why flame ff mums?

[maxpower]

I'm getting increasingly pissed off with literature that treats ff so negatively. I was reading the bounty book about pregnancy and in one of the sections about feeding your baby, it was structured entirely around why ff was wrong and evil and no good for your baby (rather than focusing on the positives about bf). IMO, mums should be supported and recognised for whatever decisions they make about feeding their babies. Every contact I've had so far in this pregnancy in relation to feeding has gone on and on about bf like anything else is completely unacceptable. We hear a lot about bf mums feeling unsupported but nothing is set up to support ff mums. I've never seen ff cafe's or meet ups advertised anywhere, so ff mum's are also being excluded from important social and supportive events. No-one ever seems to recognise that actually, ff can be harder work in some respects. Bf mums don't need to wash, sterilise and make up bottles, they don't have to plan ahead when going out - if they get held up they have food immediately available, they don't have to consider how they will heat bottles etc when out, they don't have to spend money on formula. How about some support for mums who either choose or resort to ffeeding rather than treating them as lazy, selfish mums who don't care about their baby's wellbeing?

All the books I've read seem pretty objective either way, it just happens that the health benefits for bfing far out way ff.

As fas as the effort involved, whilst bf is like you say, and I believe more convenient, bfing is harder work on your body, it takes a lot of effort to make all that milk, it is extremely tiring. You just have different things to consider, like what you can and can't eat, if you have a baby prone to wind it means you eat a limited and blan diet.

This is one debate I never really get though, most babies are ff so you already have the majority on your side. Whereas bfing mums often feel isolated and misunderstood.

'E£vil'?

Whatever.

hang on, i you OP you say "it was structured entirely around why ff was wrong and evil and no good for your baby (rather than focusing on the positives about bf). "

and then you say "Every contact I've had so far in this pregnancy in relation to feeding has gone on and on about bf like anything else is completely unacceptable"

so which do you want, the focus on the negatives of FF or the positives of BF. i dont think you want either i think you just want a row.

yawn!

If you feel FF is so much hard work then why don't you BF.

these threads are never very supportive..... try an ante natal thread or post natal thread if you need support xxx

OP set up your own FF support group. a bf group is for bfing mothers to get support for breastfeeding issues, i cant see what support that would provide for a FF mother. hardly fair to say you are being excluded from "important social and supportive events".

that is like saying a support group for immigrant workers is excluding someone who has always lived here and doesn't need support in the workplace. stupid.
and i repeat OP isn't looking for support, tehy are looking to stir up a whole load of shit.

There are a few breastfeeding support groups. There are good reasons for having bf support groups. I know of no other social event or activity which would exclude a ff mother. Ff is seen and done everywhere, isn't it? The majority of babies in the UK are formula fed at some point anyway - 99 per cent, I think, so ff mothers are hardly an oppressed minority

Where on earth, anywhere, does it say ff is wrong and evil???

How odd to think this - maybe you are reading a little bit too much into things, OP? Yes?

Good point, booyhoo.

In fact I think I'm gonna have a little moan. There is a group near me that supports single mothers - what a shame I'm excluded from it, 'cos I have a partner. And there's the Catholic toddler group that meets after church tomorrow in the church hall....ooops, I'm not a Catholic, and I don't go to church anyway. I'm missing out! Maybe I'll go to the Adult Literacy group that's just started up in the library. No, I can't go to that, 'cos I can read and write pretty well

"it was structured entirely around why ff was wrong and evil and no good for your baby"
Ummm, I think you may be putting a leetle bit of your own spin on that, perhaps?

LIFE is a ff cafe. 99% of babies get formula. (At least, only 1% are ebf to 6 months) Every time you meet another mother, there's an overwhelming chance that she ff too, and you can discuss, well, whatever you want to re ff.

There's a good reason bf mothers go to bf cafes. It's cos without them there's a jolly good chance they might never come close to finding another bf mother.

However, IME "important social events", they ain't. I'd reserve your envy for something else, I think.

X post with tiktok!

apart from the MN meetup i have never breastfed in the company of another woman breastfeeding except at the local BF group. every mother i know outside of the group FFeeds and doesn't need any support with that.

Oh unclench.

Have some warm milk and go to bed.

It'll all seem better in the morning.

snort @PC

What is it you need support with ? Can you be more specific?

