve decided to fine me.

I metup with the headteacher but she was not giving an inch, citing how she pays her office staff by the hour and they have other commitments etc. She instead started to solutionise for me by prescribing my son more afternoon clubs. My child already had enough and I dont feel right to force him into more when he isnt interested. Anyway, bottom line is I am facing a dilemma. My eldest isnt much of an issue as I can probably find a solution but the other two are young. Depending on traffic I can be a maximum of 15 mins late but no more.

Im tempted to complain, but actually I just wanna cry. Simply because I expected better and more empathy and maybe even compassion but no, doesnt look like that's the case. Ive been stigmatised, made to feel like im doing wrong and fined.

I need advice, 1) Has anyone been in this situation with a primary school
2) what did you do?
3) had anyone ever complained and whats the chances of winning?
4) if i complain will I be victimised?

Honestly its been terrible because I dont mean any harm, but i dont know who to seek advice from. I feel ive just been targeted unfairly but I dont wanna damage what I thought was a good parent-school staff relationship.

Thanks in advance.

I feel for you op, but…

it’s actually outrageous of you to think that other people who are basically strangers to you, should work for you for free for an unknown amount of time potentially every day. That is what you’re asking for, so using words like ‘empathy’ isn’t relevant here.

you have put the school staff, twice in a little over 2 weeks, in a horrible situation. They get paid till eg 4pm, they possibly need to leave for their own reasons bang on, and they can’t be use safeguarding rules are that you can’t just abandon an 8 yo. So they have to wait for you to turn up. If I was that teacher, even once, even with a good relationship, I would be absolutely fuming. And if the parent wasn’t so grateful and begging my forgiveness, but instead was talking about complaining about the fact that I should look after their child for free, that would be my relationship with said parent over.

your thought process here op, admittedly driven by frustration and upset on your part, is kinda outrageous. Sorry.

I think you have no choice but to find a solution that can pick up on time.

my choice would be to put out an ad on your local fb for an alevel student to pick him up and walk him home. £5 maybe £10.

This is a difficult situation for you.

However, until you are able to put both of your younger children in the same school, you really have no option but to put your Y4 child in more after school clubs as a safety net.

It is unfair to expect staff to be available to extend their care of your child after the end of the school day.

The headteacher suggested a solution instead of further fines, so I would accept what has been offered to you.

It doesn’t sound so much like a fine as opposed to if you don’t turn in time then they have to provide wrap around care so they’re charging you for that. Just book the ASC the head has suggested. It’s the perfect solution and would likely alleviate a lot of stress for you about the things you can’t control like traffic. Next year in Y5 they can leave on their own and/or maybe you’ll be able to get the youngest into the same school- as a sibling they must be near top of the waiting list.

I would pick up one of the children 15 mins early each day so you can get to the second school on time. Sell it as a temporary problem while waiting for a place to come up. As they’ve done afternoon registration they won’t be marked as absent

You say you are not usually late, yet you also say the schools are not walking distance apart and you have to drive. You can't be at both schools at 3:30 - or whatever the home time is - so you must be always late, even if you get there before the 'take to lates' time (usually 15 minutes after home time). It's not nice for the child to always be the last to be picked up and it's not great for the staff either, always waiting for the same parents to collect. Talk to the head about the likelihood of getting your younger child into the school - priority sibling place - and if not move your Y4 child. Secondary child should make their own way home.

One of my friends has a similar problem with children at two different schools. She uses a childminder to collect the younger one whilst she is collecting the elder. She then goes to the childminder’s to collect her younger child.
Schools will continue to fine you as staff having to stay late waiting for you is potentially costing them overtime payments for the school staff.

Get a local childminder to do you an hour.

I'm surprised by the lack of compassion here. You can acknowledge the school's position and still agree with OP that it's a shit position to be in through no fault of her own. Instead people are saying she should pay for clubs (you don't even know if she can afford that) or for a childminder (I don't know anyone who'd be happy to travel to a school for 15min of work), or ask a friend (someone posting on aibu that a friend asked her to pick up her kid from school would be told her friend is a CF for asking !)

OP, any way you can leave work a few minutes early and make up the time on your lunch break or wfh ? Apologies if you already explored this option.

Otherwise, the 9yo sitting outside the school waiting for you ? Would that be allowed ? You could get them a cheap brick phone so you can be on the phone with them for the ten minutes it takes to get there.

Talk to your youngests school, they be may be sympathetic and allow you to pick up 15 mins until your eldest is year 5/6 and take themselves to and from school.
If not, then at our school, all children in KS2 are allowed to leave without a parent if parent agrees. Though in some areas I’ve heard it’s year 5&6. So maybe your eldest can walk to a nearby bench or park if there is one. I would get a smart watch with location tracking, so you can track and also talk to them (or your year 1 can chat whilst you talk to them!).

Surely you are late every day if the schools finish at the same time?

YABU - this is your problem, not the school’s

Oh OP. What a tricky situation.

I feel for you and am surprised the school
have already fined you.

