When to call it a day.

[mrsnec]

I had an emcs last Friday. (26th.)

I was nil by mouth for the following 24 hours and only liquids on day 3.

I tried bfing within the first 24 hours. I was told by the midwives to always try bf first every time dd needs feeding.And then to make formula if she's still hungry afterwards.

Within on day 4 the pediatrician became concerned that dd was undernourished and potentially jaundiced and the implications were that it was because my milk isn't rich enough and I wasn't supplementing her with enough formula.

In hospital feeding was very stressful. I was in pain from the procedure and wasn't getting any support from the staff. So feeding was a very stressful affair. I would run out, have to put dd in her crib and take her down the corridor with me to make a bottle to then go back to our room and take her out again and the lifting was causing me a lot of pain and it meant each feed took a very long time.

I'm very sore now and was told to use shields. I thought now I'm home it would be less stressful but its not. And my milk is still very watery and runs out quickly. After about 15 mins on each side. She takes about 60ml after at least. She was 5 days prem and 6.9lb. This happens 5 or 6 times a day.

I've been told to increase my calorie intake but I'm not sure if that will help.That's why I mentioned food intake at the start.

I've also been told I must decide to do one or the other. I'm getting very upset and frustrated with this. I'd like to bf but I'm not going to beat myself up if I can't I just hate seeing dd so upset when I feed her. I'm drinking fennel tea, and taking vitamins.

Are you in the UK? The question about you having to do one or the other is a bit strange.

Is it possible for you to find a local breastfeeding group, or to find a lactation consultant?

In the meantime have you had a look at the Kellymom website? It has lots of useful info about breastfeeding, and how to deal with a variety of problems.

www.kellymom.com is amazing, just putting the link in for you :)

In England (I'm not sure about Wales/Ireland/Scotland) most Surestart Children's Centres run a weekly breastfeeding group run by trained staff. Several of the support workers at mine are also trained in breastfeeding so it might be worth rocking up and asking anyway, even if they don't have someone trained they tend to be lovely and will help you find decent local support. You can also contact your local midwives and push to see a specialist.

Congratulations on the birth of your daughter

I'm not in the UK. I don't have a lactation consultant, it was a friend in the UK who told me one or the other.

The midwives here did tell me that what I was doing was right. They checked how dd was latching etc and said it was all fine and just to keep going.

I don't know how a breastfeeding group would help me with that. Being around people doing a better job of it than me isn't the answer.

So I suppose I should rephrase the question. Am I just being impatient? What can I do to improve the quality? How long to give it before I give up?

It's highly unlikely that there is an issue with the quality of your milk. Your own diet will not affect your milk unless you are near starvation for a while. It is helpful for you to feel well to eat a healthy diet and drink enough water, but it won't affect your milk.

The suggestion of a breastfeeding group was not meant to taunt you with women who are doing a "better" job than you. You might find that there are women who have been in a similar position and can offer you useful suggestions, or just support and encouragement. But a group setting isn't everyone's cup of tea and it sounds like it wouldn't be of help for you.

You can investigate whether there are any lactation consultants near you via the International lactation consultant website (www.ilca.org). I do think that getting individual advice from an expert is going to be the most helpful thing.

Breastfeeding is a long game, and it can take a while to resolve issues. Patience is definitely worth it. If you want to reduce the formula top ups you could try offering a breastfeed every 2 hours in the day, 3 at night. If you give formula top up afterwards, then use a teat that mimics the breastfeeding action rather than a fast flow one. It will take time to move over to 100% breastfeeding.

On the other hand, if it is causing you a lot of stress and upset, then you can of course swap to 100% formula feeding. It's your choice to do either, and formula is a perfectly adequate substitute if breastfeeding is not working out.

Yes you're right about the group setting. I was given some info in hospital as they wanted me to sign up for a massive tandem breastfeeding event and I decided against it.

That's interesting about the timing. I was told to offer whenever she's awake. Sometimes she's sleeping 6 hours would that mean waking her up to feed her?

I was using the bottle I was giving her in hospital but I do have the breastfeeding ones I could try. I've also noticed it's worse since I had to use the shields so maybe I can give them up soon when I'm not so sore.

It's a tricky one wrt to the long sleeps, but my feeling would be that at only a few days old 6 hrs is too long to be sleeping without a feed. I would try a feed after 3 hrs if she hasn't woken.

Have you got any lanolin cream for your nipples? I used Lansinoh, if it's available where you are. You don't have to remove it before a feed, and it can really help with sore nipples.

sorry, i didn't mean to pressure you into going to a group it's just that in the UK it's the most reliable way of accessing a trained bf supporter

I will try that tonight with the sleeping.

I will also look out for that cream. I have the mothercare one and I'm wiping off the residue every time I feed I'm not convinced the mothercare cream is doing anything anyway.

No, don't worry I didn't feel pressure from you. I know that in the UK that kind of thing is usually suggested first. When I said I hadn't got support from the staff I was mainly talking physically. I had one on one coaching whenever I wanted and I had a room to myself which is another reason why it's frustrating because I know I wouldn't have got that in the UK.The lack of support was that they wouldn't keep an eye on her for me while I made the formula so it's like they made that deliberately difficult to encourage bf more. But I feel that made feeding more stressful.

Since she was born I've tried everyday more than a few times and not once has she been satisfied after a feed from me. If that happens id be more than happy to persevere.

I am a bit confused why you were told to supplement from.the start. What was the reason? Many babies will take formula after a bf even if they don't 'need' it (it takes very little effort) so on it's own it doesn't mean much. The advice you have been given about watery milk running out also seems odd. I hope you can find some good support to decide what to do.

can you get a few ready made cartons for the times you really can't face mixing?

the answer to most feeding issues seems to be settle your bum on the sofa and feed lots

If it helps, I had an EMCS and large blood loss, and my milk didn't come in for 6 days, and when it did there was little of it.

To start with we supplemented with formula as there was no option, but after 3 weeks we started to reduce the amount / quantity of bottle feeds and fed entirely on demand. Evenings were particularly tough because my supply was so low - cluster feeding which left baby frustrated and me very sore.

But... Now at 8 weeks my daughter has been exclusively breastfed for 3.5 weeks and my supply is obviously sufficient as she's gaining weight well and getting through the Pampers pretty quick.

This despite being told by midwives in week 2 that I was unlikely to be able to breastfeed.

It was painful and stressful (and may be again) but I am so glad I persevered.

Fennel tea and porridge may have helped too... No real evidence though.

I wish you luck and courage!

If I read your OP right, it seems to say you're feeding about 6 times a day. The best way to build supply is to offer lots, and your baby should be feeding 8 -10 times a day, and woken up for feeds. Each feed should start no more than 3 hours from the beginning of the last. If it hurts, do find someone to check the latch and look for tongue tie.

I had similar issues with DD, who was very drowsy after an epidural and forceps birth, I was in pain after a fourth degree tear, and i'm pretty sure my milk didn't start to come in until day 6. 3 months on, she feeds like a champion and its well worth it.