how as a nation/society can we normalise bf

[robinredbreast]

these boards really make for sad reading,esp all the ill informed advice thats been posted in the last few days from hv gp etc

how are we going to improve things for us and future generations?

what are your ideas?

("They" being midwives and hvs)

I had my db in a private wing (will I have to change my name after admitting that ?) and stayed for two nights after the birth, had a midwife or nurse who came to help me with breastfeeding whenever I buzzed (at least 5 or 6 times during my stay), and had my dh there to help and encourage me. I had a difficult time at first but eventually got the hang of it. I left the hospital feeling confident that once I got home I'd be able to feed my baby. I feel very lucky to have had this precious time with my baby.

Hearing other people's stories about being on crowded wards without much help from the medical staff, I wonder if in the same situation I would have been able to get off to the successful start that I did. I honestly don't think I would have and I'm someone that has always just assumed that I would breastfeed when the time came. (Although I stopped at 2 mos)

So "normalization" is an issue, but I think that there are many pieces to solving this puzzle. Better immediate post-natal care for all women, not just those who can and choose to pay for it, is definitely one of them.

Absolutely, bookthief. In this context I'm thinking of the gynae/obs who told me at 20ish weeks with ds2 that I'd better wean ds1 before the birth as otherwise ds2 wouldn't get colostrum A not necessarily unreasonable supposition for a layperson, but not for an obstetrician! I said I was sure that wasn't right and asked her where she got that from. She had 'looked it up' . I wish she'd felt able to admit she didn't know much about the area. (I did not wean him, btw, and am 7 weeks into tandem feeding now ).

berolina
every single midwife I saw told me I couldn't possibly tandem feed and that I must stop.
with dd2 I never saw a HV - never got her weighed, never went to the clinic. I just couldn't be arsed wtih the stress I had with dd1, how much I was nagged about her weight gain, that I should top up etc.
It really blighted my first ffew weeks of motherhood tbh.

i think the turnaround in the uk will be incredibly slow because it's at least partly generational; i also had loving mum, MIL, aunts, giving me effectively anti-bf propaganda for WEEKS. I would target grandmothers-to-be, myself. I did rant on about this to Jane FW on the Good Granny questionnaire but I note that none of my comments on that made it to the final version!

the most pro-bf in my family was one aunt who regaled me with endless tales of horrendous mastitis - 'weeping sores' 'consultant begged me to stop' 'agony' which was frankly less than helpful

the constant, constant message otherwise was 'you haven't got enough milk, ds is suffering, you're exhausted, all because you are breastfeeding'

it still makes me so furious to think about; but they thought they were helping me, because of the messages they got when they had children in the 60s.

i come from a non bf family and was worried how they woudl support me. have to say - they were fantastic about it - really supportive thrugh teh early days to now. even when i was weeping in casualty with abcesses - they never suggested i give it up. i think it has brought us closer if anything an di know that mum is proud of me for bf. even my wee sis who saw me through teh dark days has said that it has made her want to bf if/ when she has a wee one. i think when i t comes to it - the power of family and community is huge.

lol - momma!

i agree - there is still alot to be said for the how family / community can support or undermine a womans desire to bf. i was using my own expereince to show that even in a family where bf is not the tradition - there can be support. If i had not had this - it would not necessarily meant i woudl have stopped but it certainly made difficult days easier.

Even in a family who are supportive though, the myths can scupper you. My mum and her mum both bf - and have been an invaluable support to me, don't get me wrong - but some of the advice they gave to me re: spacing feeds, giving water to discourage night feeding (god, my mum was obsessed with this) only feeding for a maximum length of time...

I dunno, it's hard. I found it hard and I had first class moral support from family & dh, first class support from knowledgeable breastfeeding counsellors, excellent community midwife...friends a bit more mixed, hospital midwives a bit too busy to really help and gp and hv were fairly clueless (but fully admitted this).

Anyway, I can't help thinking that if some of that support had been missing I'd have given up. Most of my friends did and it was because of misinformation and lack of support.

You're right tiktok, I am reacting to attitudes I have encountered on mn rather than in the wider world (note to self: remember mn is not the whole world.) My beef, in the end is quite specific to my own situation, in that I did cave in and give dd formula in the early days, and most of the information I read warned against this without any constructive advice as to what to do if you already had--it's already been mentioned on the thread that when you choose the bf route there isn't really any acknowledgement of any situation that lies outside the recommended exclusive bf.

I had another thought though, which is that bf education could be tacked on to sex ed in schools, and hopefully spread some positive information before all the mythology sets in. It would also mean boys learning about it, which might translate into partner support later on.

I'd second choosy on the family side, my mum is on a campaign to stop me bfing, thinking all my problems like lack of sleep etc are due to bfing. She constantly undermines my efforts and makes me feel like I cannot possibly feed DD myself, all because she 'cares'.

Also what about support and info for partners. My DH has veered between being v supportive of bfing to telling me it dominated our lives and wanting me to stop, and now back again. He does feel a certain lack of control, not any of this 'cannot bong with his daughter' rubbish, but when I am clearly exhausted/trying to cook dinner/sleeping and DD wants to be fed he has to bring her to me to take over. I know he has felt bad that there have been times when he couldn't pacify her himself as all she wanted was feeding.

Maybe the HVs/MWs/antenatal groups should spend some time on the impact on the partner and how to manage the affect bfing has on your relationship, how partners can be a valuable help and ways to stop them feeling sidelined in the first few months.

My mum said something completely unhelpful in the early days when I had latching problems - "maybe he would be happier being
bottle fed" - I found this very demoralising. I think partly she said this because she hated bf and only did it because they couldn't afford formula. By the time my younger sister (her 3rd) came along she didn't even consider bf. She has also been a childminder for over 20 years and has bottle fed babies as young as 8 weeks so it is very normal to her to ff a baby.

I agree with the other posters who have suggested that people just don't care about how babies are fed. This is probably because there is such a good alternative (yes I know it's no where near as good as bm). My dh couldn't have cared less when I switched to ff after 10 days due to constant pain, in fact he's the one who suggested I gave up. If he'd have been more encouraging of bf then I may have carried on but it was far too tempting and, you always get told that so-and-so was ff and there's nothing wrong with them. Dh is not going to be happy when I tell him that I intend to try bf with baby number 3 and his lack of support will make things very difficult.

I wonder what midwives say to mothers-to-be when they say they are going to ff. Is it just a tick in the box for the statistics or do they try to encourage bf? Both times when I said I would bf nothing more was mentioned throughout the rest of the pg and it was hardly mentioned in ante-natal classes, let alone discussed. One thing I personally found unhelpful was all I was ever told when pg about bf was the pros like it's best for baby and it will help you lose weight - and was given no other info. When I was pg with my first baby I didn't even consider ff. What would help is a full ante-natal class dedicated to bf (and not just for first time mums). It should discuss the difficulties in the early days and where to get help, and not just from mw and hv. No one ever tells you it's going to hurt but will get better. What people need is honesty and practical advice, not just saying that it's best for baby. I guess they just don't want to put people off.

I think there is so much promotion out there about all the problems that can go wrong so we can be "prepared" but all I found it did was cause stress and that you almost feel like there is an expectation that it will be hard and difficult etc etc which I thik largely perpetuates the problem. I just keep reminding myself that we are designed to do it and IF I have a problem I'll deal with it then. Turns out no problems and still BFing at 11mths and loving it! So my only advice to new mums is just relax it's not all hard and often the most beautiful thing in the world!No intention to offend people who do have trouble though and each to their own. PS thanks I never releasied how many images of bottles we were faced with - good point!