Hunger Strike: Support thread for those difficult to feed babies

[ClimberChick]

Reflux, distractible baby, nipple confusion, teething pain, growth spurt, slow/fast let down and more......... all welcome. I've noticed that there are few babies not too willing to drink the good stuff atm, so I hope this will be useful. A problem age seems to be the 3/4 month group, but don't let that stop you from posting.

I'm assuming that the babies are BF (which throws in emotional baggage as well), but advice will be on hand to FF babies as well.

Come share your stories, offer/take advice and general hugs and chocolate support. Because we know this stressful, emotionally draining and can make you:

• want to give up BF (if this is your method of choice)
• feel cheated out of that bonding experience that your suppose to have
• resent feeding
• feel like your baby is rejecting you (even though the logical part of your brain tells you otherwise
• feel under pressure, that you or your BM is not good enough
• feel guilty for continuing to BF
• and the general worry out your mind about them not eating enough

Links for identifying the cause here and here

general tips for feeding baby during strike action here

If your worried your LO isn't getting enough to eat, look for these signs of dehydration (which although rare is serious) and see a doctor asap

• dry nappies
• lethargy
• listlessness
• weak cry
• dry mouth or eyes
• the fontanel (soft spot) on the baby's head is sunken in or depressed
• the skin loses its resilience (when you pinch it, it stays pinched looking)
• fever

When I worried about time between feeds, I just remembered the nights when she went longer because she was sleeping.

A few questions:

-Has anyone found their dc will only eat lying down? Most the time I feed ds in a bouncey chair as he's upright but when he's having a bad time (usually last bottle of the day) the only way I can feed him is to lie him flat on his left side. Rarely fails. Doesn't seem to make sense though, before the gavison this was the only way I could get anything in him.

-Does infant gaviscon do strange things to your LOs poo? He does ones on it like concentrated curry paste, no bits or colour variation, perfectly smooth.

-Can you use things like gripe water etc. for wind as well as gaviscon? I don't like to give him too much.

-Lastly does your dc poo after EVERY bottle? I've started holding ds over the toilet/ a potty (he's 8 weeks) for poos as I know it'll pop out as soon as I move him upright after a feed. I know it makes me look like a nutter holding a tiny baby over a potty! Is this something to worry about, he used to do 2-3 a days randomly.

-Did you like me give up bf because of difficulty before you'd ever heard of reflux. I'm sad I did now and I wonder if I could of succeeded had I known.

Hi Strawberry. No experience of the gaviscon thing, but I know a lot about poos! My baby, also 8 weeks, is totally random, but tends to hold off for a few days then will do three in a day! I think it's equally common for them to go after every feed - especially BF babies, but totally normal in FF babies too. My first went after most feeds, and I can tell you, I prefer it that way! DD2 stocks it up then gets a sore tum. Think I'll try the lying down feeding thing - do you find it gives your DS more wind though? x

My DS has had little problem with wind, he's generally one you hold upright and it floats up. I'm only asking about the gripe water as we have a very occasional issue with it, I used it a few times a week at most. So I'm not much help in telling you if the lying down affects wind, for my DS it doesn't but then he isn't one to suffer with wind. It only works lying on his left, not back or right, he turns his head to the ground from the teat when he's had enough. No idea why it works but I'm trying to avoid it as much as possible because I don't want it to be the only way he feeds. I always offer milk in his bouncy chair at first, except for the last night time bottle as lying down helps him drink plenty to tank up (160ml last night after daytime feeds of 80ml!).

DS goes within minutes of a feed, plus extras. About 8-10 poos a day have been the norm this week. Tuesday he did 16 dirty nappies but that was doctor time! It's a new thing. I've started putting him on a potty as it's so predictable plus he fusses so much if dirty for a milli-scond. Also squeaks at me before going.

Strawberry yes you can give gaviscon and gripe water, and if you need to infacol, rantidine and domperidone. The hospital told me that it was all ok to mix with the possible exception of gripe water and infacol. We gave up on gaviscon because it made DS very constipated but spoke to the hospital at length about what you can mix and match (one of the few advantages of a very prem baby - you have access to lots of advise).

I can sometimes only feed my DS lying down. Strange given his reflux but if he's in a state he will often feed better if I lie him in his cot. Then I use EBM. The rest of the time he tends to prefer sitting up, although sometimes I want to be lying down!

For what its worth I frequently considered (and still do consider) giving up BF because of reflux and I knew DS had it from the beginning (the monitors in nicu/scbu correlated his breathing, sats etc with his feeding so they knew he was in pain/stress) It can be soul destroying trying to BF a screaming baby who is obviously in pain and I have never actually enjoyed BF. As I find expressing no less of a chore than direct BF (I know I'm odd on that point) these days I tend to give him EBM in a bottle when he screams as it makes him and me happier (as well as helps me to get some of the drugs in him). I know all you want to do is take the pain away and please don't beat yourself up about going to FF. You did what you thought was best and none of us really ever know what that is.

strawberry, lots of people give up bfing because of reflux, often before they know what it is. DOn;t feel bad. I only managed to keep it up because I suspected reflux and I had a lot of support, otherwise I' have thought my milk was making him ill - still feel that way sometimes... My useles GP said I should give hima bottle ffs!
Please do not feel bad - it is a nightmare and you have to do whatever it takes to get through.

