We will brook no argument for a boring, uneventful, blooming pregnancy; followed by a perfectly-timed pain-free sneeze birth; vol 5

[ScreamIfYouWantToMeetSanta]

Hi No Brookers! I do hope this has worked and is in the right place...

I've added a few extra sofas so we have plenty of space for all the Rat Smackers who will be joining us soon. There's also a nice long table filled with mince pies, yule logs, gingerbread snowmen and xmas puds! Plus some non-alcoholic mulled wine. I've strategically positioned a few clean glittery vom buckets under the table, just in case it's still a bit too early for xmas munchies for some people!

As you were...

Have just got out of the bath and can't be bothered getting dressed again - will do bump pic tomorrow! I don't have one from first time around to compare, though - just never bothered to take one. Today MW said bump was lovely, not the biggest but still lovely, and then canteen lady said it was huge and looked shocked to hear that I still had 9 weeks to go. bitch. Did I ask her to comment? No I did not!

Scream, you poor thing. I would so cry in that situation! Have you had any physio or anything for it? (Sorry if you have already told us, this thread moves so quickly I keep forgetting things!) Maybe go and get yourself signed off and see where you are after a week or two of rest - it might calm down enough for you to go back to work. Terrible those pesky holes in the Pringles tubes, too - shocking!

Little, totally agree with the internet-Munchausen's thing. I read a thread about premature birth when I was about 16 weeks and it really stuck, so much so that I have been counting each day as a gain in case I were to give birth right now. This is despite the fact that I have no history of prem labour whatsoever!

I think my stretchmarks are getting ready to start again - the old faded ones have developed red tips, which look as though they are going to just continue where they left off , thus reaching even further up my tummy. Waah!

I'm losing the plot. I am. The light thing kept dd quiet but 2.5 hours in not asleep, still standing up, singing to herself. I'm stuck half in half out her room again. Drugging her is sounding appealing...@!!!

Thank you for all your lovely words, everyone. Through talking to you and DH, I'm now feeling a lot calmer. DH pointed out that the last date was the 30th Dec, which was a while ago. I'll do another on Wednesday, and should find out by the beginning of next week (I hope). Decided not to bother the MW just yet, though if I panic a bit more later in the week I might! Realistically, though, they'd just do another test to see if it was still in my system, so I might as well just try to get that done as quickly as possible.

Little, I used to scare myself with those threads too. Especially when I was suffering from lots of bleeding. I'm quite level headed, but sometimes you just panic a bit.

Scream, so sorry about your meltdown :( It's so horrible, isn't it - especially when you know you're being irrational (or realise soon afterwards), which was me this morning! Why did I spent 10 minutes sorting through all my things erratically IN the train station, when I could have walked home, which I had to do anyway, and do it there?! Urgh, madness. Hope you're feeling better now.

Hawthers, I'm so so glad you're both home :)

Fabulous bump photos Purple and Biscuits! Just uploaded one DH just took of me, though it's not fabulous - and, having got in from work, I'm in a bizarre combination of top and PJ bottoms! 22 weeks yesterday. Lovely background too - oh dear - will do another one at some stage!

Musical - is your profile public? I just tried to go and look at your pic but couldn't get it to work. I could be being hopeless though as I am on my phone!

There you are - I'm half hopeless! I got to your profile but it says none of your photos are public.....

I can't see your pic Musical! Are your profile pics public? You're so right about realising AFTERWARDS about being irrational. When the pain got too much earlier I should have sat down quietly at a desk, and when I could walk again I could have limped down to get a taxi by myself. Instead of making a public spectacle of myself!

Too I do have a physio, and she's great. However she's already told me that I need to stop going into work as soon as possible, and she's talking about crutches in the future :( Unfortunately in my line of work January is our most hectic time of the year, leading to an important deadline at the end of the month. So I really need to hang on until then. I had a positive conversation with my development partner though (after I got home!), and she understands I'll need to stop working much sooner than hoped, and she's helping to find people to hand over my work to within the next couple of weeks rather than in March!

Dream how frustrating that your DD is still awake! Still, at least she's not distressed. Fingers crossed if she's been finding bedtimes as stressful as you have been then a couple of nights of calm (even if it's calm for a couple of hours!) will help her to get back into her old routine.

