Walking together on a journey - sharing experiences, tears, anger and sometimes even laughter. United we stand, divided we fall.

[shabbatheGreek]

This special thread was started in 2008. Its a special place - one which nobody would ever willingly come to. I hope we pay tribute to our lost children by helping each other. xxxx

thank you - thats brilliant.

xxx

chip, I'm blubbing! That is so beautiful. Thank you for that.

May we share it, chip. This really speaks to me, as a bereaved parent.

Oh yes, share if you want to xx

I agree with you about shabbs. Sad that she's there to do it, but she really does show us the way. Mia's does too.....

Morning ladies

What an amazing poem Love, and it describes so well the bleakness but the companionship you can get from others in the same situation. And true about Shabbs, too.

To everyone else, hello! I am sorry I haven't name checked you all, I haven't posted for a few days so there is quite a bit to catch up on. I have read all your posts and have been thinking about you all. Anniversaries coming up, people asking how many children we have or even the day to day grind of life and well meaning but ill placed words are what we all have to contend with day to day and it is awful. Tiring. Draining.

It is strange how a string of posts on a forum about loss connect us all together - and yet we all go about our day to day lives amongst people who have no idea and we don't really know each other. I don't know if that makes any sense at all.

Anyway I am here, not great, but here, just lurking and absorbing, tired, so tired and wishing I could wake up from this nightmare. I feel like I walking through mud. Does that go away.

How do you deal with others, having to see other people? There are a few events coming up that I really don't want to go to, I'm not in the right frame of mind - especially when some people will be there who have not even text, sent a card or anything since my baby died, but are happy to tell other people about what happened to me, as if my life is a bit of gossip for them. I feel such vitriol towards them, even though there will be other people there who have been so very kind to me, I cannot deal with putting my precious baby in their line of fire (so to speak). Inevitably what happened will come up and I don't feel that I will be able to not talk about her, but I also don't want her gossiped about or my feelings talked about by someone who pretends they care, but really haven't been there AT ALL. (Can you tell I'm angry) What would you do?

I haven't responded individually to all your posts, but I am here and I am sending you all virtual hugs (is that ok?) and kindness and a hand here in the darkness xx

I think when an 'occasion' happens - party, wedding, christening etc etc only go if you really want to. If you go make sure you have an 'escape plan.' Never be afraid to just go home if it all gets too much. As for other people wanting to know every detail and your situation being their main topic of conversation - I have no answer for that - other than pity them if thats all they have to think about.

The 'early stages' of the loss of a child are awful, truly awful, revolting, gut wrenching, mud/treacle swimming terror. I promise it will improve....I also wouldn't go back to those days for a million pounds. xx

theday the first thing I would say is don't feel you have to go to anything at all. Some social events are too much. If you don't feel able to go, don't go. If anyone has a problem with that, they're not a friend.

If you do feel you have to go, try to surround yourself with the kind people. I have ended up latching on to people that I know "get it". I try to avoid the dhac's if I can.

It is hard, isn't it?

theday, i dont have much advice or wise word but i totally get what you mean about feeling your life is used as a bit of juciy gossip

i felt that way very much so too, still do a bit to be honest

i remember at messy church of all places someone had never really talked to me came over and said sorry to hear about whats happened etc ok fine
then went on to say.... oh so what did the drs say caused it[meaning my sons heart problems] [we where told from the drs basically bad luck]
but her question and the way she asked it with a glint of glee in her eye really threw me
it was really gossippy the way she said it

and i thought it was quite a rude question to ask
esp since she never really talked to me before that or after

one thing that is easier two years on, is its old news to most people
you know people that are not really friends but you come across them in everyday life
like on the school run etc

i still feel like people see me as that person
that person whos baby died as if it defines me
which it does in a way, well not define me as such but has certainly changed me for life

not only do i miss my son
i miss the old me at times

but try to tell myself the new me is more thoughtful and compassionate deeper

Hi ladies,
Thanks for your advice, Shabbs, how long does it take for the walking through mud feeling to go? I get so frustrated as I can't function properly, even on a 'good' day.

Love, you're right, it's soooooo hard. I find it's like I've had a complete emotional breakdown and any stress sets me off - the thought of being around people makes me anxious. Yet with other people who make me feel safe I don't feel like that.

Diamond, I find gatherings to be the hardest, especially when people come up to me really cheerfully and expect me to be all chatty back. I feel like 'are you serious?' I can't sit and beam and make mindless conversation. It's too surreal. I can talk in small bits and pieces about life, what's going on etc, but I find sometimes people don't want to acknowledge the elephant in the room by trying to be too cheerful and it makes me, well, sick. I find myself most socially awkward now. Whereas before I was not. I was chatty and positive.

