Dec 08 - the one where we wonder what are our bodies going to do next?

[rosmerta]

Sorry for rubbish title, best I could do

Well, ZJ, the one I'm listening to at the moment is simply called 'Classics For Babies: Soothing Music for Your Child'. Most of the tracks are very familiar but it really is nice. I bought the Classic FM one as well but DP's got that at the moment and I haven't heard it yet.

Hi everyone.
Mibbes Glad you got the CD, I picked mine up from a friend last night and looking forward to getting into it again!
I still would like to recommend the hypnobirthing CD's to everyone...and no, I'm not on commission!!!! Even if you just use it for relaxation it's lovely.

Feeling really tired, long annoying story which I wont go into but DS, DH and I were pretty much up from 3am....not happy.

olipop, hope everything's ok, poor you!

I am loving my plumber!

Had very vivid dream last night, Sawyer from Lost was my butler for some reason! It seemed so real, oh well

feeling very grumpy...oh well...DH out tonight on the razz so I can go to bed 10 mins after DS! Lets hope I am not woken by the big kid or the little one tonight!

I'm at work trying to check chemical specifications of aviation jet fuel...numbers are swimming infront of my eyes

not the most enlivening experience at the best of times!!!!!!!

mmm...rosmerta I love Sawyer from lost....wouldn't mind that dream myself!

That sounds hmmm..very interesting olipop. Was it the natal hypnotherapy cd you've got?

But hey Olipop, the one good thing about having a really crap night's sleep is that TONIGHT you will sleep the sleep of the angels and have the best night ever. Your bed will seem supercomfy and you will have no problems dropping off at all, and tomorrow you will feel fab

Your occupation sounds a LOT more technical than mine.

Incidentally - how did all you ladies who have done this before cope with the sleep deprivation? I am imagining 6 months of sheer hell and broken sleep, then another six months of semi-hell. Is this dramatic? Not dramatic enough? I'm clueless. Don't even know how often you have to get up in the night to feed the little blighters

It's very sleepy making!!!!
Lets hope neither of the boys ruin my angel slumber!!!!

LadyT sleep is the one area I'm really worried about too, especially as my DH works away for half the week, so there isn't anyone to share the load. Realistically, how soon can I hope the little one will start to sleep for at least 6 hours or more at night time? It will be very easy to torture me if I'm ever caught by baddies needing to know secrets, just deprive me of sleep for a couple of hours and I'll crack!

Yes, it was the natal hypnotherapy one...brilliant!

On the sleep deprivation issue I had a particularly nocturnal little urchin so did suffer quite a bit. He STILL wakes up in the night too but I think I have got used to that. I found the early mornings really hard (he often woke at 4.30 and didn't really go back down) and he still gets up at 5.15...god only knows why!
They are all so different..some sleep through almost from birth...some fool you into a false sense of security and then turn into night owls. Just sleep when you can and know that it will improve....at some point..and then as my mum says, they turn into teenagers and you can't sleep until they get in for the night!

I am more worried about DH than me on the sleep deprivation front, he is very grumpy when he doesn't have enough sleep, and also useless and pathetic! Plus he will have to work and I won't (for a few months anyway). And his idea of enough sleep is at least 8 hours a night! he loves me being pregnant as he gets more sleep! but that will all change soon enough.

I hope my DD doesn't take after me in that respect. I cried pretty much nonstop until the age of 2. My Mum tells me I was nearly a battered baby and the terrible thing is, I know she is not 100% joking...

Oooh dear!!
Anyway girls..I'm off now, home to feed and bath sprog and then get us both to bed!
At work tomorrow so speak then x

Lady T - like you, I was expecting the worst on sleep/crying - my mother has never stopped going on about what a terrible baby I was - according to family legend we went to stay with my grandmother, and my uncle (living at home at the time) resorted to sleeping in the office for some peace. But DD was fine - not one of those miracle sleep through the night babies from day one, but basically you could always just feed her quickly and she would settle again, so nothing too traumatic. I kind of got used to getting up a couple of times a night and doing a breastfeed while half asleep and then crawling back to bed, even when I went back to work. Amazing what you get used to. I actually found not sleeping in pregnancy harder, as after a certain point I don't really get proper deep sleep...

