I feel like I've failed my baby

[addler]

DS is three days old, born via c section. We were in the hospital for two nights as I had pre eclampsia.

He was a big boy when born, 4kg and had gorgeously chubby cheeks. In the hospital several midwives and a feeding specialist all watched him feed and said his latch was perfect, positioning great, no tongue tie, and they couldn't give any more advice as everything looked perfect and that it looked like I had done it before. I was so pleased and felt so confident.

Since being home he's been cluster feeding and constantly sucking his hands, even if he's just finished a feed. I've been feeding on demand and knew this was normal to try and boost my supply so wasn't worried, or worried that he wouldn't sleep unless on me or DP.

The midwife came today and weighed him. He's lost 11.9% of his birthweight, 500g, in three days. She said he needs 25mls at least topped up after every breast feed. My milk hasn't come in yet so DP went to buy formula. He downed the 25mls so I gave him some more as she instructed and he had 40mls in total. He then went into his Moses basket and lay there happily for 20 minutes, never once sucking on his hands. Then he slept for 2 1/2 hours in there. I've never seen him so content.

So my beautiful baby, who I thought was just a champion greedy chunk who loved milk and was cluster feeding was never getting enough from me. I've been starving him. And I didn't even know. I've been looking at pictures from today and from when he was first born and he looks like a different baby. Every time I look at him now I'm overcome with guilt and shame. I was so pleased with how things were going and was saying to anyone who asked that it was going great, and all along I was starving him.

Throughout my pregnancy I was so worried I wouldn't be able to breastfeed, I've long thought I had tubular breasts and when I was researching breastfeeding I read that having them can cause supply issues and not being able to breastfeed. I was very upset as breastfeeding was something that was really important to me for a lot of different reasons, and I felt like once again my body was failing me and I hated it, I thought that if I could feed my baby and do the one thing no one else could then it might help repair the relationship I have with my body by doing something good and positive and something my baby needed from me.

I saw a lactation consultant to ask for help antenatally and she showed me how to express colostrum, and said she would make me a feeding plan to start from birth but then never did and said she didn't think I would have an issue as I could get some colostrum and didn't think my breasts looked extremely tubular. Although I think it's deceiving because I'm overweight so a lot of what looks like breast tissue is fat tissue.

All along I've been so concerned and asked for help and everyone has said don't be silly of course, you'll make all the milk you'll need, nearly everyone can breastfeed, but I was right after all, I can't do it. I knew I wouldn't be able to.

I am 100% behind anyone's decision on how they feed their baby. I didn't need people telling me I could just formula feed and my baby would be fine. I know he would be. But to not have that choice to begin with, to have that choice taken away from me because my stupid horrible body has something that's referred to as a deformity, and is a part of my body that I've always hated for looking the way it does and is just another thing that makes me feel like less of an attractive and desirable and normal woman, it's heart breaking.

Just now I tried to express some more colostrum as was suggested, but it's much thinner than before and squirted a little so I'm now worried that actually my milk has come in but this is all it is- such a small pathetic amount that I didn't even realise it had come in.

I can't stop crying since the midwife left. She said they'll come back tomorrow to check on DS to make sure he's not getting sick, and they'll come back on Monday to weigh him and if it hasn't improved he'll need to be admitted to hospital.

I know this is long and stupid and full of self pity. I just can't stop the thoughts and feelings over what I've done to my son and what I can't do for him. I don't know why I'm posting, I just needed to tell someone.

You love your baby enough to want the best for him, you're a good Mum. Please don't be hard on yourself, no one is a perfect parent, we all just do the best we can at the time. Congratulations on your beautiful baby OP.

Oh please don't feel this way lovely.
It is normal for babies to drop birth weight then re gain.
I couldn't breastfeed at all. I had no milk what so ever.
You've done what is best for your child. You weren't to know. The good thing is now you know and you're doing what you're supposed to do.
Your body hasn't failed you and you certainly haven't failed your baby.

