Is Motherhood a form of oppression?

[pinkfizzle]

women.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/women/article7070165.ece

I don't think so - and I get a bit sick of breastfeeding is oppressive - blah blah blah...

oh and how convenient that the author has a big stake in publicis - so is incredibly wealthy - so I'm sure she is really concerned about the wage and wealth gap between men and women.

motherhood is a choice generally speaking people don't have to have babies, once you do some measure of compromise on ones freedom is to be expected, babies do need 24hr care after all and somebody has to do it

I actually think it's liberating.

It's a great life lesson not to put yourself first and also to watch your children develop and grow.
I love having children, it is the best thing I have ever done

I'm interested in the breastfeeding angle.

I know it was the formula companies and medical profession that plugged formula in the 50s but I'm wondering if part of the reason it was so popular later was because of the women's lib movement.

(and I do think not breastfeeding gives more freedom than breastfeeding).

I FF DS1 and I BF DS2 and I have to say (not because I have been brainwashed by Mumsnet) that I found I had far more freedom with Breast feeding.

I used to find washing/sterelizing/making the bottles the biggest chore on the planet. Also I used to get very stressed if I was out for the day as I was constantly worried if I had taken enough bottles etc out with me.

Moreover, how is it liberating having to earn a lot of cash to pay for formula or baby jars? Personally, I would rather spend the £20 saving on myself.

Ah, now, I had a baby who breastfed and breastfed and breastfed constantly until I switched to formula at 6 months.

It was honestly like the hallelujah chorus when I realised I could actually be apart from my child for longer than 15 minutes at a time.

Now, I've never formula fed a newborn so I guess the bottle washing and formula making is a bit more time consuming than it is when you start at 6 months.

HOwever, my babies breastfeeding sessions used to take hours. Even at 6 months.

But, I think if you have a baby who will breastfeed every few hours or so, and you are able to express (which I wasn't) then that may be more liberating.

Even so - if you are breastfeeding a newborn and establishing milk supply you are tied to it in a way that you aren't with a ff baby. Someone else can sterilise the bottles and make the milk - sheesh, if you're as rich as Jordan you can just buy those little glass bottles with the disposable teats and away you go!

oh I know what you mean bunnylicious but I kind of enjoyed the long sessions I used to lie down and watch movies and read books so I still enjoyed it. Also I think the bond with your baby means that your baby gives you a lot back too.

I guess I feel it is a lot more oppressive that women in many countries do not have equal access to education or are underpaid.

I loved breastfeeding. I found it easy and I loved just being able to whip a boob out and feed the babies.
I hate all this 'get your life back' crap as if the baby is trying to ruin your life.
Your life changes

"if you're as rich as Jordan you can just buy those little glass bottles with the disposable teats and away you go!"

You have a point there. Which kind of makes me think that motherhood on a normal salary is oppressive.

Money buys you freedom.

In ye olden days, before formula, rich women would use a wet nurse. Wet nursing was actually a comparatively well paid occupation and would often earn more than their husband.

I do agree that there's a lot of parents(note: of both sexes) that focus way too much on their children.

But singling out bf, feeding your kids homemade food etc as examples of slavery is beyond ridiculous. Bf is often less time-consuming than ff and wanting to see what actually goes in your kids' mouth is hardly excessively involved mothering.

I also find it strange that this self-proclaimed feminist is telling women that their choices are wrong. It's seems possible that many women have different attitudes and expectations of mothering.

As long as the mother is doing what she feels is right for her as well as for the children (ie does not force herself to bf if she really hates it, for example), then I don't see whose buisiness it is.

Lol at the woman shackled to a tobacco habit that writes a book about freedom

(and yes, she might be smoking because she wants to and not because the thought of going an hour without one fills her with anxiety but the stats would suggest it's unlikely).

Just what I thought, shonaspurtle! Hope she enjoys emphysema, heart disease and gangrene!

Another SHAG parent?? (Shoulda had a goldfish)
Yawn!

Totally agree with winnybella. As long as you do moterhood your way, why is it oppressive?