IME bf support groups are full of mums in physical discomfort, at wits end, seeking help to resolve largely traumatised nipples and other physical issues such as mastitis, thrush or babies that aren't doing well for one reason or another. Whilst a certain camraderie does develop and mothers do support one another generally, they are hardly cheery social occasions that you paint them to be, but then if you've never been to one then I guess you wouldn't know.

Please link to official literature describing formula feeding as 'evil' or 'unacceptable'.

As others have said, you could always start your own. A large number of bf support groups are run on an entirely voluntary basis by mums volunteering for national bf charities who turn up week-in-week-out to support others. What's stopping you doing the same for formula feeding mums?

Wow - way to collectively jump down maxpower's throat.

I'm surprised at the mocking tone demonstrated by almost everyone thus far.

On many threads I see this reaction justified by saying that OP is spreading misinformation about breastfeeding and therefore the responses are needed to set the record straight.

That's not the case here. And while maybe 99% of people give their babies formula at some point, this board/thread/whatever-you-call-it ("breast and bottle-feeding) is overwhelmingly supportive of breastfeeding. In this context Maxpower's point-of-view as stated here is essentially innocuous - after the first person disagreed with her it was unnecessary for 10+ of you to pile on.

Posts like this are often written by people who deep-down feel bad about not breastfeeding. It doesn't take a psychology degree to realize that.

Hope you all haven't scared her off for good.

I don't think we need ff meet ups. Formula feeders don't get left out, they are widely accepted.

The reason there are breastfeeding cafes & meet ups is because most of society doesn't like seeing breasts used for their true purpose.

I ff dd1 anywhere, never felt that I couldn't get out her bottle & feed her. I bf dd2, again anywhere...but I felt eyes on me, I saw people give me 'looks' and I felt very conscious doing it.

DH has just said that it will be you paying the price for her having so little sleep in the week, and therefore its not fair.

crap, wrong thread sorry

well, when i had dd, there was an nhs bf support group which i wasn't allowed to go to cos i expressed bf, then had to switch to ff. everyone else from my ante-natal group went there, but i wasn't allowed in! (even though i expressed until illness meant i couldn't feed dd my own milk & then it dried up)

i was devastated at not being able to bf dd - and then i was excluded from any support about the 'choice' i had (it was bottle feed or let her die, not much choice really).

i know incredibly few people who never bf (can only think of 1), a lot who did a mixture - gradually changing to ff, and a sizeable number who exclusively bf. whilst it is obvious that women who have probs with bf should be supported, it seems equally obvious that women who ff may also need support. it isn't just about the practical difficulties, but also the emotional ones. if you're crying every time you give a bottle (even of ebm) cos you feel so upset abut not bf, then there should be somewhere that you get support, but my experience was that you were treated as a 'failure' and the only 'support' available was 'can't you try some more'? and NOT being allowed into the group where other mothers were!

so i think the op has a point.

I see your point Kissassangel. I did cry when giving my DD a bottle of formula. She ended up being exclusively ff by 4 months. I got very upset and constantly felt as though I was being judged by bf groups etc. It took a lot of time and some very understanding friends before I realised that the only judging in my case was coming from me. I'd assumed I would be able to bf and couldn't. I should have tried harder to get support and not given up so early etc...

I didn't actually go to any breastfeeding groups for help / support/ whatever because I felt a failure and as though they wouldn't support me. Perhaps I should have asked them.

yes, i wonder what the midwives would have done if i'd turned up to the bf group and taken out a bottle - they didn't even tell me about it, even when i was expressing! so dd was getting bm, but via a bottle.

everyone knows that bm is best, BUT fm was not invented for mothers who were too lazy/vain/arrogant/stupid to use it, but in order to save lives.

probably there are some who choose not to bf, but i have yet to met them, every mother who has used fm has done so as it was the best option for their child. so, yes, there should be support for bf mothers, but why can't there just be 'open' support groups for mums with ANY feeding probs?

those of us forced to ff, have experienced even greater probs than those who succeed to bf.

"those of us forced to ff, have experienced even greater probs than those who succeed to bf."

Not necessarily.

if you mean it focussed on the risks and drawbacks of ff then that's becuase there is a shift from talking about the benefits of bf. Doing that sets ff as the normal infant feeding method and bf as the gold standard.

Talking about the risks of ff sets bf as the normal infant feeding method and sees ff as an intervention sometimes.