why dont younger mums breas feed

[codswallop]

on the whole?
18 year ikd nighbour has just had a baby !) musch to her parents horror.. and isnt even trying to b feeed.
why is this?

I'll make it 501 messages and say, give us more support. INCLUDE teen mums in the normal ante natal classes, don't seperate us, give us leaflets on it - don't expect us to just formula feed. STOP being ageist. Introduce us to lactation counsillors or just tell us that breastfeeding groups DO exist and that there ARE people to support us. The system is severely lacking. I know this is a choice, and no one's harming their baby in any way. But at least give us the relevant materials to make an educated decision. We don't need a higher education to learn about breastfeeding or to get over any fears of baring ourselves, we don't need the added wisdom that comes with age - we need more support.

Also, imagine being your typical teen mum - immature boyfriend who doesn't understand? Or maybe he's left you.. everyone's expecting you to be a not-quite-adequate mother, you're alone, you're scared, you weren't sure you wanted this baby in the first place bu you bravely stuck with it, you're maybe still grasping at an education... breastfeeding is HARD work by itself for most people.

I'm leaving this thread alone now!

I tell you what, fastasleep- you are a shining gem on this thread. Your posts have stood out as really wise and well-thought out amongst all the bickering. Thanks for sharing your experiences and wisdom.

well done fastasleep. that makes sense. i always wondered why young mums were seperated from older mums etc. surely older mums and even the 1st timers who are older could share some gems with us.

Hi fastasleep. At my antenatal class there was a teen mum and I remember thinking how brave she was. Her partner was with her every week and often us other mums-to-be went on there own. I think more support is needed too and more educating people. For example why do so many people think breast feeding means being tied to the sofa/a lot more work etec etc. I personally found sterilsing the bottles a lot more work and much less convenient when going out. And it is possible to b/feed discreetly in public - as someone said it doesn't mean getting your baps out to all and sundry

WOW fastasleep, what a post!!

Well said and you sound like a great mum and very wise!+

Fastasleep. A very interesting post. When I had dd years ago they younger mums could come to the 'ordinary' antinatal classes. However many of them didn't like them, probably since they were full of old mums like me

The MW set up separate classes so that younger mums would feel more at home, with people of their own age.

We did have one younger mum in with our class and she was 17-18. The younger mums group was held in the youth centre as it was seen as more approachable.

I'd be interested to know if that approach worked, or if it alianated even more mums.

i never realised that young mums didn't go to the "normal" antenatal classes but were shunted off into separate ones.

we had a midwife who dealt with teenage pregnancies only, and somehow she got my details from the hospital, rang me up and asked me if i wanted to go to the teenage ante natal classes. they even had a mini bus picking us all up

that would make me feel wierd tammybear. did you find that it made you feelcut off from other mums?

slightly. when i went to baby clinic every week to get dd weighed, all the new mums knew each other as they had gone to the ante natal classes. but i did feel better knowing i had other people my age in the same situation, not that i have spoken to any of them in ages. there was a post natal class as well but i didnt like that.

as they had gone to the ante natal classes at the GP that should have been

I wish they had classes for people inbetween teenagers and older married couples. I felt so out of place at mine, and I look really young so they probably all thought I was a teenager anyway.

i never went in for all the coffee mornings/post natal groups etc, as i am not that good at socialising. did go to a young mums group once at my old old house, but i found some of the people too rough and ready for my taste (16-24 group). too much swearing and smoking outside.

i didnt really like the other teenage mums. most smoked, and some werent too nice.

Gobbledigook and Luckymum, thanks for your answers and apologies for not replying sooner. Was at work (and they expect me to do some rather than post here. Pah.) Really interesting replies, thank you.
Luckymum, that's really sad. I was very, very lucky to have great support. Couldn't have continued without it (and without the motivation of dh's appalling asthma and eczema). So angry that it isn't available to everyone.

I have conducted myself on mn in a manner courteous to others. I have always reponded with respect for the others opinion. This has not been the case towards me by some other mumsnetters on this thread. You might not agree with my opinion the bf is the best for infants but that's life. I might not always agree with your opinion & thats life also. I was very much taken aback by gobbledigooks post 9:28:40 am 15/11/04

Firstly here's the answer to your question gdgook: -
Your question:"I'd like to know how many babies have died as a result of bottle feeding instead of breastfeeding!!!!!"
The answer - "1.5 million babies died from unsafe bottlefeeding in 1998 (1)References to "The Facts"(1) W.H.O./UNICEF Estimates, 1996"
source:www.breastfeeding.com/advocate.html

You say that I "have no right to come on here...." This is a strong statement to make. My views don't have to be your views. What I like about mn is that I can see the whole spectrum of opinion and I have learnt alot from this. It is my opinion that people with views different to my own post here and we can respect and discuss each others beliefs.