Olipop - do hope you get some rest tonight!

ZJ - I have a couple of the classic fm cds - there is a lively one and a bedtime one. DD used to bounce around in my belly when we played the lively one! The bedtime one is still her bedtime music, so they were well worth it IME.

Preggiejane - there is an article in today's Guardian about the breastfeeding thing as well if you are interested. Its a tricky one - I don't see any problem with milk banks like Veggiemummy describes, but the idea of actually breastfeeding someone else's baby (or the other way round) feels a bit wierd, not exactly sure why?

Rosmerta - i LOVE Sawyer. Hands off him, he is soooo mine .

Re sleep deprivation I have to say that with DD it was not as bad as I thought (and I NEED lots of sleep). From birth I would breastfeed her all evening to stock her tummy up and then we would all go to bed at about 10pm. She would then sleep until 3am, then I would breastfeed her propped up on pillows for 45 mins while I half dozed and then she would go down again until about 7.30am when I would breastfeed her lying down and dozing. We both finally woke properly around 8.45am. I don't remember ANY nights where she cried and cried and I was awake for hours. The only problem was she carried on in the described pattern for months, so although she started off better than most babies they improved and she did not. Finally at 7 months I did the controversial controlled crying to get her to fall asleep without a feed and it worked for us. Within two days she was self settling and sleeping 7am-7am!!! All was heaven until the early wakings started but I won't touch on that now...

theinvisiblehand had a read of the guardian article..... i think before i had an emotional reaction to the thought of breastfeeding another baby or visa versa, thinking of the health risks etc of another mothers bodily fluid, but the article pointed out, which i had forgotten, that we are screened for HIV and Hep, but i do wonder how far you know if someone has been exposed to other health risks such smoking or alcohol use?

But the practice of milk banks for premature babies is something quite wonderful

Thanks it certainly gave me food for thought

Don't talk to me about sleep deprivation! DD was terrible. Investigated all possible causes and tried everything - including reflux, sleep specialist, colic, cranial osteopath. Nothing worked. She just suddenly grew out of it at 8 months! Only prob was she didnt nap either unless being walked in pram so I couldn't catch up on sleep during the day. DH could only cope w 3hrs max a night because of the MS so I never got a significant amount of REM sleep. I ended up hallucinating and then breaking down at the baby clinic from exhaustion.

This time I'm interviewing a night nanny for one night a week. Honestly what with DD's birth then sleep deprivation we nearly didn't have any more!

I think it's random, though the traumatic birth didn't help. Have to admit to slight evil glee when a 'friend' who had very carefully explained to me where I was going wrong (because her baby slept) had a second baby that just wouldn't sleep whatever she did! (am mean person but lack of sleep does that to you!)

Invis, that all sounds quite positive. I suppose it's luck of the draw to an extent, what sort of baby you 'get', but I will try to get into a routine and just hope for the best really...

As to my own strange crying habits, the doctor finally suggested that my parents put me to sleep in the same room as my sister, who is 6 years older. My Mum thought this was a crazy idea - no one in the household was getting any sleep as it was. But they tried it and from that day forward I never cried in the night again...so a real mystery. I must've had an abandonment complex

arti, you can have him, he's really not my type which is why I'm a bit bemused to be dreaming of him!

LadyT it really is the luck of the draw. I was really very lucky with ds, in the beginning he had 2 feeds a night (midnight & around 4am) and then he was sleeping 7-7 from about 4 months and apart from the odd night here & there, that's pretty much been the constant since. I think it helped that he was in a routine and had a pretty specific bedtime routine, plus he was on formula which always fills them up more than bm. And he napped really well during the day which meant I could at least rest if not sleep.

I really sound boasting now don't I? This is why I never really spoke about ds's sleep patterns to any friends cos they all seemed to be up and down loads during the night. Anyway, am sure junior will be different and I will be prostrate with sleep deprivation!

