Dd is hated at school, no friends, and just having a miserable time. Even dh seems to dislike her these days, and she does have some annoying habits. What on earth do I do?

[Feelsosorryfordd]

God, this is a brutally honest one, no punches pulled.

Dd1 has always been slightly 'different'. She has always played by herself in complex imaginary worlds. She has always been touchy, awkward and a bit gauche. She does do odd, sometimes irritating things like make weird screaming noises, and keep repeating the same thing over and over. She just doesn't 'connect' with people.

However, now she has got to 6yo and Year 1, it is starting to get really problematic. My heart breaks for her when she comes home from school every night with another story about being bullied and hated.

She says all the children tell her to 'Get Lost'. She developed a friendship with a new girl who started at the school this year, but within weeks, this girl was telling her she hated her.

What the hell do I do? Even at home, her strange behaviour is starting to get on our nerves. The strange obsessiveness about toys, the refusal or inability to see anyone else's point of view, the strange squeaking noises.

Is a child psychiatrist going to be able to help or shall I just leave her be, with love and support, to develop her own personality, albeit a fairly anti-social one???

"Who knows, I might learn a thing or two from them as well?"

Absolutely - when I read that unwritten rules one I kept saying "damn why did noone tell me this!"

Haven't read the whole thread, but wanted to say to OP that I'm so glad she is interested and caring and doing what she can to help - I was very much like her DD at hte same age, and my mother hated me for it - and still does - and my father did nothing when my mother and sister picked on me verbally and physically - and I have spent many many many years getting over all that.

Something that might work well for OP's DD is a group activity like scouts (guides? not sure what they're called here) where the people organising the activity are very clued-up about people (i.e. monster child) management, disability, inclusiveness etc. As well as being an environment where everything will be geared towards acceptance of the DD, it will also give her a lot of life skills - and if she is a bit obsessive all the better if she sticks around in that environment for years, as she will continue to learn life skills in a relatively safe environment.

(I do realise I sound like an old fashioned scoutmaster saying "get her into sports, dammit" but I found this kind of thing really helpful)

Ooops. Just read Mrs Flittersnoop's post. Fair point about scouting/rugby etc not being called for in any given situation.

But I actually found that team stuff was the least fraught environment, because it was very straightforward: if you did your stuff correctly, then you got your badge/ won the game / whatever and noone could argue against it - and eventually the NT little sods came around to being nice because I'd done the same stuff as them, not harmed them in any way, and (shock horror) turned out to be just like them in most ways...

It might be worth a try if nothing else.

as different views have been expresed about scouts/guides here let me say that I think my child has been helped a lot by being with younger children. They are the same development stage physically and emotionally and therefore have more in common. Scouts and guides can be great for that if your child is older than the average age of the group.

Also such groups tend to be run by mums who are used to trying to involve everyone and they often have quite a high adult to child ratio.

Later on volunteering to work with young children can be good for boosting confidence.

I wish someone who study how high functioning people cope. Personally I think a lot of it is ensuring that your child's confidence is not destroyed.

Tatt - I agree with this.

Working with younger people and connecting with them, is the part of my job that i love the most. I still feel behind with respect to people my own age.

I got most of my confidence - the unassailable feeling of real confidence as opposed to smugness that can go sour when someone cooler tries to dent it- from going on camping trips/ expeditions that required a fair amount of endurance and resolve. A relatively natural place for we social oddballs on such an expedition is the quiet person who gets stuff done reliably, then sits quietly by the fire with everyone else but doesn't feel the need to join in the banter much.

My mother went out of her way to destroy my confidence, and my sister has taken on that role with a vengeance now she is an adult and doesn't get criticised for it. At some point I realised that they are enjoying life less than I am...

Feelsosorry - I feel so sorry too that you are going through this worry. I am not an expert but it really does sound like some of the things you are describing are similar to those of children on the autistic spectrum. A lot of children are being diagnosed with Aspergers Syndrome now which is at the very "mild" end of the Autistic spectrum. My friend's grandson has just been diagnosed with Aspergers. He too has always been a bit "odd" and unconnected in some way and was bullied at school. This little boy told my friend (when he was about 7) that the other kids thought he was stupid. How sad is that. Sadly though kids will always react like this to any kid who does not "fit the mould."

You really will have to fight for someone to take your worries seriously, as children who are "borderline" are often overlooked. If ahe is not a behaviour problem inthe class room then the teachers are not going to be overly concerned that she is having trouble with her class mates. I think the first port of call would be the GP but others have given suggestions about the way forward which may be more helpful. Have to say I am not a great fan of CAMHS but that is my prejudice! A good clinical psychologist could probably help but you would need to access one privately and they are not cheap.

Incidentally I was a little shocked at your H's response - burning toys/taking them away from her............oooh sounds too horrible for words to be honest. Your daughter needs your help and support not punishment for something that is not her fault. She is being punished enough by having to cope in a situation at school where she is being rejected by the other kids. Hope you are able to stand up to your H and impress upon him that he needs a different persepctive on your daughter's problems.

Anyway do hope that you can get the help your daughter needs.

Your dd sounds exactly like my sister at that age. My dad acted in exactly the same way, it was horrific and has scarred their relationship. She did not get diagnosed until her teens because my parents didnt take the inicitive (sorry! cant spell!) to go get her assesed, they just wrote her off as "weird". From discussions with other people who have an aspey in the family, I ahve heard that going private early in the game, in conjunction with therapy for the parents to make them understand whats going on is highly effective, it will make your husband understand more and equip both of you to deal with the ignorant people you will come across in rasing your daughter - this is all IF she has austism/aspergers. From my experience and taling to other familys, forget the school, they wont help, i know of people whove even been fobbed off at top knothc private schools. Go private with the doctors if you can, this will delay wait times, allow for more frequent appointments etc. Anyway, I just wanted to tell you all that and stress the improtance of early diagnosis, I, and many other families feel your distress, it can be incredibly frustrating and painful. I hope your little ones situation improves soon.

