Told I ruined my BF chances at 8 days PP

[Copenhagener]

Hi all,

I’m desperately hoping someone can help me.

I gave birth last Monday via c-section. Baby struggled to breathe so I could not do skin to skin for a few hours while she was on a c-pap machine.

Tried to establish breastfeeding at the hospital for the next 3 days. She would not latch at all.

I asked if I could start pumping at the hospital to secure my supply on Wednesday evening. I managed to get a small flow going, which reassured me - but it was only 10-20ml per pumping. By this point we had to give formula because she’d lost 12% of her birthweight in 3 days.

Discharged Thursday with a warning about the weight loss, and gave her formula with some pumped milk - managed to get up to 100ml a pumping session so was feeling quite positive (pumping every 3 hours). I continued trying to get her to latch, but she couldn’t, even with help from a consultant and a health visitor. She has a high palate and a very recessed bottom lip.

On Saturday, baby was suddenly admitted to NICU because her breathing started to fail. I was in total distress and crying so much. I still carried on trying to pump every 3 hours, but my output immediately fell to 5ml every session. I was told it was because I’d gotten too stressed and my cortisol was too high to produce milk.

We were discharged today, and now I can’t even get 2ml a pumping session. I’ve been doing lots of skin-to-skin and trying to get her to latch still, with no success. I’m basically 98% formula feeding now. It’s horrible pumping and pumping and looking at an empty jar.

I spoke to a lactation consultant at the hospital, and she said I’ve lost my chance to breastfeed now and the window is closed as we’re at 8 days post partum and I should’ve been referred for help within 24 hours of her failing to feed. I did ask for help
but the nurses just kept trying to put her on my nipples the same way over and over again. I’m so angry at myself for getting so upset at the NICU that I ruined my supply by spiking my cortisol levels.

Has anyone else ever had this situation? Can I come back from this, or do I need to accept that I am destined for formula feeding now? I didn’t realise quite how small the window was - and trusted the nurses to help me: I’m so sad.

I'm so sorry your baby has been ill, OP. Of course you would be stressed and upset and its totally bonkers of them to suggest you are somehow at fault for that?! In fact, i feel very cross they have even suggested that to you!

I had a baby in NICU and we definitely went past the 8 day window as she wasnt even discharged for 2 weeks and it wasn't exactly a conducive environment for establishing breastfeeding. I managed to bf + formula top ups for around 7months. I never got to EBF but I was so pleased at being able to ensure she had any breast milk at all. And I never got more than 30ml from a pump, so the fact you got 100ml at the start sounds very promising. It might be worth seeking out a second opinion from another IBCLC? I have seen a couple of different ones over two pregnancies and definitely got better advice from one over others. Kellymom.com also has great resources - i will see if i can find some for you.

NICU is very stressful for mamas too - don't forget to look after yourself as well. In time, it might be worth thinking about some talking therapies to process everything (i did not and i regret it). 💐

My baby was in NICU and I had to pump for her to be tube fed for the first 3 weeks. Once she was big enough to latch and feed my supply increased quicksand I breastfed her until she weaned. I really don't think you're past the "window"

You’re baby breathing was failing. It would be worrying if you weren’t really distressed. You’ve had a really stressful time don’t put of reaching out for post natal support with your mental health.

You’ve done nothing wrong. It’s worth saying it again, you have done everything you needed to do for your child’s health. She recieved milk and medicial care as needed.

I couldn’t bf DD1 as I was very ill after birth (c section and spesis) and it wasn’t until I had DD2 with a much easier birth that I realised how much pressure I had put myself under with DD1.

Sorry for typos, I’m rushing but I wanted you to know this isn’t your fault. You’re being an excellent Mum.

Relactating is a thing and can be done months after last breastfeeding so the nurse is talking rubbish.

You can buy a supplemented device you put formula in and attach the long straw to your nipple, baby has both in her mouth and doesn't get frustrated as gets the formula but also stimulates breast milk too.

However, whilst 'breast is best', fed is better. Formula was invented for times like these and is a miracle that allows baby's to thrive who otherwise would not have done. By all means give the above a go but think carefully whether it's worth the stress and whether it will actually add a blot on your early motherhood to be worrying about it so much.

You poor thing. I've had problems breastfeeding 2 of mine, 1 couldn't at all and 2 had no problems once we got started. I know how awful it can be when you try, ask for help etc but it just doesn't happen. Breastfeeding can be hard as it requires skill from you and the baby and you also need support as well. I can't remember what it was called big I know people who have had success with a device that is like a bottle containing formula or pumped milk that you hang round your neck and there is a tube attached to it that you tape to your breast. The baby sucks on your breast to stimulate your supply but they are still getting milk from the bottle/tube thing at the same time. It may not work if she can't latch at all though.