Sorry forgot to add, if he is still asleep now I probably would get him checked just for reassurance. I'm a worrier and would need the reassurance x

I think it’s normal to sleep a lot at 3 days but do wake him every 3 hours for feeds. If he won’t wake easily then get him checked over.
Also it is completely your choice whether to BF or formula feed but this period is really crucial for building your milk supply so if you do want to continue BFing then make sure you pump every time you give formula. So if you’re pumping anyway you may as well give him the expressed milk rather than formula. If you don’t pump then your supply won’t increase and it will be a vicious circle.
You are doing really well and obviously haven’t failed him at all.

Congratulations, what a gorgeous baby!

I had similar with my first after a traumatic c section birth. I mix fed, pumped and expressed and by 8 weeks was exclusively BF. However you feed him is fine as long as he gets fed! Try not to worry or judge yourself (I know this is hard).

All these positive stories are really helping me to feel more hopeful, thank you. I woke DS for his feed at three hours and he woke up fine after I undressed him, which he always hates. We had skin to skin while I watched Netflix which was lovely and he was alert for that so I feel reassured at least in that department.

I don't know what to do with offering the breast now. The midwife said to give him a top up after every breastfeed but until she came I was feeding him whenever he was showing cues, normally a few times an hour and sometimes he would fall asleep on there but suck every now and then so I would just leave him as I thought having him on would be good to try and get my milk coming in. But if I give him formula after every one of those times he'll never be able to have room for breast milk would he?

This is what he looked like at birth compared to tonight.
He just looked so round and full and now he looks so different.

Don’t compare how he looks, he will have been so puffy after birth; my DD looked like a different baby a few days later and she only dropped 8%.

You can top up but don’t use formula if you want to be able to keep breastfeeding, or if you do then you also need to pump (so as I said you may as well give the expressed breastmilk). If you just top up with formula then your boobs won’t get as much stimulation and your supply will never be enough for him. Look online at stuff about ‘the top up traps’.

I know it’s tough, I expressed for a whole year for DD! But you have to protect your supply if you want to be able to BF longer term. No problem giving bottle top ups if that’s what’s been advised but pump pump pump!

When I pump I only get a few drops of the (now thin) colostrum/milk. Nothing else comes yet. Would it be better to keep using the pump even if nothing is coming out or put him to the breast more often instead?

Keep pumping and try and use that for top ups. I did use forma too for about 2 weeks but gradually reduced the amount as I managed to pump more and eventually went fully BF.

2 ebf babies here, expecting no3 in march.

It's totally normal for a baby to lose 10% in the first 3 days. Both of mine did but I was lucky and had a midwife who knew what she was talking about re bf.

Consider joining a LLL Facebook group and a local feeding group if you can.

Its very hard being a first time mum: there's loads of stuff some midwives/hv's will come out with and coming up to dc3 I just ignore them (like being told Ds2 was underweight because the HV couldn't read a graph correctly- I teach maths and wasn't expecting to have to teach that at an appointment. I wonder to this day how many women she'd panicked due to incompetence/ lack of training)

Do both! Not everyone can pump much. Or sometimes it means that the pump isn’t fitting you that well, it sometimes takes a while to get the hang.

Here is some info on top ups: loveandbreastmilk.com/wp/top-ups/

Agree with doing both. Also pump one side while he's feeding on the other. I needed my husband to help here with the logistics! The hakka style silicone pumps are good for catching milk on the other boob.

Just jumping on to say do not compare a just born baby with a 3 day old baby. A just born baby will look really chunky as they've been swimming in amniotic fluid for 9 months.

I had this with my dd who was also an emcs baby, I think you have to just keep going and keep offering breast as much as possible, you do get to a point where you sort of sense they're not needing the top ups as much.

It's really hard especially when hormones are all over the shop, you're recovering from a major surgery and you're sleep deprived!!