I find it's like fighting against peoples expectations of what you should be. You feel inside like you should be able to do certain things. Yet you can't. You feel like people are thinking that you should be 'moving on', yet in reality I have no idea what they are thinking.

I do realise now that over six months in, people are starting to expect me to be different to how I am. Or in a different place, but big gatherings make me awkward, dealing with lots of people makes me feel anxious and peoples words hurt me the most - even if they think they're being kind.

I find it hard to reintegrate into my old world. And yet, if I feel comfortable or not anxious, I can chat, and joke. For a while, anyway.

Thank you ladies for your words of wisdom. How do you deal with the anxiety?

I know what you mean. I'm now six months and one day in and I feel that some people expect me to be functioning differently and not to be counting the months so much. I don't understand it. I count the days in my mind.
Sometimes I can put the mask on, and sometimes I can't.

I remember people talking about a man who had lost his son years ago and saying "He never got over it" in a way that implied that he should have. When of course he never got over it.

32 years (almost) and 22 years (almost) since I last saw my boys. I dont know when the swimming in treacle stopped - if it ever has. I am not as good with coping with stress these days. I go to my parents and do all the practical stuff for them - you know the cleaning, feeding and laundry BUT the emotional side of it makes it feel like my heart is going to break into two.

You learn ways of coping for most situations. You become more compassionate with people who are having a difficult time, or are newly bereaved or just generally struggling to get through each day. You are never the person you used to be - you are different but I think much more compassionate.

We are all walking the 'crappy path' - the path that seems to have no light at the end of it BUT if we walk it together and help each other it is infinitly better than walking it alone. xx

Lily, it's amazing what you can accomplish when you've got the mask on isn't it? I find that I can do maybe a day or too of perhaps 70% functioning and then the next few days I'm wiped out. I always find that if I do too much. Do you find that on those down days you have to hide away?

Love, oh if only it was that easy "to get over it" and I must admit I may have been inclined to think that way before this happened to us. (Because it was too awful to contemplate otherwise). I think half the battle of grieving is feeling so isolated and lonely because people don't understand you or what you're going through.

Shabbs I'm so sorry to hear of your parents and their ill health. I know I've said before but it is unfair. Unfair to see them getting older and having health problems and just unfair. I often think of you and of your sons. How is your grandson (the earlier threads made me smile)?

Do you find you have happier times or are they marred with the loss? I read some accounts of people who've lost a child and they'll say it's awful but now they can feel happier times and appreciate life more. Is that possible?

I've just gotten into bed now, early night for us here. I hope you all have a peaceful evening xx

My grandson will be 6 in June!! He is loving primary school and is as bright as a button. Asks a million questions about aliens, whirlpools, tornadoes, lost city of Atlantis, the moon, the Bermuda triangle etc etc etc. He is a delight....ginger curls and massive light blue eyes. He is having a 'Valentines day sleep over' at our house on Saturday

I find that I genuinly do have happier times - in the middle of a 'better day' I think about the boys - not with sadness just with a 'wish you were here to see this' kind of feeling. Matt will be 30 in June and we will be having a party for him - no doubt getting slightly drunk tipsy and singing his favourite songs. His favourite song was 'Pump up the jam!!!!' I only have to hear the opening music of that song and I sit and grin at Matts memory xxx

love thank you for putting down our experience in such a fitting, eloquent way. So, so beautiful. And so, so right. xx

theday - yes, you will have happier times. I also needed to be told that it would be possible. However, I always maintain that I will never be 100% happy ever again, that is simply not possible without my beautiful Mia.

diamond like you, I used to get furious at the voyeuristic way some people (a very few, admittedly) would say to me in a faux-sympathetic voice - "And how ARE you?" yet they hadn't been there for me to cry on, or to understand in those terrible early days. They popped up later on, not having the courage or skills to deal with my grief - and I simply felt that they did not deserve to know anything about how I was, or if I was feeling particularly sensitive, sometimes I would say something very blunt like this "How do you think I feel? My daughter died. That's an impossible question. You really don't want to know." My mother would try to point out that perhaps I should try to be more understanding, and that they probably didn't know what to say, but I was adamant that it shouldn't be me taking that role.

lily don't wear the mask too much if it's heavy. Paddy wouldn't mind. Tears are liquid love, as MrMia always says.

