We will brook no argument for a boring, uneventful, blooming pregnancy; followed by a perfectly-timed pain-free sneeze birth; vol 5

[ScreamIfYouWantToMeetSanta]

Hi No Brookers! I do hope this has worked and is in the right place...

I've added a few extra sofas so we have plenty of space for all the Rat Smackers who will be joining us soon. There's also a nice long table filled with mince pies, yule logs, gingerbread snowmen and xmas puds! Plus some non-alcoholic mulled wine. I've strategically positioned a few clean glittery vom buckets under the table, just in case it's still a bit too early for xmas munchies for some people!

As you were...

Aw :) Glad it went well!

Yay on scan and mw appointment. I love the special box idea too wants.

Congratulations Wants. So glad all is well. I bet your older boys are delighted they're going to have a baby brother?

Biscuits have you got to call the hospital in the evening then if you haven't got to 10 kicks? At least you know now that there is movement going on in there even though you can't feel it. Did the midwife say that's still likely to be the anterior placenta causing that?

Musical I'm glad it's not just me. Thing is I'm the last person who would cry at films (let alone a kids cartoon) when not pregnant

Purple I read your BFing posts with much interest. I had a meeting with someone at the hospital when I went for my 20 week scan about it. I think the organisation she was working for was called FAB? Something beginning with F, About Breastfeeding. It's quite clear to me now that the reason my milk production was so poor was because after the birth I was left on my own (DH had to come home for a rest and some food, he'd been in there with me for 18 hours by that point). DS was put in the cot next to my bed, I was completely bed ridden by the epidural (which I'd more or less been forced into having at 8cm dilated) and I couldn't get to him. I'd had pethidine throughout my labour after giving up with gas and air as it was making me violently sick and I'm sure that's why he wasn't interested in feeding, along with the fact it was a forceps delivery in the end. A midwife spent 5 minutes after the birth trying to help me get him to latch on and he wasn't interested. 12 hours after the birth he still hadn't fed and a midwife came and managed to get a tiny amount of colostrum into a syringe for him and that was more or less it for another 9 hours. Even then I was desperate for help as I could feel that it wasn't working. To be fair the midwives were extremely stretched and as it was Christmas week there was no BF advisor available. I struggled on trying and failing until day 5 when the community midwife came to our house, weighed him and sent us to A&E as DS had lost so much weight and was apparently very de-hydrated. By that point I'd mastered the latching on but sadly the milk production never really got going and we ended up in the same situation a week later. I persevered for another week or so with formula and BFing but seeing how contented and happy he was after a bottle rather than BFing resulted in me giving up completely by the time he was 4 weeks old.

Sorry for the long story, I've been reflecting on it quite a bit for the last couple of weeks. I'm keen to have another go this time and feel more confident about it after reading your posts Purple (sorry if you've fell asleep by now). But I also feel more confident about deciding when enough is enough and not putting us through the stress of him being poorly again. The lady at the hospital said she will make sure there is someone available to see me when I'm in after the birth and will spend as much time with me as I need. Fingers crossed.

Yes, the boys were with us for the scan! DS2 had a big grin on his face when she told us! I think they are looking forward to getting all their old toys out again!

I have a delivery date - my section is booked! 9th March, at 37 weeks exactly. Yay! Scan was also good - Bean has grown the perfect amount and is on the same centile as she was last time (more or less, anyway) for both head and abdominal circumference. The sonographer said she didn't need to to see my notes and didn't check the kidney as a result, so they've to do that next time. Bean is estimated to weigh 2lb 8 already, which seems huge to me. I was around the 4lb mark at birth, although I was a twin and born at 35 weeks, and DD1 was 6lb 15 at 41+3.

Congratulations on yesterday's scan news - all good!

Biscuits, hopefully LO will just be a nice big baby and the GTT will be normal. I would also hate to have to give up chocolate, even for a good cause.

Wow, Purple, that link is amazing!

Wants, hope the scan went well.

I watched the second half of OBEM and Biscuits, it is a Good Thing that you didn't see the forceps! They look horrendous. Both DH and I cried at the births, and panicked when the forceps baby wasn't breathing.

Purple, thank you for the bf tips. I am also determined to bf and have been looking up local support in case I need it. Might try to go along to a session before Bean arrives, as you suggest.

Fishcake, a move 400 miles away sounds just a wee bit daunting! Good luck getting it all organised and congratulations to DH on the new job.

Opps, I am an idiot and missed this whole page. Wants, glad to hear the scan went well and yay for a little boy!

Oops!

Great scan news wants. I like the box idea too.

Purple, that is a fantastic link, very positive for you dream!

That's fantastic news Too and does not seem long away now at all!

Need some brooking. Mini h in icu. Iv, o2, csnnulas ng tube the works. I'm not holding of together

Oh no Hawthers you poor thing. Are you able to say what the matter is? I don't want to ask loads of questions, but there may be someone who can help if you're able to tell us what's happened.

Goes without saying re the brooking. Wishing you and your family lots of love and strength ((((hugs))))

It appears some sort of virus or infection. Need to watch and wait for next 12 - 24 hours.

Oh no Hawthers, I'm so sorry! Much love to you both.

