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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

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Original poster

Explain expressing to me?

17 replies

BeanyIsPregnant · 10/08/2014 14:27

Ds is 4 days old and has tongue tie, it's being cut on the 19th- until then I've been advised to express as I'm doing my nipples too much damage trying to feed him.
I managed to express with a hand express machine 2oz in 20mins (no idea if this is good or not?) into a steralised bottle.. But what do I do with it? How can I store it etc?
If he's fed from bottles for the next 10 days is there any chance he will be able to latch properly again or not? :/

OP posts:

mummaduke · 10/08/2014 15:06

Hi,

Congrats!!

I can't comment on tongue tie, but best way to store expressed milk is in the fridge - top shelf, at the back. I believe it will keep up to 5 days. Always shake it well as it separates.

You can also freeze it - defrost it in the fridge overnight.

Best way to store is in storage bags, e.g Medela ones, can be bought in Boots.

2oz in 20mins on day 4 is great. If you continue to express you'll see this increase...

Good luck getting your DS to latch on - do you have a BF councillor nearby?

whitemusk · 10/08/2014 21:27

Hi there, there are ways to make bottle feeding more like breastfeeding breastfeeding.support/tips-to-bottle-feed-a-breastfed-baby/. And this article may be helpful re pumping breastfeeding.support/how-can-i-pump-more-breast-milk/ Some babies take to the breast after a short period of bottle feeding without any problems and others need a little coaxing but although 9 days must feel like forever it is comparatively a short time and your baby will still have their feeding reflexes etc. I have seen babies take to the breast after several weeks of bottle feeding and also several months. However do seek out some really good hands on help with positioning, ideally if you could book an appointment with a lactation consultant (IBCLC) they would be able to go through everything with you and help you get positioning just right and keep your supply going until baby latches. Yes 2oz is great on day 4, check storage guidelines here kellymom.com/bf/pumpingmoms/milkstorage/milkstorage/

GoogleyEyes · 10/08/2014 21:35

If you can get hold of a double pump (might be called a 'hospital grade pump') either from your hospital or the NCT, that makes expressing much easier and quicker. You can buy them, but they're over £100. And if you hire you will see if that particular pump works for you.

People will recommend different bottles - I had a really good experience with Breastflow bottles, as it was the most similar jaw action to breastfeeding and the milk didn't come out too easily. But that was with an older baby, and only one feed a day.

I'd second getting hold of an IBCLC if you possibly can, she will be able to advise you on all of this.
Might even know someone who can deal with the tongue tie faster, too - they tend to have excellent contacts.

I do hope things work out for you

stargirl1701 · 10/08/2014 21:43

It needs prep. I found I got good results from:

Breast massage with Weleda nursing oil
Looking at photo of baby
Smelling an item of baby's clothes
Listening to a bf hypnotherapy CD (Maggie Howell)
Pumping minimum 12x per day inc 3 overnight
Rewarding myself with choc raisins every time I pumped

But, I think the key is real life help. Have you spoken to the Infant Feeding Co-ordinator at the hospital? The mat unit will have her number. Also try local bf cafés, the national bf helplines and a board certified lactation consultant (maybe by video if you live rurally).

There is also good pumping info on kellymom.com

Good luck OP!

museumum · 10/08/2014 21:46

Can you put him on the breast at all over the next ten days? I had two weeks from TT diagnosis to snip and my ds has a bf with a bit of expressed to top up every feed. He was fine bf after the snip and in fact became a bottle-refuser at three months!!!

Original poster

BeanyIsPregnant · 10/08/2014 23:27

I can probably put him back on the breast again tomorrow, but not sure I would be able to last an entire feed, I really am quite damaged :( also struggling because I'm fairly sure he can smell my milk? Every time I pick him up for a cuddle/ to comfort him he starts rooting and crying.. It's making the whole process a lot harder tbh!
Thanks for the fab links, have had a quick look but will read properly tomorrow. I'm really torn as to what I actually want. I thought I wanted to ebf, but I also want a balance of some sleep/ being able to have 1:1 time with my dd.. Which will be bloody hard ebf ds, equally, I know it's the best thing for him and if I don't give it a really really good go I'm scared il regret it forever..

OP posts:

returnvisit · 11/08/2014 08:57

Hi im i was in a similar position to you. My ds had tongue tie. Nipples were torn to shreds. I couldnt take the pain so for 1.5 days i expressed and gave a few formula feeds. I really wanted to ebf but i couldnt express any more milk so had to top up. Things are much better after hes had his tongue tie snip and i can no feed him without my nipples getting sore. The football hold was best for me. Try different positions and google the nipple sandwich technique, it really helps to achieve a deeper latch. Good luck

donkir · 11/08/2014 09:06

Have you tried using nipple shields while feeding. I know advent and tommiee tippee do them. I had to use them with ds as I have inverted nipples. They were great and could breast feed without getting pain and cracked nipples where ds couldn't latch on.

worldgonecrazy · 11/08/2014 09:11

I expressed a lot in the early days - we used a Haberman teat which was originally designed for special needs babies, but is great for babies who are bottle fed too. The baby has to actively suck to get milk from the teat, even the slowest flow of normal teats seems to leak a bit of milk, which could lead to laziness. The teats are available over the internet. I used a hand pump during the early months, but then switched to an electronic pump and wished I'd done it earlier.