Little those threads are terrifying! Yet it's so hard to tear yourself away... Try to fight the temptation to keep looking! Easier said than done

I can't see yours either musical

she is distressed now scream, light lamp's off, crying and standing up etc etc.... boo!!!!! she's got serious staying power... glad you had positve chat with developmetn partner

Sorry, got absorbed in lesson planning (now there's a rarity)...

It keeps saying "Sorry, We couldn't find that picture". Maybe it's the browser I'm using..

Musical your pj trousers look just like mine! That's a very neat bump you have there!

No Brooking for Dream's DD to sleep soon! Clearly she gets her staying power from you Dream, so you can outlast her!

It's showing up for me now Biscuits. No sign of Scream outside..

Dream, as Biscuits says, at least DD's not distressed. Hope she's finally got to sleep...

I also like that mug you're drinking out of Musical

Seriously though, Musical's photo is working for me now.

And me now - and a lovely looking bump it is too Musical

Yes, lovely neat bump musical. My pj's are also strangely similar to you and scream!

Does it have to be morning now?? I don't want to go to the scary mw, I don't have a pee-pot, she'll do that sigh of frustration, eyebrows raised 'don't you know by now?' Cat bum face and I'm so tired I might just cry. She is very scary... Plus I had a horrible dream about going into labour, having the first baby fine then everything going wrong. I know its only a dream but its freaked me out a bit... So scream, were there any signs your friend was going to have a prem labour? Pg complications? I didn't last time of course, but this time the stats are different as my uterus will be fully stretched earlier!!!

Me me me.... Sorry.

Hope everyone else ok. Keep up the blooming and No Brooking, and good morning farley for your first one at home again.

morning everyone, hawthers so glad you are home, how lovely.
And some lovely bump pictures going on here.
dream did you get any helpful suggestions from the sleep board?

I'm having a little wobble today. Now i'm pretty sure what I've been feeling for a few weeks was not the baby but wind around the area the baby is in but now since yesterday I'm not even getting that. Its just because the crappy Christmas junk food is finished isn't it so my body is getting back to normal? I'm not feeling anything. Not a sausage. If it wasn't for a bump I wouldn't think I was pregnant. 16 week mw appt Thurs lunchtime. Please help me get there without freaking out.

At the moment all dreams are so vivid that they can be really unsettling, poor you Dream, I hope you shake off the post-dream shivers soon!

As for my friend, it's a scary story. From what I've been told there was no warning earlier in the pg, she wasn't ill and didn't have any complications. This is her first pg as well (like me) so there was no previous history to consider. She just woke up one morning (at 26+4) and her waters had gone. She went straight into hospital and they tried the usual antibiotics and drugs to stop everything, but she gave birth within 24 hours. I haven't heard anything more since that first day, but obviously she's busy and stressed. I just hope everything is going well for her and her DD.

I have a consultant appt later today which I requested following my scan last week. It was a private scan, just to confirm the gender, but the sonographer noticed that apparently one of my fibroids is completely covered by my placenta. No one at any of my previous FOUR scans has mentioned this, including my official 21 week NHS scan! This lady said that at her usual NHS hospital (all the private scan guys are just topping up their income on the side from their main sono jobs in a regular hospital) I would be immediately referred for additional growth scans to make sure the fibroid isn't stealing blood & nutrients from the baby (via the placenta). This positioning of fibroid and placenta runs the risk of delaying/reducing the baby's growth apparently. She completely terrified me! Either she's wrong (even though she's clearly an experienced sonographer and I have no reason to doubt her) or somehow the NHS totally missed this issue at my 21 week scan, therefore possibly endangering my baby! I've booked the appt today to get the consultant to look at my old 21 week scan pics and confirm if there's an issue or not. It's a bit nerve-wracking though. Makes me worry about prem delivery a bit more.

Plus it turns out my Nan had all 5 of her DC 2-3 months early, and at around 2lbs!! My Mum and her siblings are all fine thankfully, but I had no idea of that piece of family history until now! My Mum had all 3 of us at 36 weeks, which I know is technically early but not dangerously so. We were all around 5lbs. I'm freaking out a little now...

I've gone straight back into the essay-long me me me posts! I'm sorry ladies. It's just been playing on my mind. I'll be shorter next time, promise!

Lovely bump pics. If mine ever develops then I will post a pic although I've had my food one for years.

