8week miscarriage isn't quite the same as delivering a full-term stillborn?

[Lira]

I'm really sorry for the upsetting nature of this post but i am heartbroken. Tomorrow is the third anniversary/birthday of my stillborn son who was born full term. I have phoned round my friends to ask if they are free to mark the occassion like we do every year. We go for lunch or something. We talk about him.

My friends have been quite evasive about it this year and finally one called this morning saying she thinks i should let it go. I can't keep letting this haunt me forever. She had a miscarriage at eight weeks a few years ago and i don't see her organising anniversary lunches etc. Her words.

I'm so sorry if this sounds cruel, but to me - yes, they are two horrible situations but not quite the same. Delivering a full term baby, and holding him, getting a photo of him etc is not on the same level as a eight week miscarriage. Just as i think someone losing a child - for example a baby to cot death - is again far worse than delivering a still born.

I understand that everyone has different emotional boundaries. So for some people, a miscarriage at 4 weeks could feel the same as someone losing a child to cot death.

Basically, i jusst feel quite embarrassed now and isolated. I want to celebrate Ethan's life no matter how short it was. But i've been made to feel it's insignificant. Am i being unreasonable thinking both of our children's deaths are terrible, but not quite on the same level?

Yep, moved away! Nice one, HQ!

Oh OP I am sat crying thinking of you and your loss. Of course you should not just let it go you nurtured him through your pregnancy and he was born and on this earth albeit briefly. I had a miscarriage at 9 weeks and I still think of that baby 15 years later and 4 children later so emotions can be raw whatever stage of preganacy. However cannot imagine your pain. Do something by yourself and I will be with you in spirit x

Those of you who want to discuss still birth in general, and crusade for more openness about it, can perhaps start another thread in Aibu, and leave this thread for supporting the OP?

Lira - so sorry for your loss. It must be the hardest thing.

I agree your friend was completely insensitive. Nothing can compare to losing a child who has been born. Does you talk about it with your DH? If not I think it is time that you both did. He is really the only person who can understand fully what you went through.

Why does there need to be another thread? So that one can be moved as well?

Yep, go private, Lira. People don't like to see anything about child loss, unless it's stick knives into the McCanns, on here.

Well Said QuintessntialShadows.

Lira, you're in my prayers

But surely that is the point of the thread quint?

lira doesn't feel she is able to talk openly about her son Ethan who was stillborn.

It does need bringing out in the open.

mnhq thats a shocking decision .... poor op posts in area which is sure to get lots of responses and therefore lots of support and because someone might be upset by the subject it gets moved

poor op also got arguments, did she not, hence Aibu was not the right place?

Lira is being shut up in RL which is why she posted on AIBU. And now Shadows you want to shut her up again.

Hmm unless the OP requested it be removed its sort of proving her point no?

This is crazy.

Op if you're still there and want to chat come and talk xx

OP, did you ask for this to be moved?

I am surprised that anyone thinks it's OK to demand that someone grieve for their dead child in private. Mostly people are lovely, kind and thoughtful, but even on MN there are some utter twats.

OP, did you challenge your friend who said this?

Lira - have you decided if there is any kind of memorial you would like instead of the lunch? Have any of the suggestions on here helped?

I dont want to shut anybody up. I have not requested the thread moved. I have just pointed out that arguing on this thread whether the thread should be moved or not, is perhaps not supporting the op.

Lira I am sorry if I hijacked this thread with that post ...

I just feel when you have been through the tragedy of a stillbirth you dont want to have to hide it.. you want people to acknowledge your child as part of your family

Ethan will always be your child and you will always have time and space in your heart for him

i think that was the point of your original post and I think mnhq having moved it have underlined your point beautifully.. people in general dont like talking about stillbirths ....

Its the last great taboo of our society...

its a heartbreaking reality of having a stillborn child.

Well it's been moved now so let's all shut up and give lira some support.

Has she asked for support? Perhaps she wants a debate. This is AIBU after all.

There is a difference, though, Expat between forgetting and moving on.

My DH hasn't forgotten his little boy (none of us have, and I never even met him) but life has moved on and he's remembered in different ways now.

I do believe there has to come a time where you can celebrate what there WAS rather than grieve for what there was NOT. Does that make sense?

It's not healthy to expect your friends to mourn. It is acceptable to have them mark the occasion in some other way. Raise a glass, charitable donation etc., I'm not saying don't talk about it.

Oh, no it isn't any more

Sorry for your loss, OP.

I think your friend is being U for starting the comparison, but I don't think it's helpful to continue it either. I've had two early losses after IVF and, while a stillbirth would have been worse, it wasn't easy either.

This is really tricky to say without seeming overly harsh. But I guess that, usually after bereavements, people rally round at the first year or so, they tend to expect the bereaved person to manage with a little less support? Obviously no-one would expect you to forget and the people closest will get in touch. I try and do something special for someone the first Christmas or birthday after a bereavement - a special present, organising an event, raising money. But I couldn't keep going with this for all the people I know every year, as, sadly, most of us get more friends who have experienced losses, or experience them ourselves, as we get older.

I think what I'm trying to say is if your friends have already done two anniversary lunches and were there for you at the time of Ethan's death, that maybe you could have a smaller lunch with just your family, without writing them off as bad friends? I think your friend was really tactless and I don't think they've handled it very well. I also don't think they've forgotten, or will expect you to have, or will let the anniversary go by without sending a card or a text. But, maybe it's best for everyone if you do something a bit different than lunch with friends.

My suggestion would be to do some sort of fundraiser or volunteering, and that way you're channeling your grief into something that helps others. Depending on what charity you picked, it also might help you meet others who have a better understanding of what you've been through.

She didn't come here for support, Quint, she started a thread in AIBU and I'm sure she, being an intelligent person, understands what that means.

But let's shut her up and shunt her off to Bereavement, she needs to be more private about her son, apologise to her 'friend', change herself as one person put it, etc etc.

I have just pointed out that arguing on this thread whether the thread should be moved or not, is perhaps not supporting the op

Is that what she posted in AIBU for though?

I didnt get the impression that it was purely support the OP was after although of course I would expect replies to be as kind as possible to someone in OPs position.

Every year in November my friends rally round me. They buy me cards and flowers, they drag me to the pub, they text me and phone me.

They remember Oliver.

Who the fuck told her to apologise?