New baby question - night feedings... please reassure me it will get better or advise about formula!

[usingapseudonym]

I love breastfeeding or at least I did when I had daughter no 1 and we nursed well over a year.

However daughter no 2 (11 days old) is wonderful during the day - feeds every 2- 3 1/2 hours and sleeps a lot in between (completely unlike no 1 who was active from the word go) but at night... ARG. She wakes every hour to hour and a half. I'm knackered. With no 1 I could of course sleep during the day but with no 2 I have toddler to deal with. I'm exhausted already and husband hasn't gone back to work yet. I'm dreading it.

I'm just about out of zombie mode at some point during the day but I really don't want to spend the next 6-9months in a daze. I know I was very sleep deprived with no1.

I've already started to think about a formula feed at night. I know friends of mine from first time round did this. Bf mainly with a feed at night just to get some sleep.... would it be so bad?!

Or will she settle down in future or are her days and nights muddled?!

Any advice welcome. During the night I am really beginning to resent her waking up and wanting to feed :(

Congratulations on your new baby:)

I formula fed my eldest from 10 days, because I just couldn't cope. He fed every hour and half. I breastfed DS2 until 7 months.

If I'm honest, the formula feeding at night was actually easier in the first few weeks, as warming bottles at night was a real faff, and took a lot longer. He still fed every hour and a half.

(I absolutely hated breastfeeding - long story - but it was easier at night).

Saying that, giving a bottle of formula won't hurt, and at least someone else can do the feed for you.

Good luck. X

Stupid brain - I meant breastfeeding was easier at night!!!

Do bear in mind the amount of faff involved with ff, esp at night when you're exhausted. It's very early days and won't be like that for months and months. Can you try co-sleeping? Your milk supply will still be adjusting to your lo's needs and will be affected if you use formula at this early stage. If your baby sleeps a lot in the day, do you have a chance to express so your dp could give ebm for one of the night feeds, perhaps?

I would try feeding more frequently in the day (3.5 hours seems like a long time between feeds), and feed lying down in bed at night so you can doze and feed.

Make sure the baby sleeps in the living room in the daytime with lights on, people chatting around them etc - then keep night feeds as dark and quiet as possible. Hopefully that will help sort night from day.

I would second co-sleeping as the answer: baby feeds lying down, you sleep, Bob's your uncle. FF would involve getting up and sitting up in the cold night - not for me!

This is normal and what your baby is wired to do-prolactin(the hormone responsible for milk production) is at it's highest at night which is why babies wake frequently during the night so your milk supply can establish this takes between 6-8 weeks. Introducing Formula may interfere with this natural occurance and it not a guaranteed way of ensuring your baby will sleep - I formula fed my first and she was a terrible sleeper.

Also your baby is far too young to know the difference bwtween night and day yet.

I'm sorry to contradict the earlier poster and I do so respectfully, however it isn't possible to say with certainty that giving a bottle of formula won't hurt.

This website might help, OP. www.kellymom.com/nutrition/milk/infant-formula.html

I really do feel for you. Nights like that with a toddler as well are utterly miserable. :( Co-sleeping really can help and I strongly recommend a book called "3 in a bed" which discusses the pros and cons of it together with safe co-sleeping information.

If it's possible to feed more during the day it may help but in all honesty the most likely thing to help is time, and working on strategies to manage it. Anything you can do to try to increase your sleep within each 24 hours. Nap when you can, early nights, co-sleeping and so on.

The downsides of night time formula feeding have been discussed and when your DH goes back to work it may be harder for him to take on some of those feeds, too, so it's not necessarily an easier option. If you can manage to get the hang of feeding lying down and co-sleeping you can actually latch on and go back to sleep which can be a lifesaver. Babies often sleep better next to you as well, so she might just sleep a bit longer between feeds.

Having said that, if none of this is working then there is a safety and risk balance between the risk of introducing formula and the risk of you, say, driving when utterly exhausted.

I found Dr Sears to be reall helpful. He has some lovely night time parenting books and a great website.

What Organic said^

I agree with a few of the other posters that FF is not the answer. It will not only not make baby go longer but it will also affect your supply. 11 days old is hard because they are feeding so often, but hang in there and I promise it gets better. DD2 is now 5 weeks and JUST started going 3-4 hours at night and 2 in the day. Before that she was 1.5-2 at night. Co sleeping has been a god send and I plan to keep it up for my sanity, you should try it if you can

I wouldn't say that FF isn't the answer - just that there are lots more answers before then that could really be better ones :)

But banana is absolutely right that it is soooo early on and things will change so much in just a very short time. Hopefully some of our suggestions will help you through that time :)

Thanks for the reassurance - its what I needed to hear. My brain is a bit sozzled at the moment.

We do sort of co-sleep. I have special cot with 3 sides attached to the bed. The "problem" I have is oversupply so I have to be awake when feeding to have a towel for the other breast to catch the cup of milk that comes out that side when I feed on the other side. I am currently feeding her close to me and pushing her away a little while I sleep.

I am so tired... zzzzzzz

When husband goes back to work he will often be away mon-friday... help?!

PS I LOVED the book 3 in a bed with my first - not just for the co-sleeping but the breastfeeding and other natural approaches.

My baby sleeps a lot during the day- should I be waking her to feed her? Its probably about 2 hours in between but sometimes up to 3 1/2. I've just left her to it so far!

Day time is definitely noisy (toddler sees to that) and night time quiet.

Oh you poor thing :( I would hate my DH being away that long :( Def one to factor in - that whatever happens you'll be doing those night feeds.

I think it might be worth waking her to feed in the day and see what happens. Of course, over the next 11 days, which will whizz by, she will double her age and change completely.