Also make sure you eat and drink loads, you need the calories to heal and for energy.

Congratulations, he is a beautiful baby.

@addler I had a very similar experience when I had my Lo 10 weeks ago. I'd successfully EBF my first for a year so felt pretty confident about breastfeeding. I was shocked when she lost 11% at her 3 day appointment. That night she wouldn't stop screaming and I ended up giving her a bit of formula and she settled right down and slept. I was soooo worried that I wouldn't be able to breastfeed this time around and my confidence was totally shaken. After that bottle of formula I breastfed her as much as I could, never letting her go more than 2 hours between feeds, and my milk came in and by day 5 she'd gained 80g and she's gained ever since and that bottle or formula was the only one she's had to have and I'm EBF like I wanted to.

I know you're shaken and you feel like your body isn't doing what it's meant to, but I hope my story gives you hope that it's possible to turn things around after a big initial weight loss.

I breastfed my son exclusively for six months and continued feeding to 2.5 years old. I could NEVER express milk by hand. Even when my breasts were so full of milk it was painful, I was completely unable to express by hand. So being unable to express is not a sign that you have no milk. Even with a pump I never got as much milk out as the baby was able to get.

Also, all babies lose weight after birth, and breastfed babies lose more weight than bottle fed babies. Midwives should know this but many of them don’t, probably because so few women breastfeed. My son lost 12% of his birth weight and he was absolutely fine. It’s normal for a breastfed baby to lose that amount.

Cluster feeding is not a sign of hunger. It’s a natural reflex and it’s the baby’s way of stimulating your body to produce more milk. Babies often suck for comfort even if they’re not hungry. My son was on the breast pretty much constantly in the early days. They only need a tiny amount of milk, much less than you’d expect, and certainly much less than you’d give them if you were feeding formula.

If you really want to give top-ups, instead of topping up with formula I recommend you pump and use a bottle to give your baby any extra breast milk you manage to get. The more formula you give your baby, the less your baby will feed from you and the less your body will be stimulated to produce milk. It’s a vicious circle that often results in women failing to develop a milk supply and failing to continue breastfeeding. It’s much easier and faster for a baby to get formula out of a bottle than to get milk out of a breast, so they drink a lot more and then fall asleep because they’re absolutely stuffed. Once you’ve stretched your baby’s stomach by feeding formula they’re unlikely to go back to being satisfied with a small amount of rich breast milk.

You have NOT been starving your baby. The weight loss is normal. The constant feeding and desire to suck is normal. The small quantity of milk you’re producing is normal. I’m so angry at your midwife for making you think you’ve done something wrong or that your body isn’t working properly. Your experience sounds completely normal and your midwife obviously knows fuck all about breastfeeding. Stop worrying and feeling guilty, try pumping and offering breast milk top-ups from a bottle until you feel more confident that your supply has increased.

He looks absolutely beautiful. Gorgeous. He's a great colour - both of mine were more yellow at that stage - and to me, with 3kg newborns, he looks very rounded and chubby in both photos!

These first days and weeks are relentless. It's a constant cycle of sleep, feed, nappy. Just keep snuggling that baby, and let him explore your boobs as much as he wants. It will all fall into place I promise.

DS's poo has changed today from the meconium colour to a green seedy texture. Seedy means he's been getting some sort of breast milk or colostrum from me right?

Since we gave him the first bottle with formula yesterday he hasn't latched as well as he used to and he's unlatching sometimes and doesn't seem to be swallowing much or sucking as hard. I feel like I don't know what I'm doing or how to do it anymore. This time yesterday morning if you had asked me I would have said breastfeeding was going great and I was so happy and was just waiting for my milk to come in but I wasn't worried because I knew it's normally 2-5 days and longer with c sections. But now I don't even know if my milk has or will come in properly and if he was even cluster feeding in the first place and I have no confidence anymore.