Also the post of blossomhill at 9:55 15/11 saying "There were 2 people that were being particularly nasty, pathetic and childish. I cannot believe that people can be so judgemental." This is also aggressive against me and my opinion.

Can I ask for some respect towards others on mn???

eefs i have never been aggressive in my life, only defensive. cardigan, i respect you because you did support me when i was at my lowest. i am tired of all this and want to change the record.

Nailpolish - thanks for your words I hope all is going well for you. Mn is like a friend to me and I don't want cross words either. I feel here we should all agree to disagree & get over it.

Cardigan,

You were perhaps as taken aback by my comments as I was by yours.

That statistic needs to be put into some context - is that 1.5 million babies worldwide? How many of them are in the UK and what actually caused the death? What is 'unsafe' bottle feeding? Using dirty water or lack of hygeine with regard to washing bottles etc? The paper comes from WHO/UNICEF so I suspect many of those babies are from 3rd world countries. While that doesn't make it better it does clarify that it is not formula milk 'per se' that has caused death but the way in which it has been prepared and that's a very different thing. Posting stats like that out of context is frightening some women on here unnecessarily so it is wholly irresponsible imo. Tell you what, lets do a poll of all the MNetters and see how many have heard of a baby who died from being formula fed.

Your second point also lacks context - I didn't say 'you have no right to come on here' full stop - I said you have no right to come on here and berate and frighten people about the choices they've made when I'm sure you know damn well that they love their children as much as you do and have not actually done them any harm whatsoever.

There are lots of decisions that posters on here have made that I don't understand or agree with but I don't go posting potentially frightening statistics or comparing them to driving with out carseats/seatbelts which is frankly ridiculous.

Some formula feeders need a good dose of oxytocin here!!
All sources of info referenced so other mnetters can check then if they want to. Don't agree with your poll - but thats my opinion. I express it in respectful language.

GdiG, I think you are right to question the relevance of the WHO statistic to UK mothers. The majority (though not all) of those 'bottle deaths' are from enteritis, basically, diarrhoea, and this comes from not just the dirty water, but from the fact that formula does not contain antibodies which protect against infection. Babies and toddlers do not die of enteritis/diarrhoea/dehydration in the UK - formula fed babies have more gastro-enteric infections than breastfed babies ( many studies confirm this) but of course they are treated quickly and efficiently when needed.

However, a study was done in the USA to see if formula feeding caused excess infant mortality in a developed country, and they found that it did.

You can find the newspaper report from the Washington Post on this study here .

I don't want anyone to be anxious about this or feel criticised - this is for information only, which was asked for. The researchers don't know all the answers, though protection against infection is certainly one, but one of the possible reasons they give for the comparative safety of being breastfed is that they think breastfed babies may be physically closer to their mothers more of the time, and are therefore less likely to have an accident. So it is certainly not direct cause and effect in all cases.

Occasionally, babies in the developed world do die directly from a contaminated batch of formula - there was a case in Bedlgium a couple of years ago, and recently, some babies in Israel died because their formula was missing a vital enzyme because of a manufacturing fault.

This is not to frighten anyone. I don't know of any contaminated batch of formula in the UK that has led to infant death or illness.

Thanks tiktok.

However the study you provided a link for tells us nothing except they found a correlation between breastfeeding and lower mortality but since they have no explanation for it, you might as well correlate it to anything!

I don't buy the hypotheses that breastfed children may have less fatal accidents because they are closer to their mother either (but at least it's not telling us it's because there's something wrong with formula!!!). I don't bottle feed my baby at arms length! My baby is in practically the same position and proximity to me as if I was breast feeding and for the same amount of time.

That argument is just silly and I could just as easily say that my children, although bottle fed, are less likely to have a fatal accident because they don't go to nursery - I look after them 24/7 so they are in closer proximity to their mother than babies sent to daycare and also have a better 'staff' to child ratio!!!

I'm not saying this is true of course, but you see the analogy?

"There is also a possibility that women who breastfeed their babies simply tend to spend more time near their children, protecting them from fatal accidents, Rogan said.

"It may be something as simple as physical proximity. Breastfed kids are closer to mom," said Rogan"

call me contentious but thats Bollocks!

whilst studies do have their uses they are also very conflicting - take HRT - first of all "it protects against heart disease and osteoporosis" then 'sorry we made a mistake - it actually increases your chances of a heart attack' and now "actually yes it does protect your heart" - give me a break!

Joolstoo - I totally agree with everything you say. I think your posts are spot on.

I breastfed for 2 weeks and the rest of the time I bottlefed. I am completly mad about my ds safety - if anything too much and too over protective - so I find the claim that my ds is more likely to have an accident the biggest load of crap I have ever heard. what a load of rubbish

Bfeeding definately more dangerous. It makes you drowsy. in early days my mum had to hold onto dd so I didn't fall asleep and drop her.