mias, oh yeah, used to get that from one mum in particular at the school gates everyday
headtilt check
high pitched sympathic voice check
and how arrrrrreee you

every fucking day
wasnt even someone i was friends with

one day i snapped
im ok a half shouted in a really pissed off tone
she never asked me again

good

another mum, who i like more but not friends with came upto me at a childs party and asked how i was coping
uh
i ended up snapping well im just getting on with it as what choice do i have
i must have come across as a right cow, but i just didnt have the skills to talk about how i feel and it wasnt really the right situation for me really

i found that seriously hard
going to childrens birthday parties
and making mindless small talk with the other parents
truely hideous
my dd was in reception so there was loads and loads of parties almost weekly it seemed
i used to come home with headaches and cry about it
and theres been a few times thats happned and ive posted about it straight in here
miasmummy and shabs might remember!
but thats one thing that has got easier
as people are less awkward around you over time

one thing i did like was when it was my first day on the school run, the teaching assiatant, touched me on the arm, and said its good to see you

a simple, non invasise touch of kindness, she didnt ask me how i was
an impossible question as you know
she didnt say oh im so sorry blah blah

but in that simple exchange
i knew what she was saying to me

i will try to remember to do that
if in that situation with someone else

It's a gradual thing. I remember thinking that a holiday dh and I had planned was a bit pointless. Everyone in our family thought it would do me good except me. I knew I would be miserable on the holiday. And I was. But actually it was better to be miserable in the sun than in the cold and rain.
Two years on, I actually look forward to a holiday. And I have laughed aloud and done karaoke and danced in my SIL's kitchen to Garth Brooks.

Sylvie-Rose is always on my mind. And it will never, ever be ok that she died. But I live around that fact.

Funny enough, on another forum I'm on, not bereavement-related, one of the lovely ladies has cancer. I commented one day on how brave she was and she said, she didn't feel brave, she was just getting on with it.
And I thought, oh crap, I've probably said a dhac thing to her. I apologised at once! I might not have checked myself if I wasn't all-too-familiar with being spoken to in platitudes.

Oh love I didnt knoe you liked garth brooks do you like that song the dance?
I often think about ds and listen to that

Agree about the might as well be miserable in the sun comments
I think when I do stuff I like but dont enjoy as much as before
well better to sad and happy and the same time rather than just sad.

Morning girls xx

Morning shabs!

diamond, it's more SIL who is the Garth Brooks fan! There has been a bit of a hullaballoo over here as he is playing in Dublin. All the concerts sold out and SIL didn't get a ticket and was very upset. And then he announced two more dates and she got tickets. So the dancing in her kitchen was to celebrate that!

Afternoon all.

Shabbs, I can't believe that he will be six (from my reading all the posts and past threads I thought he was still little). I love that age, when they're still little and lovely and inquisitive and like cuddles. :) It is good to read that there can be some happiness amongst it all. I guess the missingness never goes away though? Perhaps for me, accepting that I will always be 'missing' my baby is part of it. I can't keep fighting it.

Mias, thank you, I needed to hear it too. Although, do you find that she is on your mind always - and if so how do you live with that, does it become almost comforting in a way?

Diamond, there are so many DHACs around, that I find myself getting really irritable and short with them - I can't help it. It's taken all my mental energy to get out of the front door, and then they say something stupid which knocks me back. I've found that I have a severe aversion to people who annoy me. I read an article in the Daily Mail (of all places) yesterday about a lady who lost her fiancé the night before they were due to get married. She talked about how she suffered from PTSD and had lots of counselling, and she said something like the "innocent words of well-meaning friends would erupt like hand grenades inside her" and I knew exactly what she meant. Although her situation was different, I could empathise with the emotions and fragility she felt.

Love, I have that mentality too, that I might as well be miserable elsewhere. Especially when there are other children to cater to. Sometimes I find that for example, we took the DC's for a day out recently - I didn't particularly want to go, but when we took them and saw how much they enjoyed being out, going on a train, etc - that prized a little chink of light into my mind. Does the fact that Sylvie-Rose is always on your mind, do you find it quite draining sometimes?

I saw the comment you said about the other forum you were on, and how you apologised - that in itself means that you do have a clue, you do understand or at least have empathy for the lady in question. I find it's the people who don't even realise what they've said to be the ones who truly DHAC!

I've been all over the place today, crying this morning, to having normal conversations (at work), to feeling the fog, to feeling a slight bit of happiness in that I accomplished some things at work I've been meaning to do. Oh, it's like a big mish mash of emotions in one day. There's been a couple of pregnancy announcements today, I've noticed more mums on the school run with bumps or newborns….I wish my baby could be here with me. I can't help but think what is wrong with me, why did I do this to her? Oh my baby, I miss you and love you everyday xxxxx

Hello to Lilly, Heavenly and anyone else who I have not mentioned. I hope you are not getting washed away with all this rain :(