Strawberry - forgot to say don;t feel bad about the BF thing, you gave it a go which is totally heroic if you ask me. BF is hard to do full stop, never mind if your baby has something like reflux. Can I ask how much your baby takes and how often? I only ask because I'm confused as to whether mine is taking enough. My first was nearly 2 pounds heavier at birth (dd1 was 8lb 9 oz, DD 2 was 6lb 10 oz) so I've got nothing to use as a yard stick! I'm worrying that DD2 isn't eating enough, but DH thinks I'm comparing apples to oranges, as DD1 was such a guzzler! DD2 is taking 3-5oz about every 3 1/2 - 4hrs.

Crazy-it's VERY erratic what he takes. He's hit 160ml at time, but occasionally 40ml. I guess he averages 120ml (3oz) every 3-4 hours. He was 8lb at birth and is now a shade over 11lb at 9 weeks (as he was at 6 weeks, diarrhea and virus affected it, I'll weigh again tomorrow and update). It doesn't seem enough at all, but so far he's gained well so I try no to freak.

I keep a record, here's a bad day (Tuesday)

5am- 70ml, 9am-30ml, 1pm-40ml, 6pm- 40ml, 8pm-20ml, 11pm-60ml

here's a good day (today)

3am- 140ml, 7am- 120ml, 11.130-100ml, 1pm-30ml, 3pm-100ml, 6.15pm-130ml

as you can see it's often barely 3oz (120ml) on the average feed. Some of those 40ml feeds took an hour of calming and re-trying.

120=4oz, sorry!

sorry can't help on the amount of formula, but in a way it's nice to see that even FF worry about their LO's eating enough (sorry, I know that sounds callous).

My LO weighed 11lb 5 at 18 weeks, now at 21 weeks she's almost crawling (so being little comes in handy).

disclaimer:crawling as defined by un-coordinated shuffles in the forward direction albeit with head still often attached to the floor

hilda I think most people find direct BF easier. Expressing takes me at least twice as long as feeding, but at least it comes without tears.

straw mine also prefers lying down with both breast and EBM.

I'm really happy that this thread has taken off (even if I've lost track of it already), now we just need some more non-reflux babies to balance it out (I like things to be even, my bad)

Bleeding nora climber, what time were you up?!? I'm really happy about this thread too, as most of my time seems to be taken up worrying about what DD2 is eating!

Strawberry - Sounds like you have had some really bad days with your baby. I sympathise hun! I think mine will be approx 10.5lbs now, so it's good to know that she's eating about what others are. She's been having 4oz every 3-4 hrs over the last two days, but on Saturday, I think we only managed to get about half that. I've come to the conclusion that she's just not much of an eater and gets a bit constipated now and then.

I think she gets bored when I'm feeding her, which results in her taking the bare minimum and pulling off too early and getting upset when I try to put the teat back in. So, I've adopted a new tactic! I'm just lifting her up from her naps and feeding her whilst still asleep! Dream feeds in the day. I've been managing to get the 4oz down her before she realises and wakes up properly. I've found this works pretty well. Not ideal, but it'll do for now.

On another note, what time are everyone's babies getting up in the night for a feed? I'm getting quite frustrated that mine is still doing the same as when she left the hospital - feed at 10.30pm, then up at 2.30ish. I was hoping she would start pushing this feed back by now. DD1 was through the night by now, but this one isn't even getting till 3am!Suppose I've got it better than some poor sods though!

My DS night feeds are completely random. We've had one sleep to 5.30, several to 4.00 - 4.30 average is still 3.00 am occasionally 2.00 am

feed before is between 10.30 and midnight - there seems to be a pattern of 3- 4 hour sleep from bedtime at 7, then 4-5 hours then 2 hours so 4 am is so much better than 3am.

I have no idea what to expect, ds is now 11 weeks corrected (22 weeks actual)

lol, I live in America, so I rarely post the same time as other people (unless I'm at work, like now )

A typically night for us are feeds at 20:00,12:00,3:30,5:30 up at 7:30 (although she doesn't like to eat until 8:30)

Crazy - no night feeds. I never thought I'd hate that. Some nights I get one, but more often than not now he hits the full 10-12 hours. I say he wakes one night in three. I tried waking him but he won't eat anyway, too sleepy. I want to make him bloody eat.

today

(monday 6,15pm feed,) tues, 6.30am, 11am, 2pm, 5.30pm, 8pm feeds,
100ml, 80ml, 120ml, 70ml, 130ml respectively.

depressed

Hi Climber - you had me feeling really sorry for you then, hehe! Aren't night feeds pants?

Strawberry - wow no night feeds, I am envious! I'm looking at how much he took yesterday - is that a normal type of day? How's he getting through the night on that bless him? Did you get him weighed?

He must just love his sleep! Does he nap much in the day?

Mine has had 3 good nights in a row (by that I mean one night feed and up at 6.30!) but I'm convinced my luck is going to run out! She's having her immunizations on Friday, so it'll all go to pot!

