Feeling terrible about mixed feeding - wanting to go back to bfing?

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Hi, DD is now 12 days old. We started off bfing, which I was really keen on from the off. We left hospital after a day, with the midwives telling me she was feeding fine only to end up with severely cracked and bleeding nipples 4 days later - the pain was excruciating.

The midwives at the hospital never actually watched the latch, just my position. My midwife visited me at home for day 5 visit and watched the latch, confirming she wasn't latching on properly (just right onto my nipple). She told me how to do it, but by that point I was so exhausted (bad latch = feeding lasting about 50mins and having to go again 30 mins later) and still hadn't properly recovered from a 30 hour labour so I started to use my electric pump to express.

DP was not massively supportive of my bfing, and when I had problems he was very quick to go out and buy formula (also I guess all he saw was me so tired and in pain). I have been so upset since, crying every day (I kno hormones all over the place) at feeling like I've let down DD and disappointed/ like a bad mother.

I have been expressing about 8 times a day since, my nipples have nearly healed and I am thinking I would like to give bfing another go. Do you think this would be possible? I am expressing about 3 oz each time. Does anyone have any advice for me?

Thank you

Hi! Don't be disheartened breast feeding is a bugger to get the hang of. If you've continued to express your milk should be good to go, get her to latch on, and feed until she stops, the general rule of thumb is the more she feeds the more you'll produce.

I would suggest getting in contact with

www.laleche.org.uk/

They'll assign you with an expert who'll email you between HV visits, I found them really useful (my son was a hungry one, and I could only keep up with him until he was 16 weeks, and they were a great support to me).

Try not to give up, and try not to combine feed (breast and formula, I did this to combat the hungriness and he rathered the bottle as it was faster, and as I was feeding him less, the milk was less = catch 22).

Your hormones will be all over the place, keep trying but don't feel like a failure if it doesn't work, it isn't the end of the world I promise you that. I felt as though I'd failed and it was horrid but I got over it and merely enjoyed him being alive and healthy! Best of luck to you, and congratulations! :)

Congratulations on your new baby, and I'm so sorry you were let down by the mws. Very poor care to not actually check the latch!

Have you spoken to your MW or HV about re-introducing bfing? Is there a local bfing group that you could go to (LLL as mentioned by Lifeforrent is fab but they might not cover your area). You really need face to face support at this time as for all the good information any of us can give you, you need someone to look at you and your baby to see how you are doing (absolutely wonderfully hopefully ).

That said, there is lots you can do in the mean time to prepare for it.

Good on you for expressing 8 times a day, that's really encouraging that you won't have a struggle with supply. When you pump do you pump both sides? Do you have an electric pump or manual? Have you been shown how to hand express? This can be done after using a pump to get the max. amount of milk out (the more milk removed the more you will make).

Have a look at Jack Newman's website - it has some fantastic videos on how to latch on baby and how to see if baby is swallowing milk (reassuring after lots of bottle feeding).

Also, you can do lots of skin to skin and co-bathing to help baby latch on by herself. Keep it low key (don't stress if she doesn't go for your breast straight away) just let her enjoy mummy's warm skin and gentle touch. If you express a little milk just before trying skin to skin you can rub it around your nipple so that baby can follow the smell.

There is a great website on skin to skin bfing (also known as biological nurturing or laid back nursing) here.

I bottle fed DD1 until she was 8w old (mainly formula too), she then came back to bfing and nursed until she was 3.6y/o (not saying you have to but that bottle feeding doesn't mean that baby will never bf again).

My one bit to say is that it's not too late! I was forced to mix feed, and by week 3 the bottle feeds were EBM only, by week 4 we were off bottles completely.

I went to a BF clinic and the baby cafe to get help, definitely worth looking up support in your area.

Keep pumping, and by all means start offering the breast again.

Congrats on your baby, well done - a 30h labour must have been exhausting! And you have done incredibly well to persevere with giving her breastmilk. Please give yourself a pat on the back and feel proud of yourself .

As for relactating, if that is what you want then it can be done. It is not too late.

The key is feed, feed, feed. The more you feed your dd, the more milk you will make.