I think I will call the infant feeding team today, I thought they might call yesterday after we were referred. Or I can ask the midwife when she comes today as well. I just want someone to come and watch him feed, as they only watched him latch and never checked if he was swallowing etc, and tell me if he's feeding properly and they can tell he's getting some milk. And to know that if my milk does come in in the next few days he won't have gone off it because he's had bottles.

He slept so well last night. I woke him every 2 1/2 hours for a feed and then he went straight back to sleep, he was up for a while after the 6am one this morning but is sleeping again on my chest now while I try and pump. DP and I both managed to sleep at the same time for the first time since he was born. I feel like the formula has made him so much more content but I wish I could do that for him without it.

Could you afford a private lactation consultant?

@addler if you Google pace feeding baby it can help from switching between breast and bottle. Most bottles we found our son could inhale it but we had a lot of success with mimbie bottles as the teet was very slow (they are only online). With your pumping relax, put the TV on have lots of water and cover the bottles with socks. If you are watching then you won't really be relaxed.

The midwife can watch you have a feed as well in terms of not swallowing as much you might find that he's not as hungry as formula takes longer to pass through their stomachs. Really stick with the set volume and only every 3 hours (we did every other feed). Feeding plans can end up in a bit of a cycle best advice is loads and loads of skin on skin and cuddles. Really focus on a deep latch as it will help your milk as well. If latch gets readjusted to shallow and more suckling then break him off with your little finger and start again.

I know it doesn't feel like it but honestly your doing fantastic! They always make BF seem like it's natural to baby so it just happens. Reality is a lot of mums don't in my antenatal class half of us were on feeding plans. But it does start to get easier in a week or two.

I'm no breastfeeding expert but just want to say, no matter what happens be assured you've done the right thing by him and are doing fine.
Whether he winds up on full formula or if you manage to exclusively breastfeed or both, it will be ok and he is gorgeous!

You're not failing your baby. It takes time to establish feeding and in my experience some HCP don't give very good breastfeeding advice, only to tell mums to top up with formula before nursing is established

There is absolutely nothing wrong with formula feeding or combi feeding, but if a mum wants to breastfeed then she really deserves proper support to do so without people giving her advice that will make her decision harder.

There's lots of mums who wanted to breastfeed who don't and many of them could have succeeded with the right support.

I'd reccomend an ILCC breastfeeding consultant, Lucy Ruddle on Facebook shares great advice, and La Leche League. It was only a few months in when a local breastfeeding specialist identified tongue tie and I'd been told in hospital that everything looked great.

@addler look up breast compressions on google/YouTube and do that when you feed (basically just squeezing your boobs to move milk through them - helps baby get milk quicker which is useful if there are latch/tongue tie issues and ups your supply. You should hear him swallow after every couple of sucks when he’s actively feeding. If he’s not doing that and is just sleeping on the boob then move him around a bit or switch sides to keep him going.

The poo sounds like he’s doing great! As I said, I could never express a drop so genuinely had no idea if I had any milk at all other than by looking at my babies’ nappies. If wee is coming out then milk is going in. DS was never sick/never posseted as a baby either - I remember being totally shocked when he vomited up a full milk feed at about 6 months as there was so much there and I’d never seen it!

BTW all my kids (and apparently this is a normal thing) say a very noticeable "LAA" when hungry. First they fuss then they start crying saying LAA then they sob cry. everyone can distinctly hear the LAA so listen for it if you're wondering whether he's hungry

@grey12 that’s funny - both of mine only say LA when they’re having their nappies changed - they both hate(d) it! Maybe LA is the sound of extreme rage 🤣

That was bad advice from the midwife, you should have been supported. You haven't been starving your child and it does take time for milk to come in. A drop in birth weight is completely normal. You don't have to stop feeding, put baby to the breast very regularly and see if they take it. The more they suckle the more milk your body will make. The more you top up, the less milk your body will make. X