He's lost again, same weight at 5 weeks now he's 9 weeks (11lb). Just prescribed soya today to try to help with runs. No nights feeds doesn't mean I sleep! You worry to much and check a baby constantly that's eaten that little in the day and every 3 hours you try to do a sneaky dreamfeed. He naps anywhere anytime. He has about 3 by midday, my friend complained she's never seen him awake. He does about 30min slots of awake time then wants you to go away so he can nap. So far today up half six and feed, nap 7-8.15, nap in buggy on way to gp for 8.45, nap after gp in buggy, feed, nap in my arms for hour and half, ten min, up, now napping in chair. VERY VERY ratty is disturbed (I did a few times as he was smelly and with a week of runs I live in fear of nappy rash). By the way that's an average days feed, not a really bad day of 40mls.

Feed went:
smile smile- suck suck-scream-squirt-nappy change and soothe-smile-suck suck-squirt-nappy change sooth....smile smile. Bless he even smiled at everyone in a&e last week between pains when he was dehydrated and running yellow water everywhere. Hoping soya does something.

Oh hun, you must be past yourself. Are you ok? I'd be up the wall. I can't imagine much worse as a mother than not being able to give you baby sustenance. Hope the soy works. He should like the taste, I've heard it's much sweeter. Maybe that will encourage him to guzzle it up. There are all kinds of brands of milk for lactose intolerant babies out there - is that what your GP is thinking? I think that runny poos are a sign of an intolerance. I guess if the new milk doesn;t suit him, you can keep trying others until you hit something him takes. Does he drink much water? Sometimes my little one will not fancy more that a few oz of milk, but will guzzle down water if offered.

Maybe he's still recovering from his tummy bug and is just taking his time. His appetite might return with a vengance and you'll be up all night feeding him!! Here's hoping. I'll keep popping in to see how you're both doing. xx

Today has been good in the sense of the amount of food in him; 7am-120ml, 11am-140ml, 2.30pm-130ml, 6.30-50ml (still working on that one, just giving him a rest. It's been fucking awful though in terms of poo. 3/4 poos per bottle, plus during feeds, runny. Got soya (had to be ordered in) at 5.30 so one go so far. Everything crossed.

I am starting to get down, but at least I'm now been taken seriously and not getting the 'oh is it your first' comments/looks. I was at parents today and I think they finally got why I was fussing after seeing him feed and do 4 poos during a feed plus a lot of crying (only time I see tears when he cries, it hurts my heart). Worse my husband is away during all of this so dealing with it alone. Have been fine, but a week in my hard shell is cracking and I've had two cries today. I love him and it cuts deep to see all this.

So much poo I've given up with baby bath. Stick him in shower in mesh bath chair. Doesn't seem to ming.

Oh bollox, just checked him and he's fallen asleep straight away on 50ml for the night. Normally can get some in in the cot after a 5 min white noise lying on his side calm down. Will try a gentle nudge....

Aw, strawberry, sorry you are feeling down. We need to combine our 2 then divide them again and we would have the perfect baby! It take HOURS to persuade him to drop off or stay asleep.

Night feeds for us vary. He feeds and fusses all evening, often till 12 then he passes out. He'll usually feed at 3 or 4 then again at 6 or 7 and squirms his way through the night.

FOr some reason he tends to be easier to feed in the night - less fussy, more focused.

Why did I think that would work?! Sheets changed, poo and sick wiped up, baby changed...poor sod. Can't sleep now. Shit mother here.

You aren't a shit mother!

It's a nightmare having a kid with eating problems.

Might be worht sticking with the soya - it will take a few weeks for the old formula to get out his system I think?

Everyone says that Nicky, I think mine is so difficult to feed as he's sleepy and the whole experience well and truely wakes him up. In the day he's awake and we can stop and start as much as we like without the stress of over-tiredness.

Soy milk bottle has let to a record FIVE poos.

NIcky-for the wind for your boy a tried and tested method we use in Ukraine worked for us. Boil half a teaspoon of carraway seeds in half litre of water until you get a tea (seeds sink). Cool and feed water to baby (tiny bit of sugar if needs persuasion but not if not needed, I'm talking a few grains). It really does work. I gave him 20ml-30ml when very bad wind and it's magic. I gave little as he was so little but treat it as you would boiled water. Once a day did it for us with mild wind, but my BILs child had more. Google it, it's very common in Eastern Europe where we don't have all these medicines.

Thank god he's dropped off again. HE's beautiful if I do say so myself as his biased mother.

5 poos! Bloody hell.

Yes, they are so gorgeous....when asleep.

I'll give the caraway seeds a go, thanks.

I've used so many nappies I've started putting him on a potty after feeds as it's so predictable

Hey Strawberry, just checking to see how you've been getting on. I can see you're having a shite night. Have you googled lactose intolerance? It sounds very similar. There are threads on mumsnet about it too. They talk about a milk called nutragem (or something like that, can;t recall). The mums say it tastes pretty rancid, but you can dress it up to taste better by the looks of it. Also, it's not a soya based milk, so if soya's not suiting him in the long run, it might be worth a go. It's pretty expensive, but you can get it on prescription.