WHAT CAN BE DONE TO INCREASE BREAST FEEDING RATES IN THE UK.

[lissie]

we all know that postnatal care is a huge factor, but what else can be done?

i speak as a failed bf-er who will try again with every baby i have, but supports the mothers right to choose.

good idea lissie, although i think they need to take the angle that breastfeeding doesn't have 'benefits' (as it should be seen as the normal way to feed a baby) rather that formula feeding has dis-advantages.

any cost to gov of pro-bf advertising would be outweighed with how much it would save the nhs if more people breastfed. and i'm sure most people know that 'breast is best' but don't necesarrily know why - protects mother from breastcancer etc etc

also i think it would help a lot if soaps featured breastfeeding storylines. and not just a baby being fed, but a storyline on mum getting mastitis, getting help from a breastfeeding councellor and managing to succeed with breastfeeding. it'd be great as so many people watch soaps. i'd love to see someone on corrie breastfeeding a toddler too, imagine the comments they'd get on points of view! lol!

lol roskva! you read my mind!

with regards to the cost of formula feeding to the nhs...
breastfeeding is known to result in
less orthadontic prblems for baby/child
fewer ear and eye infections
lower rates of childhood obesity
lower rates of diabetes
lower bp
less GI problems
lower incidence of pre-menopausal breast cancer for mum
lower incidence of ovarian cancer for mum
lower incidence of osteoporosis for mum

and am sure there are lots more things, just can't think of them all atm!

Someone mentioned that having real-life mums go into antenatal classes would help.

I've been one of those! The midwife at baby massage asked me and one other mum to talk to some of 'her ladies' at a surestart class. She stressed we should give them the full Monty - any issues we'd had, problems, great experiences etc.

So we yabbered on about our 'breastfeeding journeyi' (midwife's words) - stressing that, since we're not trained BF counsellors, they were just our experiences (mine - poor latch, great midwife support, then thrush in the nipples, ouch, followed by fantastic months of painless fab feeding then back to work and expressing fun).

Did it help those pregnant women? Who knows? I'd like to think so... We answered their questions and for half the group it was the first time they'd seen anyone breastfeeding (this was Southwark in London). The other half were newly arrived in Blighty and all said they were more used to seeing BFing women (mostly in Eastern Europe and Africa).

Sorry for ramble.

hi,
im still happily bfing my 9mth baby but i nearly gave up many, many times in the beginning. it really hurt, it was like being tortured 10 times a day. luckily i had a really good midwife who is a breastfeeding counsellor and runs the babycafe near me, and she helped me with positioning, let me bawl my eyes out on her shoulder, and generally supported me. it took 6 weeks to get the hang of it, but i would have to totally prepare myself beforehand, would be sobbing through some of it, and it was a very difficult time. sometimes i hated my baby because it was so painful, i actually feared him being awake cos of his demand for my breast, and i often wondered if we would have had an easier start to his life if i had put him on formula.
i think i found comfort in the fact other people had such a difficult time, and i think now that its better not to have such a rosy glow on breastfeeding. i wasn't at all like those smiling mothers, breastfeeding seemed to interfere with our bonding rather than help it. at the babycafes i found other women who found it difficult and painful and had carried on, and it was this, rather than the easy stories, that helped me carry on. suddenly too, other members of my family were telling me: oh god, yes, its agony isn't it?!
i don't think it should be a secret that it can be tricky for lots and lots of women. my midwife said, in her experience, about 90% of women had trouble bfing in the beginning, but, by 6 weeks, it turns a corner. and that helped reassure me.
so despite storming out the house screaming "give him formula!" and leaving my crying baby in my partners arms
i carried on and its been great! i perservered partly as a longterm investment. because whilst it was more difficult in those early days, i knew that he had so much less chance of allergies, that his immune system was getting really strong and good, and that i might be up half the night now but hopefully i would get pay back when he is a healthy child.
btw, i am a bit shy about bfing in public which is odd cos im quite gobby generally! a horrible old woman complained about me on a bus to all the other passengers and although i stood up for myself at the time, i have been shy ever since. you just don't want conflict when youve got your tits out! it feels really vulnerable!
oh, and this autumn im training as a peer supporter for other breastfeeding women.

Not sure what you mean by 'spurious' desiderata....but do you want some links to some papers on this? Do you really not think there is a price to pay, by the NHS, for formula feeding???

I saw a Mum BFing a baby the other night on TV - at about 2am when I was BFing!! It actually showed the baby suckling on the breast! Needless to say it was a foreign film (Japanese maybe I can't remember), but it was great!

Desiderata: this is a recent paper showing the extra cases in the UK of asthma, eczema and coeliac disease with formula feeding.

here

this is a collection of somewhat older papers covering a wider range of risks.

None of this means every individual formula fed baby is likely to get anything in particular, but on a population level it has a cost implication to the public purse in terms of medications, doctors' involvement and hospital stays. Not sure why this is still a live argument. What people observe in their own personal lives and among their own contacts means nothing. Proper research looks at thousands.