Hope you can hang in there and work through it. xx

Hi using, just wanted to let you know you're not alone. we've got the same here I'm guessing it's normal and I have just blocked out the pain with the other 2. Dd is 1 week today she settled much better in bed with me she did her first 4 hour stretch last night. I can't beleve how much she sleeps I am trying to feed her every 2 hours in the day but she's sometimes hard to wake enough for her to have a good feed and my nipples are in bits so reluctant to put her on when she is sleepy or she gets lazy with her latch.

Four hours..... four hours...... sounds like heaven :) What did you do? I woke my daughter last night for a feed before I went to bed and she managed 2 slots of 2 1/2 hours which was an improvement.

Its funny how perspective changes doesn't it? A few weeks ago if my daughter woke once I would be a bit grumpy - now I'm desperate for my baby girl to wake just once!

Grr for sore nipples though :( That's not good. I've been lucky in that department so far this time around.

Not disimilar here....Ds is now 10 days, waking every hour at night to feed. He also won't sleep in his basket, only on my chest, and i'm scared of falling asleep in ase he overheats or suffocates somehow. My husband smokes etc, so worried about co sleeping. I'm already thinking about expressing a bottle just so he can do a night feed, or big feed in the evening, but am feeling a bit pressured by all the advice about nipple confusion.
The sleep deprivation is already taking it's toll, think I was hallucinating his face on tv last night, a bit worried about going nuts so chugging the anti deps and vitamins.
I know it will get better, but I don't suit 20 min sleeps...second to pseudonym...how do I get him to go a bit longer?

I second the cosleeping too, also try feeding more on day. Dd cluster feeds from 7-11pm now and has increased her night sleep to about 7 hour stretch. Flop side is she sleeps less in day so less time for me to spend with her brothers.

Bleeding will get easier though, it's just different after you've had your first. I always feel guilt for not giving the boys more time. It does get easier tho.

Congratulations on baby :-) my dd is 9 weeks tomorrow x

youtalkintomeunderthemiseltoe are you seeing anyone IRL about this? Your nipples should not be like this. I would really try to get someone to help you as this is not right. What is her nappy output like? Are you getting plenty of wet and dirty nappies (say 5-6 wet and 3-4 poos, mustard yellow probably) every 24 hours?

adewonder you are right that smoking is a bedsharing risk. Sleeping on you like that should be fine though especially if you have a save surrounding in the bed if she rolls off. Would you Dh consider quitting (great reason to) or maybe sleeping in another room for a few weeks to try to save your sanity a bit? He won't overheat on your chest, provided he's not under a duvet. Just a babygrow is probably fine if he is literally sleeping on top of you, with a blanket if you need it. WRT nipple confusion, yes this can be a problem but you might try feeding with a syringe or a cup (latter not easy though and very messy). However if you really need to because nothing else is working, you might just want to try the bottle using the tiniest hole possible in the teat (newborn style) and as few bottles as possible, stopping if she shows any dissatisfaction at the breast and trying again in a few weeks. Just a thought.

usingapseudonym 2 lots of 2 1/2 hours isn't bad - sorry :( although obviously you need more than that in total. But it does show she's going for a time rather than waking every few minutes which might mean something is wrong (even if that something is "just" being alone). So it's a positive thing and means she's likely to start to go longer when she's ready. That's not very helpful, is it :(

Yes to nappies and poos I know what the problem is, I had one night of exhaustion where I fed her in bed without correcting her latch she also has a tiny mouth and I have big nipples sorry tmi, this is my 3rd breast fed baby and I have had a period of sore nipples ie toughening up with all of them. I'm through the worst now feeding is much easier today.

She was back to her usual 2 hours at night but settled much quicker, I've been waking her every 2 hours today although it does involve stripping her off to wake her enough for feeds.

using I've been napping between 7 when the others go to bed and 10, it feels very unsocial but I felel slightly more human although that said I've just been to town to get remaining pressies and despite being there all day returned with nothing it's like a foggy haze.

Oh that's ok then :) Hope you don't mind me asking - just wanted to make sure you were ok and not battling on without knowing it could be sorted out :)

It's not so much toughening up (just didn't want that to confuse someone :) ) as much as mum and baby getting the knack between them. Sounds like you know how to do just that, which is brilliant.

Of course not it's hard work and every baby is different even though I've done it before I found it no less challenging each time, the difference is I know the hard part isn't forever and that it's worth it in the end doesn't mean the thought of giving formula hasn't flashed through my mind

I know what you mean, youtalk :) Good on you though :)

Organic - I wasn't complaining about the 2 x 2 1/2 hours but being pleased! So far (and either side of those) its been every hour (as per OP).

I was foreseeing a future like with baby one where it was every 2 hours at night for the most of the first year. I simply couldn't maintain this if she wakes every hour. Whereas with baby 1 I could nap during the day I simply can't with baby 2 as husband works away (after his paternity leave finishes). I simply couldn't function as I did if this goes on like last time!

I feel a lot better today BUT its because my husband is off at the moment and took her for 3 hours during the day after I fed her and I slept. I also haven't cooked anything or had to put my toddler to bed etc!

I suspect the answer will party be as youtalking suggests - to go to bed after bedding toddler.. Ho hum!

I'm scared silly of being a zombie for the next year and not enjoying her at all and if a bottle of formula at bedtime would change that I'd do it. However she is not yet 2 weeks... so I will hold off for a while :)

Organic - yes that's very helpful! If it means she will go longer when she is ready I can hold onto that .... :)

OP if it helps I have formula fed three babies and it hasn't made an iota of difference to their sleep - they don't .