Can you go to some breastfeeding drop-ins? Your HV should be able to tell you about local ones. But, importantly, go to ones run by NCT/BfN/LLL/ABM volunteers, as these ladies are the experts and absolutely the bee's-knees when it comes to breastfeeding support. BTW they will not judge you for your feeding methods, but help you go forward in the way you feel is best for yourself and your baby.

Your dd is still young enough to have the 'breast-crawl' instinct. This is where she will, given the opportunity and plenty of patience from you, seek out the nipple herself. Best to do this when she's not frantic from hunger.

So have a Babymoon. Undress both of yourselves as much as possible and go to bed together. Plenty of relaxed skin-to-skin contact. Feed as often as you like. Feeding lying down and in a relaxed, unrestricted manner, will give you and dd the opportunity to learn about each other and I'm sure that you will, within a few hours, see her searching out the nipple for herself - something that is much harder to do if it is covered with clothes and she has to wait while you uncoil your bra to give her access.

Set up a Sofa Station. Plate of healthy snacks (eg fruit and sandwiches) bottle of water, book, TV RC etc all within arm's reach, and do nothing but feed and relax.

You can either start in the morning and hold off giving a bottlle as long ad possible, or you can aim to skip one bottle at a time. Either way, breastfeed her before every bottlefeed.

I must dashnow, but I just wantto say also that I relactated when ds1was 6w.

Don't be afraid to access as much support as you want. The breastfeeding supporters are fantastic women - I cried on many of their shoulders, and laughed with them, too.

if getting out and going to a group is difficult your local lll may know of a lactation consultant who can come to your house - although this may cost. also ask your hv if there is anyone who you can contact - i had an infant feeding co-ordinator come to me. this should be free. good luck xx

I gave up bf on day 2 and started again on day 6, got to exclusive breastfeeding by day 11 even though I didn't do any expressing between day 2 and 6. Try what has been suggested above to see if you can get baby to feed direct from you (biological nurturing can be really good). If you're struggling with the latch still, keep up the expressing until you can see a bf counsellor.
0300 100 0212 is the National Breastfeeding helpline.
0300 330 0771 NCT breastfeeding helpline
0845 120 2918 La Leche League

I got help with the latch and built my supply back up by expressing after feeds (would only get a few drops but the stimulation tells your body to make more milk)

You're doing really well by the way :) The first few weeks are so tough, especially as you're still recovering from the birth, but it does get better

what marzipan said - i was told the frequency of stimulation is the most important thing, not how much you get out.

I just re-read your OP, and realised how much you are expressing - 8x3= 24oz a day! You don't need to re-lactate, you've maintained your production of milk at an excellent level. That is quite an achievement! How much formula is dd actually taking?

Definitely get some face-to-face support from a trained breastfeeding supporter. I think that, once you get the latch sorted, you will find that your supply adjusts very quickly and easily.

Babymooning for 24h will still be helpful. And fun .

Thank you so much for your support.

I rang my midwife this morning (unbeknown to DP) after DP and I argued as he doesn't want me to try again. It is hard doing this without support! She is going to come out tomorrow morning and help me with the latch again.

She also gave me the number of the BF coordinator in our area who does drop-in sessions, which I will try too.

She is a greedy little thing - taking about 3-4oz formula and same in breast milk alternating feeds at the moment. It is a shame because I am producing more than she wants to take.

Just got to wait for DP to get out of bed then I'm going to explain that I need to give this one last try, and that I'm a lot calmer now and if it doesn't work again then that's that. I just need this one last go, otherwise I will really regret it.

Babymooning sounds lovely, will give that a go this week!

Thanks again

Congratulations.

You've had some excellent advice so I just want to add my positive experience to add to your confidence. I had to bottle feed for the first two weeks due to a tongue tie. I kept expressing during that time (although not getting any where near as much milk as you) and at six weeks we've now been breast feeding for almost four weeks.

My DH has been supportive but struggled seeing me in pain. Now we've settled into more of a routine and the bf is going better he's finding it much easier to cope with. Hopefully your DH will get used to the idea quickly once he sees you being successful and your DD thriving.

Y'know, it doesn't have to be all-or-nothing.