LadyT - your doctor's theory sounds mad but plausible! I think I stopped being a cry baby when my brother came along (and we shared a room) and I don't think either of my sibs were anything like as bad...

We're toying with the idea of putting the new one in with DD once its out of our room, so we will see.

Verso - that sounds really tough though. Hadn't realised your DH had MS either - my Dad suffers from this and I know that looking after him is itself gruelling enough for my mum. You should definitely take advantage of any help available!

preggiejane - glad you enjoyed the article. I hadn't really thought about the health angles either really. For me its just a bit of an emotional reaction, which a can see isn't necessarily especially rational!

i really believe a lot of the sleep thing is down to the baby in my NCT group we all pretty much did the same thing (routines at bedtime all that jazz) and all our babies did different things. DS takes after me and likes his sleep he didnt sleep through for ages but when he did wake there was a good reason hungry, teething pain or ill and would get back to sleep quickly once whatever it was was sorted. He now as a 3year old loves a sleep in in the mornings with us (usually comes in between 5-7 and sleeps again until 8am!!!) I am a very deep sleeper so i think he got that. However other mums in group were doing the same thing and getting next to no sleep so you can try your best and do what you need to do but it is really up to them in the end.

I was also worried about how DH would cope with lack of sleep as he was practically in agony if he got less than 7hours sleep, were i had done years of night duty so was ok with it. But was pretty good he did more than his fair share of getting up to DS and at one stage when we were trying to cut back his feeds he got up to him all the time because he knew if i got up DS would smell my milk and try to sneak a suck. Also he did at one stage admit that he was happy to get up if it meeant i got more sleep so would be less tired at bedtime so therefore he had more chance of getting bit of action

Hello ladies

Been feeling very low and weepy the last couple of weeks, so have not been posting. Happily feeling much more sorted so thought it was safe for me to come back. Don't want to depress you all. Have been reading though and trying to keep up...

BF - I donated to St Thomas's milk bank when I was feeding DD2. I had a blood test for HIV and Hep B, then a further one at 6 months. They also heat treat your milk so it's long life, as it were. I filled in a lifestyle Q and perhaps they wouldn't have had me if I were a smoker, but a glass of wine didn't matter. You just don't express straight after drinking! Your body metabolises it quite quickly, so you can have a few whilst BF without harming your baby. St T's got early morning milk, so all booze well gone by then. I also gave a friend some BM when she wanted a night out and didn't want to give formula. Seemed to go down ok. I'm not sure I'd BF someone else's baby, but I don't have a problem with the idea per se.

Interesting, not all hospitals have the facilities to collect and store BM, so they buy it from places like Tommy's which do! £100 a litre - it ain't called liquid gold for nothing....

Prams - hideous travel system for DD1, hated it, Maclaren for DD2 and P&Ts for them both together. Now DD2 and soon to be born DS in the P & T, with DD1 having to walk. Recommend the P&T but if you've only got 1 (or are planning a bigger gap) I'd choose the maclaren every time.

Sleep - I have a very good sleeper (DD2) and a rotten one (DD1 aged 3 1/2). DD1 on a sticker chart to win Dora slippers for staying in her own bed all night. She's much better with DD2 in the room though. DD2 always fed and slept well. I had the laptop by the bed and would watch Sex and the City etc on DVD as I fed. Plus eat copious amounts of choc to keep my strength up. It was a very happy time.

Weird dreams - oh yes. So far, I've had Gordon Ramsay, Jay Rayner, one of the male dancers from strictly and someone I used to work with. I feel rather embarrassed when I see them on TV or in the paper. Strange as I have zero libido when awake but clearly loads in my sleep.....

John Lewis - my friend was messed aout over a carpet fitting and the "recognised her disappointment", as they so quaintly put it, to the tune of £350! Result! Always worth raising - there speaks the lawyer in me.

DDs asleep, so off for a glass of wine. Much needed tonight. I'll try to post more regularly now. Hope you are all well and happy.