Breastfeeding till the age of 4 - what do you think?

[lisalisa]

Message withdrawn

Hunker, I complained to JLP last week about a 'Congrats on yr new baby' card on sale, which was a photo of three massive feeding bottles full of milk (I doubt it was ebm).

The spotty lad I complained to looked bemused, to say the least, but after I explained three times, ('Whaaaat?? You can use tits for feeding babies??' kinda thing) he said he saw my POV. Will be going back to see if the cards are still on sale and also to get the name of the mfg and write to them (maybe with a suggestion that they also do cards with soggy breast pads for bfing mums..

It seems a pettifogging thing to complain about but I do think such things are part of the negative overall culture surrounding bfing.

I completely agree Suedonim. I don't think that baby dolls should come with bottles, although I am aware they can't come with breasts children are likely to use their imagination to feed them whichever way they see fit if there isn't a bottle sitting there perfectly fitting the dolls mouth.

I intend to buy my little girl a breastfeeding doll set when she's older although she's so enthusiastic about her breastmilk right now I imagine she'll soon be asking me to feed all her dolls and teddys anyway.

It is so lovely to meet other mothers who are doing the same things and feeling the same things that I am. Although I am lucky in having a few friends around me who intend feeding well into the second year and beyond, its still not easy when your family treat you like a freak. For me the reassurance I get from places like this that I'm not alone gives me the determination to continue.
I'm really glad I found this thread, I believe I found many more people here who are pro extended breastfeeding than against it and that feels great!

Hope you all had a great weekend!

Clare

I think we have to be careful though not to be as negative about bottle-feeders as some posters have been about extended breastfeeding. Tolerance has to work both ways, when all said and done.

While I agree that more could be done to promote breastfeeding as a choice, I think that complaining about bottle feeding being shown on cards is likely to be seen by bottle feeders as equally intolerant of the way they have chosen to feed their babies as some of the comments on this thread have been to extended breast feeders. Like it or not we have to accept that many babies are bottle fed, either through choice or circumstance, and to complain about it being shown on a new baby card only serves to make bottle feeding mums feel guilty about the choice that they have made.

I'm very pro-breastfeeding, but I'm also all for women doing what feels right for them, and I feel slightly uneasy at the thought that trying to promote positive images of breastfeeding should be done in such a way as to put bottle feeding in a totally negative light.

I'm in two minds as to whether to press post because I do agree that breastfeeding at any age should be shown as a positive and beneficial thing, but I also think that bottle feeders will only see this as more proof that breastfeeders look down at them ... oh, damn it, I'm pressing post - now hang me for it

roxswood, that's what my dd wanted me to do;bf her teddies...

thank you Wigwambam. Well done on pressing post!

Seudonim - I really dont see how complaining to the card manufacturer is going to do anything. A tad extreme IMO.

I understand why you complained sudonim. After all, who has ever seen a 'congratulations on you baby' card with a picture of a breastfeeding mum on it?

That's the real complaint surely?

But to the point that the existing card should be removed from sale? WTF?

No, perhaps not madmarchhare. But can you understand the frustration of some at the bottle being the only acceptable portrayal of breastfeeding? I believe suedonim's action was a reaction to this.

You're right though. A campaign to have both sorts of feeding portrayed would perhaps be more effective and fairer for all.

Some of the "you're having a baby brother/sister" type books that DS1 got before DS2 showed up, had bottles in them. I can understand some degree of squeamishness about showing bf in kid's books (well, not really, but I'm sure some parents are twitchy), so why not just leave that detail out? (Some did have breastfeeding, though.)

Oh, and I ended up looking at the "What to Expect First Year" book recently, and they advise stopping breastfeeding by a year. It stops being as good, apparently, and they need cow's milk. Those books annoy me more and more, the more I look at them.

Oh, I get annoyed by the baby feeding rooms with a bottle as the icon. But then, if they put a boob, presumably it would attract the wrong people?

I am very very jetlagged and tired, so please excuse any lack of sense.

I completely agree that women need to feel comfortable about how they feed their babies, whether they breastfeed for however long or bottlefeed.

I object to formula and bottlefeeding being advertised to the detriment of breastfeeding being seen as a normal thing to do. This is not to say that bottlefeeding should be seen as any way "abnormal", of course not. But I don't like the "congratulations, you've had a baby, here's a card with a picture of a bottle on it, a babygro with a picture of a bottle on it...and...what do you mean you're not feeding your baby with bottles?"