Thank you everyone for your comments. It was really reassuring to hear from other women who’ve experienced similar situations.

Since I got home I’ve managed to calm down a little, sleep, and eat, and managed to get around 20ml per pumping session overnight, so baby got a full bottle of breast milk this morning. I’m cautiously hopeful my supply might not be finished after all. And I am 100% okay with formula feeding - it just wasn’t what I had envisioned.

Taking the advice here, I’ll book an appointment with another feeding consultant asap to see if they can help me further - preferably one who has more experience with pumping (not a common feeding method where I am at all).

If you keep pumping until after you think you've got everything, you'll often get a second let down, and that's what increases the supply x

I’d also add i get almost nothing from a home grade pump but when baby was in nicu and I had a medical grade one I was getting 150ml+ (I was feeding my three year old as well!)
Do they have facility to lend you one or could you borrow something somewhere? Trying different pumps if possible

Sorry to hear you're struggling. My DS2 could hardly latch at all due to bad tongue tie so I established/maintained my supply by pumping until we could get the tongue tie sorted. If this is the route you want to try then I'd highly recommend getting hold of a hospital grade double pump for the short term. If your hospital can't lend you one then they are available for hire https://www.medela-rental.co.uk/shop/symphony-double-breastpump-hire

Try to pump regularly if possible, even for just short sessions, and if you can fit in one power pumping session a day then brilliant (https://www.alderhey.nhs.uk/wp-content/uploads/2023/06/Power-Pumping-Breastfeeding-Leaflet-PIAG-341.pdf)

Again, this is just info for if you want to go down this route. It is bloody hard work and there's no shame if you decide it's not for you. You have to look at the whole picture of how you and your baby are getting on and make the decision that suits your circumstances.

That's absolutely rubbish. 8 days is nothing. Mothers can start relactation after months of not feeding.

Remember that milk let down is a hormonal response so feeling frustrated can prevent it. Try watching your baby or videos of your baby whilst pumping to get the hormones going. Also I would be attempting more than every 3hrs to increase supply. My newborn fed every hour to establish supply, so I'd be attempting pumping every 2- short sessions rather than long ones. Some women also do much better with manual pumps rather than big electrical ones.

With her high palate and recessed lip I'd try to find different positions to help her latch- maybe reclined so gravity can help her stay on, that helped mine who was tongue tied with a high palate. It can be tricky when they are tiny and you are newly post partum but if you have a Google there are a lot of different positions.

Sorry you're having such a rubbish time. If you've got the money then I'd try and contact a private lactation consultant, a lot of them will come to your home.

Almost exact situation here with same age baby and addition of 4 days of phototherapy for jaundice at home. Absolutely everything that could interrupt the feeding getting started has, including tongue tie. At the end of the day the balance is always between you, your baby, your time and health.

It’s fine to give it your best shot and say on balance your health and time is most important, that’s fine.

@lollylo I am so sorry to hear you’ve also been having difficulties with feeding too and faced similar challenges in your first weeks. It’s really sucky.

What ended up being your way forward? We went back to the hospital for a weigh in today, and she had lost 7 grams since Monday taking her weight loss to 11%, so they’ve given her extra-fattening formula. Big improvement on her losing 10% in the first 4 days, so I’ll take the small victories and hope the special formula works its magic soon. I’m still pumping (for now) as I can make 1 or 2 smaller bottles a day, but I may end up giving that up after the end of her first month, depending on if my supply kicks in or not.

I had trouble establishing a supply after a c-section.

The lactation consultant I had got the OB to prescribe prolactin for me. That stimulates milk production. This was in the US though so I'm not sure about the UK. I was not producing anything at all after a week post birth, but the prolactin got my milk going.

You really can’t blame yourself for being anxious about your newborn baby being admitted to hospital. You wouldn’t be human if you didn’t feel that way.

is it possible for you to get a second opinion?

In my admittedly limited experience you're not past the "window". In the immediate term I would try to find a better IBCLC consultant - they can make a world of difference, if you happen to live in north west outer London I can recommend. I would also rent a Medela hospital grade pump today so it's with you by Friday, and basically pump very regularly (2 hours) including overnight, trying to top up with a feeding cup and skin to skin etc after attempting from the breast.