Hawthers glad Farley is home and doing well

Dream can you just go a bit earlier to mw and pick up a pot from reception and have it ready for when you are called?

Ninja I'm at 21 weeks and feeling no movement here so I'm sure you are fine

Scream if your Nan was 2-3 months early and your Mum only slightly early then you are probably going to go on to be late if you keep up the each generation being later tradition.

Sorry x-posts Ninja. I'm sure your LO is fine! Please remind me, was it you who recently confirmed an anterior placenta? I know Biscuits has one and she will be able to emphasise with you on this! My placenta's posterior and I still didn't have consistent movement at 16 weeks. I could only feel anything if I happened to be sitting still and not doing much at exactly the same time the baby moved. So I often didn't feel anything all day. Try not to worry, everything I've read says it's only really after 20 weeks that movement is more obvious, and you don't need to track it until 28 weeks I believe. You and LO are fine! As your mw will confirm on Thurs.

thanks for the reassurance jen and scream I just feel so much more anxious this time round! I guess I just floated around in the general loveliness of being pregnant last time. And thinking about it, it was way past this I felt movement last time. I remember being in a hotel in Hong Kong at about 4.5 or 5 months pg and feeling the first flutters so must have been about 20-22 weeks I guess? Right, positive hat is going on.
On another note, I don't know what to do with ds today? If it doesn't rain I guess I could take him to the playground later?

Ninja, I know some people do feel 2nd pregnancy movements a lot earlier, but I'm sure I've heard that the standard time is still only 16 weeks for starting to feel a 2nd baby. So you're really not late at all.

scream, I'm sure your consultant will be able to reassure you. At least they have discovered it now, and it might not even be an issue. Everything is so scary and worrying when you're pregnant though.

dream I hate the vivid pregnancy dreams. They freak me out for hours in the morning.

Well I'm glad I chased up my mw appointment, because it turns out they didn't get the referral letter from my gp . But the good news is they've fitted me in on Friday afternoon, which I'm really pleased about. Just need the scan appointment now, but the mw said she'd get the gp to fax the referrals again, so hopefully that'll come through soon.

ninja, 16 weeks is early. I got some little flutters at 15 weeks, but part of that must be because of the extra uterus-stretching of 2 babies. It was odd little flutters, no particular pattern, I'd just feel it and feel happy, and then worry I'd felt nothing for 24 hours! And I have a fully posterior placenta, plus was at one of my lowest weights when i got pg, and had lost loads with The Puking so not much padding to disguise it! I think you will have been feeling flutters, and these little tikes like to scare us good and proper it seems. You'll be so relieved at your 16 week appointment and be able to float aorund being happily reassured of your healthy pregnancy. And statistically the chances of anything bad after your 12 week scan are so low. Plus no-one is brooking any argument about it. I bet the movements will really start up again soon and you'll wonder why you had a wobble

jen, how sensible your advice re:pee pot was.... Good lord my brain is scrambled to not have though of that...

And actually, I ended up late for the mw (5 min but I was last appointment), she was waiting for me, and was lovely . Not scary today at all. Gave me a pee pot, no cat-bum face. Chatting about her grandchildren, etc. I asked her about whether me having a 'smooth' twin pregnancy so far meant I'd be less likely to go into prem labour but she said no, there's no pattern like that with twins, it could be just that your uterus triggers labour by feeling 'full term' early due to the sheer size. And that can happen to anyone. Plus they have no idea why some people have prem labour, it happens to anyone (as screams friend can testify). But she said my not having had a prem labour with DD has no implication for a multiple pregnancy. Even while that is not altogether reassuring, I feel reassured. maybe just by asking a professional about it. I heard the heartbeats too! Both found really easily, and the mw was laughing at the babies visibly squirming away Alien-style from the doppler. . Oh, and my bump measures 29-30 weeks at 25, she says I'm very neat so far for twins. So not as bad as I thought/feel.