Oh shit hawthers, have you got lots of people there with you for support? I'm sorry to not have much advice, but remember that very little ones are treated with the utmost importance by the hospital and the amount of help they are given (oxygen, tubes etc) can look very scary. It doesn't mean your lo is not going to be absolutely fine. Brooking hard for you xx

Wants another boy for you and team blue on this thread! How wonderful :)

Scarlet I definitely didn't fall asleep! What a hard time you had of it :(
We recommend that everyone knows how to hand express and is part of the baby friendly training, here is a good article, simple and exactly how I would teach it :)
Basically if you express or feed within the first 6 hrs it gives it a really, really important kick start! But until about day three your milk production is controlled by hormones. Then it switches to the demand feeding that we all hear about, i.e feed as much as baby needs and as much as you can and this is where supply difficulties come about and hence the harping on about demand feeding from birth.
However, you can take from this that the baby has three days to get over their birth traumas and start feeding properly with minimal impact on your supply! (Obviously if there is blood sugar issues with the baby.etc then it is different)
It is also worth remembering that in a newborn baby their stomach capacity is only about that of a teaspoon, 5-7mls.
This time I think you need to offer the boob as much as possible, mind you I would say that to anyone! As it will improve your supply and do lots of skin to skin with the baby, as often this enourages them to feed when possibly they wouldn't. Boning up on Biological nurturing is helpful and there are lots of videos on youtube of this :)
Again see what help there is available in your area and I really hope it goes better for you :)

Oh Hawthers - brooking like crazy for you! Hope you have lots of RL support too. Come on mini H!!!

Scarlet - in the hospital notes there is a fetal movement chart which starts at 28 weeks (although it does say you only need to fill it in if you're told to). But when I said I don't get 10 every day before 6, the mw said 'haven't you been phoning the hospital then?'. I said I was only 28 weeks on Tuesday, and both days since I'd got to 10 by say 7pm. Since that's the same as it was up until this point (ie not a change) I haven't bothered phoning. But she did say the anterior placenta would probably still stop some of the feeling.

On the bf point, I can relate to a lot of what you say Scarlet - I was also stuck in bed after the spinal for the surgery and DS didn't wake for food or show any interest so I'd get a mw try for a few seconds every 3 hrs or so but the first night I was so tired and out of it I didn't know what I was doing and clearly DS hadn't read the instructions either so we had trouble too. We had a terrible latch etc and found it so hard to get going. I'm v scared that it'll be a problem again. I'd be interested to know anything else about the bf lady at the hospital - how come you got to talk about that at your scan (If you don't mind my asking?)

Wants very pleased for your good scan news.

Purple I'm hoping you're right about the big baby thing - DH is TALL and was a 9lb baby. I'm sort of medium height etc and I think I was 7lb ish? Can't really recall....

Hawthers - still brooking all out for you my lovely xx

Hopefully this link should help some of you find your local support or there are other links on the page :)

Just nipping in to congratulate on the good scan news and to brook vey hard for Hawthers.

Hawthers I am just popping in to say we are all brooking like no one's business over in the rat smacking room. Sending you and minihawthers all of our love x

Oh hawthers, how frightening. It does all look so scary but means he's not going without anything. Little babies go downhill quickly but can recover really quickly too. I will Brook No Argument that in 12 hours you get a good report and in 24 hours its even better. Much love to you and your family. And having a good sob is par for the course and doesn't mean you're not holding it together as much as is possible with your precious boy in icu Xxx

Lovely about your baby boy wants. Now, your MIL better beware if she thinks of saying anything about no girl!!! ( it was you saying about that wasn't it?!)

biscuits here here for total denial about the birth. I feel a little panicky if I think of either exit mode so I just don't, or in a very abstract way. But we will be fine, regardless of what happens. I think you'll just know what's normal for your UBB movement wise. After all, ringing the hospital every day isn't practical. I sympathize, as mine are very very active, then twin 1 goes quiet. As in nothing. This week for 2 nights 1 day- to the point I'd been posting on the twins thread, discussing with Dh and going to go in. Then the little tike moved back to the left and all normal ferretss-in-a-sack movements back. It's worrying. I think you're going to have your baby in 8 weeks. I don't know why I think that!!

Hello everyone else

Brooking lots for you hawthers must be so scary :( :(

Oh no hawthers how scary - so much brooking for you and your family. Let us know how both of you are on 12-24 hours time.

Oh Hawthers so sorry to have cross posted with you :( I am brooking hard for you and little Farley's quick recovery.

It makes me feel sad that so many of you didn't have the support with BF, but that is why I am doing what I am doing!

Brooking like buggery here for you Hawthers and Mini-Hawthers

gosh hawthers how scary. Am brooking with everything I've got for mini H to get better as quickly as possible. Much love to you both. Keep us updated when you are able. xxx

purple thanks so much for the links, I am about to go off and read them all. Just from what you've said so far I feel more informed than I was before.

wants brilliant news re the scan, how old is your ds2? We're taking ds to our 20 week scan in feb and he's 4 and i think he'll be super excited to find out if its a boy or a girl.

biscuits I guess you get to know what level of movement is a normal day to day amount for you to feel and take it from there? It must be difficult to know when to phone? I am another one in birth denial. I know its got to happen but I'm really not ready to deal with that just yet.

too great news on the cs date! And congrats on a good scan.

Well I'm pooped. Going to chill on the sofa and watch the rest of location location location (and pretend we're not actually going to have to move house to fit this bean in).