Motherhood is hard, you're looking after a tiny human who cannot do anything for itself. It's also the most wonderful experience I could ever imagine.

Of course it's important that mothers make sure they get time to themselves, a happy mother = a happy baby and all that, but who's to say the things she is saying will 'free' the mother, or make her happy? I can't breastfeed and have to formula feed, and it makes me really unhappy.

I wish someone would write a book that makes mothers feel good about what they're doing, there's too much out there that is negative about parenting or makes you feel guilty or inadequate. Give us a break!

So true - if you do motherhood on your own terms then it can not be oppressive.

I guess it all depends what is involved in 'getting your life back' doesn't it? Get your life back so you can go back to your life as an office drone, working for The Man? Or get your life back so you can enjoy your very comfortable life, no doubt funded at least in part by your daddy's nice wodge of cash? It basically seems like the SAHM/WOHM argument in poncy French philosophy clothes.

And having ff and bf, I definitely think that ff is more of a shackle than bf.

I never know why people go to extremes-it is much better to do what suits you and not then lecture people that it is best for everyone.

"This to the joy of men, who are able to sit back and watch the football, unconcerned by the offspring-mother battle."

so this is the problem really, NOT BFing, cloth nappies, fresh food.

I just can't imagine keeping a man who would leave all the parenting up to me just because I'm the mother. And this convinient to men nonsense "but he's so little, he needs his mum". Thankfully DH is just as involved with the children as am I (sometimes more as I'm a bit lazy) but I'm appalled every time that I hear such drivel, especially when it comes out of women's mouths.

So this whole "women's libaration" BS has nothing to do with the children, but maybe with the possibility that (huge assumption here) men in france don't pull their weight in the household.

Yes, I was wondering the same thing - I wonder if men in this country are a bit more hands-on than in France. We need Bonsoir's take on this...where is she?

I enjoyed breast feeding and it was fairly easy for me. But yes, it was a bit oppressive.

I think there must be a balance between this woman's philosophy and MN general consensus of never separate from baby/child... until they get kicked out at 16.

Can I stand in for Bonsoir? We have discussed this book on another thread (she's read it, I didn't want to waste money on it, but have heard Badinter peddling it on the radio).

French men are indeed far less hands on. Women struggle to juggle work, house and kids. Except those who have pots of cash.

And Badinter is feeling guilty because she was so busy fighting the feminist battles in the 60's and 70's that she neglected her kids, so this is her way of salving her conscience.

The book is a joke, because hardly any French women BF or practise any form of attachment style parenting: there is almost no support for BFing on maternity wards, and statutory maternity leave is so short (10 wks after birth) that mothers don't bother BFing. They are busy trying to get their babies 'ready' for life in a crèche.

Badinter is claiming that some awful American-British onslaught of BFing/motherhood oppression is hitting France. It's untrue. Sells books, though, and gets you talked about in the media, even abroad.

(That was a little succinct and slightly lacking in nuance, I know...)

Hi Franca!!
I had a daft question for you, will post on Little Italy later...

Ask away Auld!

I agree that men in Mediterranean countries are less hands on than men in the UK, and perhaps northern Europe.

Here in Italy there are small niches of hands on dads, to which I must say dh and the majority of my friends belong to... ...

I've read the book, and it is badly written and edited. It uses highly emotive language and makes vicious, personal attacks on those with opposing points of view. It's a selfish list of excuses for negligent mothering, as far as I am concerned.

Edwige Antier, the paediatrician mentioned in the article, is attacked by Badinter in the book several times. Edwige Antier's delightful grandson is in the same class as DD at school, and her daughter (ie a Mummy contemporary) is sharp-witted, maternal and charming - a much better model of French motherhood as far as I am concerned (even though it is not a complete cultural match for my own model of motherhood).

AuldAlliance- maternity leave in France is 16 weeks, not 10.

And even though bf rate is low, there's a lot of support on the maternity wards ie it's the official stance to encourage bf.

FWIW I see quite a lot of women bf in our park, not that that's a proof of anything.