*little8, the dream was so horrible, really realistic.... I was labouring in theatre, looking up at those circular lamps, while there was general activity and fussing over why all contractions had stopped, and trying to turn twin 2, and trying to find a hb.... Just way too realistic. It's still lingering...

scream, My friend's mum had both her children prem (as in my friend and her sister). Her sister had 35, 31 and 36 week pregnancies with her children- and they're all fine. But both of them hadn't had smooth pregnancies. My friend had her DD at 38 weeks. It's something to have in the back of your mind, but not worry about too much. Ask the consultant about it though (though you may get the same/similar answer to what my midwife has just given me, you may not be at higher risk at all!). Good job you'll be able to ask about this fibroid. I hope you go and they say there's nothing to worry about, but even if you do get booked in for growth scans, be reassured they're usually erring way on the side of caution. With DD they thought I had a single umbilical artery cord, which carries a risk of some congenital abnormalities plus IUGR. The sonographer booked me in for a 28 week growth scan plus one for the next week as they'd not been able to see baby's spine. I was really worried, but she said in all the single umbilical artery baby growth scans she'd done, there had never been a real problem. And she was experienced. So don't panic yet! (and at my next scan they had a really good look, and said it was a confusing view but they thought it was a normal double-artery cord- which it was so all fine anyway)

Blimey, joining you in essay length

thanks ladies, I think I'm getting in a better headspace now. I think i felt odd because I went from being burbly and a bit windy to feeling nothing at all and it was a bit odd and disconcerting. But you are all right and I know that 16 weeks is quite early still so I may not actually feel anything for another couple of weeks.

scream what 's the prognosis after your appointment?
dream glad your appointment went well and you are feeling somewhat reassured. Your dream sounds absolutely horrible, you poor thing. I'm not surprised you saying its lingered, the brain deals with the unconscious in a strange strange way. But you will be fine as the twins will brook no argument and neither will we.
right, off to cook dinner, will try to pop on later.

Ninja I'm glad you're feeling better about the movement issue. Soon your LO will be keeping you up at nights with constant movement and you'll look back on this week fondly!

Dream so glad to hear your appointment went so well, and the mw was able to reassure you. Sounds like everything is going nicely to plan so far, and our No Brooking will keep that on track!

Little good work chasing up your appointment, it pays to double check this kind of thing! Glad your appointment is so soon.

Well I've finally got back from my appointment, and it wasn't reassuring in the slightest! The consultant basically agreed that it is a real problem having the fibroid under the placenta, and that there is the potential for the fibroid to effectively steal from the placenta and therefore restrict the growth of the baby. She then said that if this does happen there's nothing they can do about it, and therefore they don't think there's any point in monitoring it at all! She wouldn't tell me how likely this problem is to occur, she just said that every fibroid is different. In the end she offered to do one growth scan at 26 weeks, but unless the baby's growth has been severely restricted already at that point, they won't do any other scans before 36 weeks.

I accept that they can't do anything but I feel like surely they should be monitoring anyway, and it could affect the timing of a csection if the baby's growth is falling behind surely?! Plus the other sonographer last week already told me that at her nhs hospital it's standard procedure to monitor growth in this situation, so I'm extra annoyed that my consultant thinks there's no point.

Just for good measure, when I mentioned my potential csection (in the context that I might need one irrespective of the fibroid position, because of my SPD) she added a whole new host of worries. She started talking about how scans are really unreliable for pinpointing where a fibroid is positioned exactly, and if they accidentally cut one during the surgery it can lead to uncontrollable bleeding and therefore they might need to remove my uterus completely! Now I'm assuming this is just the worst-case scenario but she presented as if it's a really common risk with csections for people with fibroids. I pointed out that my fibroids are posterior and therefore surely this was a very small risk for me, and she said "Oh well you never know, sometimes they cut in and there's a completely new one in the wrong place or the scan showed the wrong location." How helpful is that!?! Bearing in mind that it's the consultants at this hospital who are recommending I have a csection because of my fibroids, and now she's basically saying that I should worry about losing my entire womb in the process!!

I just felt that her comments were unnecessary and unhelpful at this stage, and seemed almost designed to worry me! I understand they need to tell me all the risks but I think that would be more appropriate at the appointment where we actually decide whether the csection is going ahead, and also she should explain the likelihood of a particular risk - i.e. is she really saying that a significant % of women who have a csection with only two fairly small posterior fibroids end up having a hysterectomy!?! Really!?!

Apologies yet again for the essay, it is appallingly long. I'm just really stressed out by this woman. I seriously hope she's not the consultant I'll be seeing after my 26 weeks scan, or at the meeting to decide whether or not they're booking me in for a cs.