Due April 2008 - the one where Mollyfloss does not have a rat!!

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Hope this works - and someone finds it

PM, I'm not sure really, I assume that would be a naturopath? I'm thinking acupressure rather than puncture which is a kind of cross between reflexology and acupuncture, they often use aromatherapy too from what I've heard, got to look into it myself though really.

Went to antel natal and they think baby might have turned

I have made a decision. Was reading Gina Ford and felt soooo inadequate and stressed so this is what I am going to do (if possible):

Carry baby mostly in a sling (read a bit in the paper that babies who are carried lots cry less). I don't care what Gina says, I WANT TO CUDDLE MY BABY AS MUCH AS I WANT so ner

Bf her when she is hungry

Let her sleep when she is sleepy

After first few weeks might try some sort of vague routine, but may wait to see if baby sorts out her own one. Am fed up of feeling confused about all the conflicting advice. If baby is unhappy or crying loads or never sleeping will review, but if that doesn't happen I will just carry on doing that and deal with issues as they come along.

Ellie, that's perfect
Cuddle baby when it wants a cuddle, feed it when it wants a feed, change it when its dirty and let it sleep when it's tired.
It really is that simple.
Baby will then develop it's own routine which you will learn to fit in with.
Sod the books, especially GF.

Feel much better now. Was getting all worried that wouldn't 'do' it right and baby would be harmed if wasn't doing 3 hourly feeds and sleeping through at 6 weeks or whatever. Bah. Am having a year off so can cope with being tired and I want a happy, secure, cuddly baby.

Have just had world's yummiest flapjack. God it was good.

3 hourly feeds and 6hour sleeps are a thing of books, what grown person ges exactly the same amount of time between feeds/drinks every day? Or sleeps exactly a certain amount of hours?
Pfft.
Bolleaux of the highest order.

Ellie: your plan sounds good. I haven't read GF yet but I will to see what all the fuss is about. Still, I know I am not going to take her advice about most stuff. For example, I will cuddle my baby when she wants or needs a cuddle! I'm interested mostly in sleep routines which I agree are not possible in the first few weeks anyway so that's for later. What worries me is that I have a friend who didn't believe in routines and at 4 or 5 months the baby was still waking tons during the night which was exhausting for both Mum and baby and very stressful and depressing for the Mum. Eventually my friend started a routine, depsite all she said and it's much better now. I am just interested in reading about routines so that (hopefully) this doesn't happen to me but I'm not interested in anything too rigid.

By the way, that same friend now has to stick to quite a strict routine. The baby is 6 months and once past her bedtime they cannot go out. My DH was saying last night that he hopes if we are invited around to friends for dinner, we could still bring the baby when she is quite young and she could sleep at the friends place. I've heard of people doing this but is it realistically possible? (GF would never approve of course)

Molly, IME and I'm sure the posters on ehre that already ahve babies will agree, the best routine is the simple 'now it's nighttime/now it's daytime' routine.
No stimulation during night feeds or changes, a bath feed and bed at around the same time every ngiht, activity during the day and noise and light etc and baby will gradually get used to being awake at the right times.
I'd imagine GF says something aolng those lines if she has a lot to do with sleeping through but I would not/will not ever advocate overfeeding or withdrawing feeds from a baby so mum can sleep. Not fair IMO.
Once you've read Gf you can come tell us all anyway

To be fair to Gina, she says you should never leave a baby be hungry and only leave to cry (and not for long) when you are sure has been fed/winded/is not uncomfy etc. And I like the points about day time and night time naps - I am going to try and do that - make sure there is a clear difference between them so baby gets idea is not the thing to do to play in night etc.

Trouble is, as my Mum is fond of saying, the baby won't have read the books so won't know what is 'supposed' to do....

I'm tempted to read this Gina Ford book just to see exactly what she does say.