At our school kids wait by the office if their parents are late. However there are staff there so it is possible to do.

if your school try to have all staff off premises by a certain time (eg to save £) then I can understand the Head’s position.

the head’s message is very clear here.

does your older child have a friend who they can go home with when this happens? Can you message a local parent / class WhatsApp group last minute to help you out so it doesn’t happen again?

Don't you think that's a bit harsh? One parent being late once to say If I was that teacher, even once, even with a good relationship, I would be absolutely fuming.

This is why they say never work with childten or animals.

What happens if mum crashes the car? That's once so you would be fuming? Even the once? But you'd forgive her if she begged you to?

I honestly don't get people some of the time. Once I was picking up my kids and saw a old lady laying on the pavement. I stopped and then I was late. I just did what was in front of me at the time I had a plan. It went to shit because I had lost control. The only way to take back 100% control would to be ignore the old lady. I don't recall begging school staff for forgiveness. But by your logic I should be on my knees begging as I was a shit person. Yes I was a shit parent making that choice but it didn't from a place of contempt of the school. The old lady could have been the mum of a teacher after all

By the this logic I'd be "fuck you old lady my kids teacher will be fuming and never forgive me if I help you!" Driven past as she be the next drivers issue but I'd be OK and one less anerisium for school

Shit happens. But to say never make one mistake ever is madness and unrealistic.

Your sense of entitlement is astounding. Pick your kids up on time or take up the solution that was offered to you.

How cheeky do you have to be to think other people should pick up this kind of slack for you on a regular basis? Did you not listen when the headteacher told you that peop have commitments and don’t work for free? Wtf do you expect them to do?

As someone who regularly has to look after other peoples kids for free because they can’t be bothered to be on time or make other arrangements, I think selfish fucker parents who do this should be fined a lot more.

I don't think you are being fined. You will have been charged for the after school club.
Schools finish at a certain time and that's when children are picked up. Every school I've worked in understands that delays happen and parents are late. But these are one off delays. You say you were late last year and now you must be late every single day if both schools finish at the same time.
Understandably the school can't have this. You have been offered a solution. After school clubs. Until you can get one of your children moved to the other school that is your solution.

I’m not sure if you misunderstood what I was saying or this situation @NotPerfectlyAdverage

this is a totally different situation to the exceptional circumstances which you describe with the old lady. That was unforeseen.

this is different. The op knows she’s going to be late, she can only be if she has 2 pickups at the same time a drive apart.

so even when she did it the first time, she knew it was going to happen.

to deliberately expect someone else to give up ten minutes of their time, rather than sort your own solution out, is the problem here.

But those incidents don’t happen on a daily basis. Op is literally trying to be in two places at once, so her being late is both foreseeable and a daily occurrence.

You feel you're being victimised because you're late to pick up once a week, so presumably you think a member of staff should stay unpaid to look after your kid because #bekind....
Sorry, but would you work late for free once a week because someone else didn't turn up on time? Didn't think so. Pay for the club, anything else is totally unreasonable.

Actually having read @TurtleBeGiddy's update, I agree with others that in reality, you must be late every day, surely? Impossible to be in place A and place B at 3.25pm, even if they are next to each other?
Or DC went to infant and junior and even tho they were literally next door, the school recognised this fact by having one end at 3.25 and the other at 3.30.

So is it that twice you have been beyond a 10-minute late which the school is happy with? And yes, a fine seems unlikely. Have you not just been charged for ASC?

If I were you I would appeal again for the schools to get two places at the same one, and if not, suck up ASC (if available) for the year 4; once they are year 5 I would be fine for them to start making their way home (if feasible) - most schools are happy with this IME.

As for being late, yes im never there at 3:15. However, no parent is, because there is a queue outside, some parents even make it at 3:20, and maybe 3:25 and that's not late because of the queue. The definition of late according to HT is when all parents have gone and no parents remain in the playground. This is why I usually make around 3:25 and their are still parents in the playground. Its just the days when im literally a few mins late. Infact they bring in kids back to the reception and then start ringing parents.
I got called twice this year and on both occasions I was outside the gate.

As I said I totally get it, I do feel for the school staff too. It really is a shit situation for both.

When I appealed for my boys place, I said the very same thing about possibility of being late but it was rejected.

It really is a shit situation for both
But they’ve suggested clubs for your child, which you’ve refused to consider.
So you’re basically choosing to remain in (and force them into) a shit situation. Why? What on earth is driving you to continue causing everyone around you this sort of stress?!
It’s really quite baffling.

The teachers probably have their own children to collect from other schools!! Just collect one child early - walk to front of queue and say I have to collect my child now as I’ve got to get his brother from his school across town and be there in 10 mins

Sounds like they have a 10minute leeway (probably most schools do) but you are regularly arriving after that. They can't have an endless leeway, there does need to be a cut off.

I am sure everyone else in the queue has absolutely nothing to do other than wait in the queue whilst some CF pushes to the front every day! That would be the fastest way to a smack in the face. That is not the way to solve the problem, it will simply create another one - especially when she is even later due to the huge row she creates with the other parents and teachers at the other school.

A state school haS no authority to fine you for being late. I suspect tgey are charging you gir afterschool club fees which is preferable to involving you to social services for abandoning your child.
Serious question who do you expect to look after hour dc after school ends without being paid?