These are things we used to establish EBF post emergency C-section when we weren't discharged from hospital for a week due to high weight loss, but not NICU. It's important to remember though that the priority is baby being fed and loved - if they aren't fed they are less likely to be alert enough to try to feed, formula is vital here when you're still trying to establish a good supply by pumping. It took us around 3 or 4 weeks to manage to go EBF and formula was a vital component of that, as well as a good pump and a good consultant. Remember too that if it doesn't work out, that's OK as well.

@Copenhagener

I couldn't breastfeed at first and gave formula after a few days I tried again and in the end fed until they were 2.5. Bodies can be forgiving and amazing. However it turns out I wish you good luck.

It was at least 10 days before I tried again.

So sorry you've been through this OP. My baby was in NICU for 3 weeks, we were separated to different hospitals at first and she was in an induced coma so I couldn't even pick her up. All that's to say I managed to BF her by continuing to pump every 3 hours, so like others said I really don't think you're past the window. If you want to carry on then I'd continue pumping and maybe look into a private latch consultant as it doesn't sound like you've got it easy with the high pallet etc. so sorry you're being told it's because you were stressed. How could they expect a mother not to be stressed in your situation. Big hugs

A very similar situation here. Nonsense that you have missed your chance.

What is in the pump doesn't reflect your supply. Even for subsequent pregnancies where I EBF no problem, I never got more that 30ml, but usually much less.

You need to decide if it is important to you (and it's ok if it isn't, fed is best). If so then put her on the breast and pump after whilst she has formula. Make sure you pump/ feed a couple of times between midnight and the morning- the hormones then set up your supply. Feed at meast every 3 hours for a few weeks (its so hard I know) Look after yourself- eat and drink and relax when you get a window. Have some cake.

You may find a manual pump more effective at first until you kind of understand how/ where to apply pressure and things. In the early days I got far more milk with a manual pump than electric.

It did take me a few months to get back to exclusively formula (by which point we were starting solids!), but i did gradually manage to reduce the formula needed. It was hard work and in hindsight the sense of failure really affected my mental health. But is is definitely possible (and after a c section it's not unusual for milk to take a week to arrive anyway.). Lots of skin to skin if you can too.

But please- be forgiving to yourself if you struggle. DD is 11 now and no one ever asks what she was fed.

Absolute rubbish from the lactation consultant & I'm sorry you've been told this. I started bf baby at 5 weeks, after formula & pumping once daily only for first 5 weeks of babies life. Baby is now 7 weeks and I'm doing a combo of bf and formula as I don't want baby to lose weight as I wait for supply to increase again

Please do not let your anxiety over breastfeeding take all the joy out of having your baby. She’s had the colostrum - that is a real achievement. You weren't unable to bf. - she was. So by giving g her formula you saved her, just as you saved her by rushing her to hospital when her breathing started to fail.

I had two babies with a high arched palates, and kept going with just a pump for 4 and 2 months respectively, until bf was established. It was hard. I had a medical grade pump (rented) and medical grade scales (rented) so I could weigh before and after each feed (don’t change nsppy between) to see how much they were getting.

nipple shields made the difference - they allowed my babies to latch. Please do try them intermittently

good Luck, but at the end of the day, better your baby is fed and has a relaxed mum, not a stressed and unhappy one. If that means ditching bf, so be it.

Try to find someone who can give you breast massages every day until your milk supply is developed. I then switched to a weekly appointment and it saved my breastfeeding journey

I’m so sorry you’ve been given such rubbish advice by a so called lactation consultant, you’ve absolutely not missed your window to establish breastfeeding so please don’t worry.

As others have mentioned, the amount you’re able to pump is no reflection on your supply. I’d second hiring a hospital grade pump like the medela symphony if you’re able to. This made a huge difference to my pumping journey when I was trying to transition back from combi feeding to ebf.

Do you have any breastfeeding support groups nearby? If you can get to one I’d strongly recommend it. I had a horrible start to my breastfeeding journey with DD and genuinely didn’t think I’d even manage to continue for the rest of the day, but with my local group’s support I’m still feeding her as a nearly 2yo. Not only was their advice and support invaluable, but just being able to sit with tea and cake and chat to others in the same boat really helped me feel less alone in my struggles.

This happened to me. First baby.. I had no idea about this 'window' either. I didn't understand the importance of cluster feeding to increase supply. When I got a home visit from midwife and told her the milk wasn't coming as it should, she said "the NHS are struggling and have failed you". It will never leave me.
I didn't say anything back to her but looking back now I wish I'd asked her to leave my home straight away. I wanted to BF so badly. Sadly it didn't happen