It's not bad - all makes sense and isn't horrid, it's just very inflexible. Advises against a sling as might muck it up. In fact anything that deviates from the method she says seems to muck it up. And gives plan for first week that goes approx thus:

6.45 wake baby

Feed NO LATER than 7

7.30 wash and change baby.

8.15 Mum have breakfast

Baby has sleep for exactly x time

Baby is woken by x time

Must stay awake for x amount of play time

You get the picture. Every minute of your day is accounted for and things like school runs, for example, or going out, are not really allowed as will muck up precious routine. And I object to being told when I have to have breakfast.

Ugh, sounds similar to the Claire Verity malarkey on bringing up baby, that was the Truby King method, but very similar from what I can gather.
I think the truby king method is meant to be even more strict than GF thoguh, no visitors for the first three weeks and practically shoving food down the babies neck from a week or so old to force them to sleep longer, then ignoring them when they wake in the night.

Yeah - Claire Verity method was mad as a box of frogs but even GF said she didn't think that. She says feed throughout night, especially if BF but just trying to tweak times into routine gradually. And you should put baby to sleep in cot so does mean can't go out anywhere.

Yeah - Claire Verity method was mad as a box of frogs but even GF said she didn't think that. She says feed throughout night, especially if BF but just trying to tweak times into routine gradually. And you should put baby to sleep in cot so does mean can't go out anywhere.

sounds like shite to me and hard work!!

I just go along with feeding/sleep, but from age of 6 weeks i try to put in basket awake. They always fall into their own rountine that will end up being the same as yours anyway iyswim.

Am HUGE fan of day/night distinction - it works.

Take the baby out to friends - they will sleep anywhere and if baby doesnt and is screeching - well you tried.

Sounds good scorpio. I love MN. In RL people don't give me such useful advice.

Have just found out who my health visitor is and she is RUBBISH and really annoying. We work with them a lot and this one is particularly crap. She missed a big fat load of horrendous neglect in a family I worked with so I also don't trust her opinion at all. Do you have to see health visitors? Can I just go to clinic and ignore her otherwise?

and if you have sleepy baby after a feed and need to go out - just pick them up and put in car seat/pushchair - honestly if they are deeply sleeping they won't have a clue! if baby fusses try dummy or tiny bit of milk to get back to sleep.

The one thing i am going to stick to though is after 6 weeks i am putting down awake and will try to minimise feeding to sleep at that point. Also give baby (after sort of 6 weeks ish) a minute (literally) before you go to it - may be only stirring.

Ellie you don't have to unless you have a problem but you could see GP for it if you wanted. They normally weigh the baby @ baby clinic but thats about it. I havent even seen mine yet - she is very nice though and used to be my 2nd mum

No you don't have to see HV's, I'll see my MW for the first day or two (they usually come round for the first ten days) and tell her I'll call if I need her again, then when HV comes (normally after MW has stopped) I'll tell HV that I don't need the help either and that I'll call if need be.
Probably won't even bother with weighing if baby seems well fed and I can tell s/he is thriving but that's the beauty of third babies, they'll not worry too much about leaving you to it, especially if you have a support network.
If I do want baby weighed I'll just go to the clinic at my docs when I pick DD up from school.

Oh also meant to add if I need help it'll be due to establishing breastfeeding so I'd go to the breastfeeding clinic rather than a HV.

same here VS; i will go to clinic once a month or so but more for social side iyswimums tend to sit around and chat at our clinic

MW saw me for 4 days last time so i expect i will have about same again; may need more help if i BF.

PS- i rang MW re feeling crap and she was so kind, she is seeing me as an extra appt on weds. She is also looking into things for me to do antenatally (groups etc) to get me out of house. Also she said i could go on meds if i want to but i really don't, not yet. I will when she is a few days old. She said its fine to BF whilst on certain ones.

Yeah it will be, if you do decide to bf then everytime you speak to a doc just tell them you're feeding, they can always find something prescribable.

Ellie - good that elliebean has turned. Is she still called Molly?

My GP is very good, as is MW, so should be fine.