You don't have to say "dh, today I am returning to breastfeeding" - not unless you want to, of course.

You can just do it for a morning, for example, and when dh asks about the bottle say "she seemed quite content and didn't need it this morning".

I'm not sayin deceive your dh, just, perhaps, don't rub his face in something he too may find distressing.

I'm not sure a man can have more than an intellectual desire for his baby to be breastfed, whereas for the mother it can also be a physical desire, a craving.

For him, the distress you have been suffering could be a bigger motivator than anything else ATM. And, perhaps, he feels he will miss out on something he has felt good about: bottle-feeding his child himself. Which he doesn't need to do, even if you end up ditching the formula completely. You have proven yourself to be a champion expressed (I hope you're freezing anything you don't use that day!), so he'll still be able to feed his dd a bottle.

BTW, if you do this, his bottlefeed should be a daytime one until she's at least 6w old, as in the early weeks nighttime feeds are important for establishing a good supply. Once that is sorted...

It's hard that your DP isn't supportive, maybe you can get him to read some stuff on why bf is so great (once you've got the hang of it)? My DH is sooo glad I managed to bf in the end - he HATED the faffing with bottles in the middle of the night!

"She is a greedy little thing - taking about 3-4oz formula and same in breast milk alternating feeds at the moment. It is a shame because I am producing more than she wants to take."

In that case, why give her formula at all?

If you are pumping 8 x 3oz ie 24oz in 24 hour period, that would be a full supply for a 12 day old baby - so while you are expressing that volume she shouldn't need any formula at all - TBH I don't really understand why you are offering formula if you are producing that amount of milk. You haven't really made that clear....

If you can't get her to latch on and feed directly (without causing more nipple damage) then you need some RL help in ensuring her positioning is good so the sore nipples don't come back - my SIL was referred to a great clinic by her GP, so do go and ask, some PCTS have drop in BFing clinics/workshops.

Hi All, Got the Infant Feeds Coordinator coming out later this morning to help out with the latch and going to take it from there.

I'm expressed 3 oz at a time, but been told I can only put together 2 different bfeeds (so that's 6 oz) and she is taking about 4oz so I'm wasting 2oz if that makes sense. Does anyone know if this is correct?

DP and I been arguing past two days about it, it's horrible. Do wasn't breastfed and says 'he turned out fine' - aarrggh! Going to take your advice PrettyCandles and use the 'she got on fine this morning'.

Wish me luck!

Tell your DP to go do some research on why BF is good. For starters: (from a US site, but I'm guessing breast milk is much the same over there )

"There are many benefits for both mother and child when a woman chooses to breastfeed. Human milk is custom-made for babies, with all the right nutrients and in the right amounts. There is no guesswork involved.

benefits for baby

Here are just a few of the benefits babies stand to gain from the breastfeeding relationship:

* less gas, diarrhea, and constipation
* stronger immune systems
* higher IQ
* fewer allergies and less risk of asthma
* fewer incidences of diabetes and cancer
* less risk of childhood obesity
* less risk of sudden infant death syndrome (SIDS)
* better dental and facial development, and decreased likelihood of dental caries

benefits for mom

The rewards of breastfeeding are often overlooked when it comes to mom:

* promotes bonding
* promotes uterine contractions after childbirth and reduces bleeding
* promotes weight loss
* less risk of ovarian and breast cancers
* economical?breastfeeders save over $1000 USD in the first year
* convenient?always available, and always the right temperature
* saves time?no formula to prepare, and no bottles to wash
* clean and safe?and available when normal supplies of food and water are interrupted

benefits for employers

Employers are increasingly supporting breastfeeding, for good reason?breastfed babies are healthier, and their parents miss fewer days of work.
benefits for the planet

In this era of increased awareness about our impact on the planet, breastfeeding is a good green solution?there is no excess packaging, no factory processing, and no transportation necessary.

From www.nursingmothers.org/html/why_breastfeed.html this site.