I had to make sure my child was weaned onto formula by 4 months of age because my full-whack maternity pay was up then, and as the chief-breadwinner I had to go back. No choice as had to pay the rent.

tiktok - I found the association with formula milk and the rise in the three diseases you describe as spurious.

Any research will turn up what you want it to. I tried to read the two links, but they were over my head (probably deliberately so!)

I will return to a point I made on another thread. I was born in the 60s, and went to school in the 70s. In a school of 1500 pupils, I cannot recall a single one who had an allergy related illness.

In the 60s, most children were bottle-fed (my brother and I certainly were, as were all my friends). I find the counter-argument that if you're breast fed your child won't get x & y totally inconclusive.

I am not saying that breast isn't best. It is the more natural thing to do. But to raise breast milk on a high, high pedestal is to make a mistake, in my opinion.

Since advertising seems to be one thing which may promote BF perhaps the Cadbury Sponsor advert for Corrie should show breastfeeding mums...everyone likes chocolate surely?

Oh why hasn't anyone commented on my suggestion....we shouldn't reinvent the wheel should we???

www.breastfeedingmanifestio.org.uk

I couldn't breastfeed as my babies were weak. I didn't have a clue at the time that they were going hungry.

What would have helped me would have been to stay in a maternity hospital for a week or so. I think all these problems are a result of non-joined up working in the health/social services. In the old days we were in hospital for a week and all these early problems would have been picked up. Probably cheaper in the long run for the NHS, if a mother's first baby experience goes well, she won't be needing as much help with subsequent births.

Before we agonise on dangers of formula milk, I think we should focus on the dangers of drinking, smoking, drugs and medications in pregnancy.

PS I agree with all that Elsbells said, way down the thread, but that comprehensive postnatal care (i.e. hospital for a week for firstborns) would help most.

Desiderata - Did a Formula Company pay you to come on here and dispute statistics??

I know 3 formula fed babies with severe excema, 1 with an allergy to cows milk, 1 with repeated glue ear infections resulting in speech and language difficulties, 2 with repeated chest infections, my sister puts her obesity down to being bottlefed and of the breastfed babies I know...just the usual childhood illnesses actually.

Difers, how very typical!

I think there needs to be more honest information about how difficult breast feeding can be, all you see is beautiful rosy pictures of a happy Mum and contented feeding baby. I had a horrendous time for 6 weeks, a cracked nipple (which never healed properly until I eventually stopped bf), mastitis (and then was told off but my HV for getting antibiotics to sort it out) and no one tells you it is so so painful - like being stabbed in the breast. But after 6 weeks it suddenly became the easiest thing in the world and I was so glad I persevered - the only reason I did was that a close friend was going through it a few weeks ahead of me and I could see it was going to get better. I am completely honest with all of my pregnant friends about my experience and it has not scared them off from BF

Agree with Miss Marvel, marvellous, i did stay in hospital for a week, I hated it but by god, I was a bf expert by the time left!

Ever heard of genetics?

surely encouragement and support for whatever way the mother choose's to feed her baby should be encouraged and suported,
I breastfed for six weeks then formula fed as i could not feed my baby.
If a higher tax was put on formula would this not encourage those on low income to give there baby full fat cows milk?

Are you for real?!

A higher tax on formula so that poor people who have trouble bfing, and let's face it they're usually the ones with the least support and the most obstacles, can be punished even more?

How much more wanky middle-class can you get? Honestly!

Desiderata -

Yes I've heard of genetics, why?

Difers ... you asked me if I got paid to dispute statistics. Anyone's gonna take offence at that.

Statistics are there to be disputed, so there's no payment necessary! Breast-feeding is not a dispassionate subject; therefore, people who seek, scientifically, to elevate its benefits, will do so very effectively.

For every argument, there is a counter-argument. If you cannot breastfeed, or if you do not wish to, I have yet to see conclusive evidence that your child will suffer as a result.

Whatever is causing this pandemic of allergies, it has nothing to do with milk.

Of my generation who were bottlefed, 4 have not had any medical problems to date, one had leukaemia and the other 3 I'm not sure if they have had any hospital treatment but they have no allergies, eczma or asthma.

My bottlefed cousin had glue ear 3 times but I feel that may have been linked to the fact both her parents smoked.

Of the breastfed babies 1 has an allergy to nuts and one has asthma. the other 6/7 are fine.

We can all look nat our group of friends etc, but it's hardly scientific.

Leave the formula feeding ladies alone. It's a choice. If you don't think it's an informed choice then educate - but don't be s negative. New Mums have enough guilt piled on them - try and encourage, not force, breastfeeding.

Desiderata are you unaware of the issues with Nestle and formula feeding in Africa?
There is some good info on www.babymilkaction.org/ including:

"The World Health Organisation (WHO) estimates that 1.5 million infants die around the world every year because they are not breastfed. Where water is unsafe a bottle-fed child is up to 25 times more likely to die as a result of diarrhoea than a breastfed child."

But I thought we were talking about bfing in the UK, Panncotta?

Appreciate the OP refers to UK but there are much wider issues relating to formula and health which are important to consider, even here in the UK.