Breastfeeding is still seen as something that fortunate women are lucky enough to be able to do, not something that everyone can do, given the right support and information.

Look at all the women on here who have posted saying they've been given poor advice and no support breastfeeding. Look at the statistics that say that 80% (or is it 90%) of women who give up breastfeeding before they want to. Something is very wrong with this picture, don't you agree?

Do you really think that symbols on cards are tantamount to advertising? Because if they are then it doesn't work; most of the cards I had sent to me when dd was born had symbols of nappy pins on, and I hardly think that they would encourage people to think "Oh, look, a nappy pin; let's use cloth nappies!".

I've agreed wholeheartedly with you throughout this entire thread, hunker, but I'm afraid this is all just too militant for me. Poor advice on breastfeeding is something that clearly needs addressing, otherwise those statistics will stay worrying, but I can't agree that removing cards from shelves or complaining to the manufacturers is going to do anything to improve the situation.

I do understand spidermama, my responce was intended to be a 'whoa, hang on, dont go over the top here'.

WWB, I didn't say I had complained to manufacturers - wouldn't go that far! I was talking more about the advertising of follow-on milk, which only exists so that manufacturers can get round the ban on infant formula advertising and get their brand names out there.

But yes, I do think that these symbols are reminders that bottlefeeding is the norm in this country. I don't want to see breasts on cards or clothing though - a boob in a frame with a ribbon round it would be peculiar

Suedonim had complained though, she wanted the cards removed from the shelves and was going to complain to the manufacturers - that was what I was referring to. It seemed from your post that you were agreeing with this ... sorry, brains not in.

I honestly don't think that cards act as advertising - as I said, how many of us put our babies in cloth nappies just because we see nappy pins on "congratulations" cards? I honestly don't think people look at cards that way.

Well, we shall have to disagree then - for me, it's reinforcement of bottlefeeding being the norm and breastfeeding being something that, as the hospital GP said to me "you can do if you must"

If your hospital GP said that, hunkermunker, then your hospital GP was a prat of the highest order and deserves a smack.

There are lots of subtle messages about the acceptability of bottlefeeding and unacceptablility of brestfeeding, though.

In babyfeeding literature given out by American formula companies, the breastfeeding information is often accomapanied with photos of women clearly not wearing wedding rings, whereas the formula feeders were altogether more wholesome...obviously a different culture from here and that may not have been noticed in the UK, but it was believed to have a marketing edge in the USA.

He did - he also told me that "they bite, you know" (referring to older babies) - there's a thread on it somewhere! I told him about the WHO recommendations, very calmly (but wanted to smack him ). I think he took it on board, but he seemed v surprised!

Yes, had heard that before re American literature

For me, literature that is being given out by the formula manufacturers is a different kettle of bananas to greetings cards. I think that the subtle use of images such as those that Ameriscot refers to are a lot more sinister and much more cynical in their approach than congratulations cards, where it would be difficult to display images of breastfeeding that people would actually buy. That kind of marketing ploy does need addressing. I just can't see that the greetings card images work the same way.

I got the feeling in hospital/from m/w and g/p that they didnt go for broke in 'pushing' BF as not to worry or upset those who couldnt IYSWIM. There seemed to be equal amount of leaflets/posters on wall promoting both.

Blimey - you definitely didn't give birth at the hospital I did then MMH!

It amazes me how different individual hospitals are. Surely they should all be "singing from the same hymnsheet" so to speak?

There's a huge variation between hospitals. The hospital where I had dd was very into breastfeeding, the walls of both the ante-natal and maternity units were covered in pro-breastfeeding literature, they had an excellent bf counsellor, breast-feeding meetings and very clued-up widwives (shame about the paediatricians, but that's another story).

My friend gave birth three months before me, in a hospital in a different county, and the first visitor she had the day after she had her ds was a representative from a formula company, who gave her a stack of money-off vouchers and samples of follow-on milk. Part of his patter was to tell her that as a huge amount of women don't breastfeed after 6 weeks, she was welcome to use the vouchers for ordinary formula, although he did acknowledge when she pressed him that he wasn't meant to try and push anything other than follow-on milk.

Now that is nasty.