The compelling reasons for me are:

• your baby will most likely be healthier
• your baby is less likely to get allergies
• your baby is likely to have a higher IQ - I've seen it quoted as 6% higher
• when DS is sick, he refuses food and drink, but he will still BF. This stops me worrying about him getting enough nutrients at a difficult time

• it will help protect me against cancer - I'd be stupid not to!
• my baby weight and more dropped off me because of BF. I am now nearly 2 clothes sizes smaller than I was pre-pregnancy, in large part due to BFing.

• Formula feeding is such a faff, and what a waste of money!

:( about your DP. If you did ff would he be willing to do all the sterilising and making up bottles in the middle of the night?

here's a leaflet from the breastfeeding network about storing and using expressed milk. It says you can add together (cooled) milk that you've expressed at different times but only on the same day. It doesn't say that you can only put two feeds together

I only latched ds2 on properly after six weeks. I was feeding his twin, so milk was there. I gradually persuaded him back onto the breast, lots of night feeds etc as well as continuing formula/bottle feeds for some feeds. He went on bdng ill he was two. Tbh it was my husband who initiated the return to breastfeeding as he was fed up with trying to comfort a screaming baby in the middle of the night. I think he handed baby to me in the end and just said "this baby needs his mum" and I latched him on again You can do it!

Hi planner
REALLY pleased you have someone coming to help you today - well done! You wrote "I'm expressed 3 oz at a time, but been told I can only put together 2 different bfeeds (so that's 6 oz) and she is taking about 4oz so I'm wasting 2oz if that makes sense. Does anyone know if this is correct?" Do you mean that you can't combine the milk from more than 2 different expressing sessions into 1 feed? I'm really not experienced in bf, but this sounds wrong. Can you check with lll or the person u are seeing today??

sorry - marzipan already answered this!

What's to say you can't feed the 3oz you have expressed from one bottle then feed 1oz from the next bottle? When you start a bottle of bm you have 6 hours to finish it.

Here Kellymom says you can mix milk from more than one pumping session but you treat it as the oldest milk (i.e. if you put milk from Monday am, Tuesday am and Tuesday pm in a bottle you treat it as if it is all Monday am for storage purposes [could only keep until the following Monday in the fridge]).

Within a 24h period, you can put all your expressings into one storage bottle, if you so wish, and keep it in the fridge. Once the bottle has been 'contaminated' by the baby feeding, then it ought to be discarded within (IIRC - argh, check with Kellymom.com) 1h out of the fridge, or 6h in the fridge. Tricky calculation, so best to forget about the 6h bit and just remember 1h. Otherwise you have to think, how long out of the fridge, therefore only that much less time out of the fridge at the next feed. Too fussy.

Human milk does not need to be treated like ordinary supermarket milk. Oddly enough, the pasteurisation which makes commercial milk safer to drink, actually shortens its shelf-life. I don't know why. But farming families will all tell you that when they drink their own unpasteurised milk it keeps longer than shop-bought milk. So while you wouldn't keep and opened bottle of shop-bought milk for longer than about 3 days, a bottle of breastmilk will keep for nearly a week. 6days, IIRC. Again, check with the oracle: Kellymom.com.

So if you collect each day's expressings in one bottle, and pour out only what you think your dd is likely to drink at the next feed, you can keep the rest for subsequent feeds that day. At the end of the day, label the bottle with the date of collection and freeze it. It will keep about 3m in a good freezer, and will definitley be useful in that time.

As for your dh's attitude, it's a difficult one to change. My MIL gave up after 2w with her first, and therefore my dh was bottle-fed. Dh is a disgustingly healthy, fit, over-achieving holder of a PhD. MIL couldn't understand why, after I struggled so hard with my dc1. DH OTOH had lived with it, we had discussed what to do about prospective dc2, and he understood that breastfeeding was about more than the proven facts of the benefits it brings. The urge for me to breastfeed was as strong as, perhaps stronger than, the urge to have children.

But your dh sees your suffering and distress, things that can be dealt with now, as opposed to some nebulous future benefit, and in any case, he turned out all right.

Difficult.

BTW I was extremely glad that I breastfed dc2 and dc3 for as long as I did, when I discovered that they were both dairy-intolerant.

Oooh, also, pour off that extra 2oz and store it in the fridge, before you give baby the bottle. You will start having spare feeds in the fridge before you know it!

Good luck with establishing BF.