Apparently I am doing it all wrong

[Saucepanman]

Have been trying to start this thread all day. Have an 8 day old ds, who was born via section. We were discharged on day 2 and sent back on day 5 due t his jaundice and having lost 13.5% of his birth weight. We stayed in overnight under phototherapy lamps and came home Sunday. All good so far.

Have 2 other dcs, we had lovely day yesterday chilled out at home, taking baby for first walk etc. He is breast fed, and yesterday I felt had really got into my stride with it- he was more alert, content, feeding well etc. He then had a brilliant night where we could actually put him down and even got a bit of sleep. Have previously bf dd for 11m so quite happy that I knew what I was doing.

ANYWAY community midwife comes out to day and basically bollcks me for pretty much everything. My positioning was wrong, latch was wrong- I was even winding him wrong ffs.Her manner was v abrupt and I felt gutted. She said I should offer both breasts at each feed and then express too. Baby should have 20-30 mins on one breast to empty it, then a bit of the other side. Also I should not feed more than 3 hourly as it takes 2 hrs for the breast to refill. I had been feeding on demand which seemed to be working. She even moved the pillows as I was not supporting myself properly

As yet I have not been able to express after feeding as feeds are taking longer and ds is wanting to feed more than the set 3 hours.

Anyway feeling really down and low in confidence, I thought I had it right this time. Does any/all of this sound right? It wasn't what I thought I knew about breast feeding. She has inferred I must get his weight up or he will be readmitted. Feel a very shit mum indeed

Her advice sounds like a lot of crap tbh, I hope someone experienced will be on here soon to explain better.

Definitely feed on demand and don't worry about 'emptying and refilling' breasts this is gubbins.

Why does she think you need to express if he is feeding well??

Good god she is talking rubbish. I don't know where to start and am sure someone will come along and write a more informative post any minute, but she is clearly mad.

Three hour feeds? Expressing as well? She does not have the basics right.

I would complain about her and carry on as you were.

She's talking bobbins. Continue to feed on demand, breasts are like a river, not a bucket.

Sounds like you're doing great. Feet up, tea and cake to hand and feed, feed, feed. (baby, not you )

You poor thing, I'm so sorry you're having a rough time of it from the midwife. Especially as it sounds like she's talking bollocks and you're doing brilliantly!

Timings like 20-30 mins per feed are pretty meaningless. Your baby will feed as long as he wants. And a breast is never empty so doesn't need any time to refill .

My DS didn't start going three hours between feeds until after the 6 week growth spurt - at 8 days he was feeding every 1.5-2 hours and since he took 45-60 mins at a feed it felt like constant feeding (I also had a section and tbh it was nice to be forced to put my feet up and feed him!). Even now (11 weeks) he still sometimes demands feeds sooner than 3 hours (eg the day after his jabs when he seemed a bit unsettled). That's why it's called demand feeding fgs.

And there's no point expressing at this stage, as a pump just isn't as good at stimulating supply as your son. You have two other DC and expressing after feeds would just make your whole time about feeding, which is impractical (as well as being unnecessary).

My advice would be to ignore this midwife and just keep doing what you're doing. You're doing a great job and enjoy these precious newborn days

Bobbins gubbins and rubbish, yup the other posters have summed up her advice pretty well

Bosoms love your descriptions of breasts as like a river not a bucket - perfect

Don't let her get you down. If you are happy, and your DS is happy, then don't change a thing. Feeding on demand is just that. Congrats on your DS - I hope you are having a lovely evening.

Just keep Feeding, Feeding, Feeding. Your doing the right thing. Feeding on demand will also help flush out and remaining jaundice. I'm sure I fed 1-2 hourly. If you've got 2 other children its harder to sit down lots but try getting a sling which you can feed in.

Position yourself how you want. As long as your comfortable you do not need to worry.

Have you ever looked at www.kellymom.com lots of info on newborn feeding behaviours and it will reassure you lots.

She is a complete loon!

You are doing exactly the right thing, breast fed babies do not follow HV weight charts anyway as they are based on formula fed babies. Feeding more often increases the milk supply more as your body produces to demand, just drink more fluids and feed your son on demand. Expressing is far less efficient at encouraging milk production than your baby is. HV should know that babies aren't robots and they can't expect them to follow this 3 hour rule that they set for them. The only thing she might have helped you with is latch and back support, but even then I am sure if she had said it differently and been more supportive instead of critical that would have helped. I know the way my 11 month old latches is different to when she was little, as her mouth is so much bigger now I can be lazy about what position she goes on in maybe I've developed bad habits that I don't know about! PS having just pulled all the muscles in my back the other day from not feeding with adequate pillow support both behind me and under my large DD I recommend that piece of advice.

pps fore milk is more watery (to quench thirst) than hind milk so feeding on one side until they drop off or for a reasonable length of time then winding and offering other breast means they get more of the rich nutricious hind milk which fills them up for longer.

Ignore her!

You were happy doing it your way and you said baby was happy too. Therefore, what is wrong?

Get comfy, get baby comfy, get your boobs out and relax. You ARE experienced at this, you DO know what you are doing. You are a great mum, and your baby loves you.

Feeding on demand is what baby needs right now,and you are doing a grand job.

Blimey ! I have enough milk to feed a nursery of babies but if I tried to express after DD had had a monster feed I would be getting out diddly squat.