Well, an update. The teacher has been fantastic so far. I think perhaps in the past, in reception I have been very tentative about saying I thought she was different. This time I am just convinced and she recognises it.

She has sorted out the bullying quite effectively, and has had a word with some of the quieter children to make dd feel more included. Dd has just floated on a cloud this week compared to normal, she is really happy. She doesn't know any of the background stuff of course.

The teacher has spoken to the SEN co-ordinator who will talk to OT and get her assessed. At the moment it is the dyspraxia that kind of shows more - inability to jump etc.

We are going away this weekend with friends.

When I took her to school this morning, she got terribly distressed about going away this weekend. She was inconsolable and said she just needed some time just in the house with the family before we go away with other people. She has a plan to have a party with her teddies.

I am going to make sure she gets her 'family time' making her feel relaxed and we will go away later on this evening nearer bed time.

Suddenly I am seeing this poor little girl who is trying so desperately hard to conform, but is not in a comfort zone and gets very anxious as a result. Things are kind of making sense and getting a bit clearer.

Next step the GP.

That's great Feelso, really happy the teacher is being fabulous.

If you do find that your dd does have (mild) dyspraxia you may feel that everything falls into place so much easier.

Little things like planning, structure to the day, less noise can all make huge amounts of difference. Good luck at the gp.

Some very classic Asperger's traits as well as dyspraxic one's ;)

Do all you can to get some sort of diagnosis for your daughter. My son was exactly the same at 6 - no friends, distressed all the time, strange noises, etc. He is now 14 and nothing has changed. He was recently permanently excluded from school. The school governors overturned the head's decision and now he can go back, but only if he has a pastoral support plan in place so that he gets the help he needs. Reading the mountain of paperwork sent by the school on the events leading up to his exclusion forced me to the realisation that there is definitely something 'wrong' with him and I have to get him assessed for autism/ADHD etc. Idiotically I have always thought that if there really was something wrong the school would have picked up on it and referred him for such an assessment. Yesterday I heard the children's author Julia Donaldson on Desert Island Discs talking about her son who had schizoaffective disorder, not diagnosed until his late teens, and committed suicide at 25. She said that she and her husband had done a lot of mourning for the little boy they had lost while their son was still alive, and that though their friends were sympathetic when he died she felt nobody had ever understood how difficult it had been for them during his lifetime. I'm not suggesting that your daughter or my son have a condition like this, but I did empathise with what she said. We have been struggling for years with our son's behaviour, blaming ourselves and being blamed by others for poor parenting. Now I think we really have been poor parents for not fighting to have my son properly assessed at a much earlier age. A statement of special educational needs alone would have helped enormously with his schooling and would have prevented this exclusion and the misery it has caused us all. I really do think the best thing you can do for your daughter is to at least search for some sort of diagnosis. It might help your husband reach a better understanding of her as well. I too have to deal with a husband who thinks my son can just pull himself together and act normally. I know he can't do that. This is my first time on mumsnet. I'm not sure this post is much help to you but thanks for listening!

sounds good - although if the school are involving the OT the gp may not add anything. Maybe check with the school when you can see them? I don't know if seeing the gp means you get seen faster.

As you think dyspraxia may be the biggest issue at the moment we bought a book by Madeleine Portwood. I'm not going to recommend the one we got as it was more for older children but this one may be worth buying, especially as the used paperback Madeleine Portwood

cheap paperback

We also borrowed from libraries and read some others. They all help you to understand your child and some have practical suggestions that can help.

Although I haven't read "The Out of Synch Child" it's how I think of mine, they are on a different timeline.

What a fantastic recommendation tatt. I am going to buy that book as well.

I am also considering giving up work or trying to persuade them to vastly reduce my hours. I just can't offer dd any support being so far away all the time, and so cross and moody when I am at home.

Also yesterday dh practically announced that he is at the end of his tether with our marriage, he doesn't think I love him and is thinking of leaving. I think I need to do something radical to make our lives a bit happier.

Getting up at dawn, racing round hour long school runs, getting home knackered with two small children and no family anywhere near has finally taken its toll on us I think.

There has to be more to life for all of us?

innerlondonmother, thank you so much for sharing your situation with me. Welcome to mumsnet! I have always found it a fantastic place to find support and entertainment, I hope you will find that too.

I hope your situation with your son works out for the best. One thing I have realised in life is that every turn it takes is a different journey, and in retrospect even the worst times can seem like a 'transitional' period to something better. Sometimes it takes a disaster to make you wake up to something that has been nagging below the surface for ages, and that isn't necessarily a bad thing long term.

I think our kids are lucky that they live in an age where we are trying to understand them. It is really tragic when I think back to childhood and how lonely I was at times. Everything seemed so important then.

One thing I have learned through my daughter is that conscious decisions about parenting are rarely the cause. I think children are born a certain way, and it is hard to always know how to manage their behaviour.

Anyway, I must go to work now! So I can hand in my notice or some similar radical thing.

Oh well, just outed myself. Never mind! Hope dh doesn't know my new name. eek.

My nephew, now 15, has Aspberger's. He is high functioning and is doing very well in computers (!).

I second the scouts: he's had a lot of fun from the organised events they have put on: long hikes and camping trips in particular. It also appears that he is a good skier.

Basically anything that's not a team game helped him. He is finding life easier and easier as he grows up and the people around him grow up and appreciate him for what he is.

He's now a charming, kind-hearted and much-loved young man.