Details of the teat are here: haberman teat

whitemusk · 11/08/2014 09:53

A PP mentioned nipple shields... they can certainly help you through but I have heard bad reports from the Tommy Tippee Shields specifically. They have made mums very sore, they seem to pinch. But with all shields you do need a deep latch just as you would have on breast and have to find the best fit. More information here breastfeeding.support/nipple-shields-good-or-bad/ Maybe look through this link for the latching videos? breastfeeding.support/how-do-i-position-my-baby-to-breastfeed/ It's difficult to make a decision about breastfeeding when it hurts so much, I do hope you can find some good help soon. Are you in UK?

eurochick · 11/08/2014 10:41

I'm mainly expressing. My daughter was born at 34 weeks and wasn't able to breastfeed to start with, but I wanted her to get the benefits of breastmilk.

An electric pump is essential imo, if you are going to be expressing regularly. We have hired one from Ardo, on my mw's recommendation. They are quite expensive to buy and having borrowed a Medala Swing to try, the Ardo one is much better.

I was advised by the NICU to express 8-10 times per day, including at night, to get up my supply.

There is plenty of info on the internet about how to store bm. I also got an NHS breastfeeding leaflet at booking in that contains guidance.

My daughter is now just out of NICU and is learning to bf, despite having been bottlefed since coming off IV food. She is struggling a bit with latch (and I have a mw coming over later to try to help) but does latch on well sometimes. We just need to get her doing that consistently. At the moment, we are mixing bottle and breast and she doesn't seem to have major problems switching between the two, to the extent that I quite often bf her for a little while when my husband is preparing the bottle of expressed milk and she goes between one and the other without problem. I hope to transition to mostly breast with the occasional bottle so my husband can feed her.

Original poster

BeanyIsPregnant · 11/08/2014 11:02

Yes I'm in the uk :)
I've got the medula nipple shields, but he really struggles to latch on them, I think the 'nipple' bit is way too long for him, he still feeds but he's chewing on my nipple more than if I don't use them, which I don't want to lead to bad habbits?!
Going to the breastfeeding clinic on Thursday, and the fb councillor I saw said they should be able to cut it the following Tuesday. Just feels like such a long time!!

Going to be brave and try and latch him on this afternoon, I might give him half a bottle of expressed milk then latch him? Hoping it means he won't want to feed for as long.....

OP posts:

Chaz1210 · 11/08/2014 16:53

Are u having TT clipped or lasered? Also is it posterior?

ElphabaTheGreen · 11/08/2014 17:15

OP - I'm currently BFing my second tongue-tied baby and I can't get an appointment to get it sorted - NHS or private - until 2 September

I didn't use bottles at all with my first - I expressed and cup-fed for the time it was too painful to feed so that it wouldn't affect latch and have done the same this time. Ask your midwife if she can show you how to do this and also see if they can loan you a hospital-grade double pump. I don't think you'll have a hope hand expressing or using a manual pump!

You also shouldn't need to stop BFing for 10 days. Nipples are highly vascular and heal very quickly. I think it took about three days with my first before I was able to start putting him back on for the odd feed, which I was gradually able to increase because, in fact, you do actually toughen up a bit, even with the TT un-snipped. At present I've made myself a bit of a 'wet dressing' which I'm finding quite effective - coat your nipples liberally in some expressed milk, then a very thick layer of Lansinoh, then a breast pad.

HTH

PinkAndBlueBedtimeBears · 12/08/2014 07:18

Chaz, no idea if it will be clipped or lasered.. My dds was lasered I think but this is a different hospital etc should I have a preference?
Elphaba that's a horrific waiting time, it's awful to think how many people will understandably admit defeat when faced with that waiting time :(
Well done for carrying on! All of the pumps have already been loaned out, I'm really struggling to keep up with demand withs hand pump, and started giving formula top ups. Il try and latch him instead of those top ups? I'm petrified of the pain tbh :(

whitemusk · 12/08/2014 09:48

OP you can find an IBCLC in UK here www.lcgb.org/consultants_local.html and a tongue tie practitioner here www.tongue-tie.org.uk/find-a-tongue-tie-divider.html

PinkandBlue bear in mind that if it hurts to latch, your baby is either in a shallow latch or pinching the nipple because of poor tongue function but either way he is unlikely to get enough milk long term that way. So continuing to offer top ups after the feed and expressing will keep your baby well fed and your supply protected until the latch can be fixed. I am not convinced that nipples toughen up as such but they can lose sensitivity after severe damage. There is more info about tongue tie treatments here breastfeeding.support/is-my-baby-tongue-tied/

Chaz1210 · 14/08/2014 22:58

Both my kids had PTT and ULT (they usually come together). I had my sons lasered last week by Dr Levinkind, who is based in East Finchley. I think laser was a better option for us because his reattached twice before and it was clipped..I would def consider it. Plus Levinknd really knows his stuff. Hope it all works out.x

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