She sounds very ill informed

I had this in december when dd was born obviously as over xmas was couple days before a midwife (not mine) came - she then went on to tell me that I had clearly forgotton how to feed a newborn totally rearranged me so "baby's neck was in the right position" and gave me the 3 hours and refill gubbins. Like you bf ds till one year so had been fine thankyou. My midwife (thank god) came two days later sat on the floor with me (where i was cross legged feeding the baby and dismissed it all as total nonsense - said the midwife had read all the books but never actually breast fed a baby or worked particularly with that side of things and to feed baby however I liked .

I will stress she was not discrediting the midwife, saying the advice would be great to bear in mind for a new or unconfident mum, but said that bf is like riding a bike and you automatically slip into what works for you with subsequent children. I know this is purely anecdotal but your situation with the midwife was exactly the same as mine so thought it might help to share.

You are anything but a shit mum!! You have a happy, content, alert baby and this midwife sounds as if she's talking out of her arse. Keep doing what you're doing and don't give her another thought.

Deffo ignore her. All the advice I have read said not to express too soon as it could interfere with estabilshing your milk. I was told to offer both sides (maybe after wind/nappy), but not to worry if they don't take the seccond, but let them decide when to stop the first. Mine got to 2.5/3hr feeds at 5 weeks but that went tits up (excuse the pun) at the growth spurts. Length of time is a misnomer, every baby is wildly different. You could always find a local breastfeeding support/nct group/lll meeting for re-assurance. It always knocks you when a professional tells you the opposite of what you were completley confident about before hand (know it did me when GP told me NOT to feed off the breast with mastitis) so someone in RL to reassure should send you back to your happy place. A mum in my antenatel group baby lost alot of weight and it seemed to take 3weeks to return, no-one told her to worry too much as long as fed on demand

if you and the baby are happy and baby is feeding and alert, then bollocks to the midwife.
You've done it before, you know what you're doing.

Feeling so on your behalf. How did you keep your (free) hand from her face?
Please do not let this unsupportive dragon put you off what you're doing. If you still have concerns, see if there is a proper breastfeeding group in your neighbourhood you could attend.

Thanks guys, I did think so but she really knocked my confidence. I had a rough time with ds1 bfeeding and ended up switching to formula at 3 weeks as I didn't get any mw support. I loved feeding dd but felt I didn't get into my stride with it till about 3m. I joined MN when pg with dd and felt like I have learnt so much about breastmilk and breastfeeding from the likes of you all and tiktok, mears etc. So it really wasn't something I was worried about this time round, I was really looking forward to it. What with being readmitted and now this, it is really spoiling his first days and my time with dh and the 3 dcs.

I was 95% certain/happy that I was right, but there is a bit of me which was worrying abut failure to thrive and ds sleeping because he had no energy to do anything else Of course it helps enormously that I am a weepy hormonal mess atm anyway!

Sounds like you need to get rid of this midwife.
Also from what you said sounds like you're doing it all right.
Whenever I tried to express feed I got nothing out and ended up with a sore boob!
My baby went through a few growth spurts too, had me up ALL DAY just constantly feeding on the breast, I would change over from one breast to the other but only when I felt the other filling up! :P

Your darling baby sounds happy so do what you're doing. And well done for bf'ing!

Do keep us up to date with how you get on.

SPM, you'll be fine Believe in yourself, keep your fingers crossed that NHS cuts in your area mean that you get a different midwife at your door next time. Don't let this upset you, you've done fabulously so far. And if it is the same midwife either nod and smile or ask for her to write down the exact info on what you should be doing and then ask for her line managers direct phone number.

other than that exactly what sweetgrapes said.

Congratulations btw

Another vote for "your midwife is talking guff" here. Your breasts don't take two hours to refill fgs. How would she explain cluster feeding in the evenings then? I failed miserably in feeding DD (only lasted 6 wks) but managed to feed DS until he was 13 months - there is no "right" position or "right" latch if it's working, then it's working.

Off point, but I did see a lovely new Mum walking around Costco whilst feeding her tiny baby on Sunday. She defo wasn't in the "recommended position" but she looked fine to me! In fact I wanted to go over and tell her how well she was doing but she might have thought I was a complete nutcase so I just kept it to a broad grin!

Congrats on your baby btw. Any trouble out of that midwife again and I'd consider calling her line manager and putting in a complaint (and a suggestion that she attend an uptodate course on breastfeeding)!

Liked the advice KickArseQueen gave, good thinking, I would defo ask her to put it in writing, if she is reluctant you 'could' say "I wouldnt want to forget all the wonderful advice you're giving me would I?!"

oh my life when are health professionals going to be taught bfing basics!??!!!?? listening to tiktok and people on here much better!

you are obviously doing fine. feed the baby when the baby wants to be fed. my ds didn't have second side for a while. obviously you want the baby to get milk and last a little while between feeds - you want them to be satisfied having had a bellyfull, but you say your baby is alert, content, has had some sleep etc which sounds about right. from your experience with your other babies, you will know if something is wrong. 1.5/2 hours between feeds is fine as i am sure you know.

congratulations on your new baby .

3 hourly at 8 days.....this woman is mad!

You sound as if you're doing the right thing. If you can I would request another HV and report her poor poor advice.

Feed on demand, you don't have to offer both breasts every feed and make sure you're comfortable.

Don't let it spoil your time, you can't get it back. A week after dc4 and I came home my DH got demoted (illegal and long story!) and I let it ruin my time with my baby, thoroughly regret it now.

hardly dare post as I know almost nothing about feeding but with a jaundiced baby I would be extremely about any advice that you should REDUCE the number of feeds you give - surely the aim should be an absolute maximum of 3 hr between feeds, with the gold standard being much, much more?? Sounds like you're doing amazingly well.