Can you lot help me with a new strategy for mealtimes because the whole experience is becoming utterly objectionable for all concerned.

[Slubberdegullion]

I can feel my gut twisting up into a ball of tension before every meal time because I know it is all going to be fraught.

Every meal (apart from breakfast) regardless of what I serve is met with a constant stream of moaning, whining, complaints, up and down from the table like a bride's nightie and then finishes with THEM setting goals for themselves

"I'm going to have two more mouthfuls and then it's pudding"

How did it all get so unpleasant? I have obiously made a grave error somewhere along the way. They hate eating and I hate cooking for them and then sitting with them while they protest at how ghastly it all is.

I need to start again I think.

They are 4 and 5. The 4 yo is a fussy bugger, the 5 yo is somewhat better but has her 500m badge in whining.

[ProfYaffle]

Interesting thread. My dd1, now 5.5, has a history of fussy eating although since starting school she has improved hugely. One of her favourite meals is what we call a 'grown up dinner party' (don't ask why!) which is little bowls/plates of bread, cheese, olives, fruit etc and she's allowed to help herself to whatever she likes, she always eats loads.

[Slubberdegullion]

Oh dear 2ndcoming. lol at "we didn't say a fucking word". I am developing a Blair-like rictus grin of tra-la-la, that was much tested today at dinner at a friends with dd2 spitting out food, fart-arsing about and generally pushing all my food-rage buttons. She was calmly escorted from the kitchen on several occasions.

[Slubberdegullion]

Goodness me. I'm surprised you don't have a pulsating aneurysm.

I am encouraged that it is all worth it after yesterday's success at lunch and non meltdown at dinner. I think my friend was quite impressed by my lack of visible frothings at dd2's silly antics.

[Slubberdegullion]

You too

[Miggsie]

My two nieces were fussy eaters. I happened to be there one day and while they were in full whine I ate the food off their plates...well, they SAID they didn't like it or want it.

Lords a lawky, the shock and fuss when Aunty Miggsie ate their food. So I says, all innocence: "I thought you didn't want it."

They very huffily started eating then.

Now I have 1 of my own and I do no snacks, no snack foods in house so they can't help themselves. No puddings.
No extra food at bedtime.
Small portions so they eat it all up.

DD's friend came over and rejected everything I offered her, she went home hungry, apparently I had the wrong type of biscuit, the wrong type of juice and she also said my plates were awful. My motivation to feed her dropped to zero at that point. I think she expected me to whip out a menu and give her options. I've long since stopped that, it just means a 5 year old is bossing you around...I go to work for crap like that, not home.

No child will voluntarily starve themselves over a sustained period.

[Slubberdegullion]

lololol @ "she said my plates were awful"

Do you have awful plates Miggsie?

I am pleased to say that the whole new strategy is working miracles here. I have had a small amount of wine so am dis-inhibited enough to say that I love EVERYONE on this thread. All of you.

Dinner today was beyond brilliant. Food that would previously have been met with moaning and theatrical lying on the floor is being EATEN. There is no shouting, no bribing, no whingeing. the food I serve is either eaten or not, there is no crossness anymore. I am feeling quite euphoric.

[vbusymum1]

Just catching up with the thread as I find food and the problems it seems to cause facsinating.
My view is best put forward by littleshebear above - at its most basic food is fuel for growth, yes, its nice to have a variety etc but when did it become such a battle ground ?
I don't remember any issues in my own childhood, is it a recent thing ? Mainly due to my own laziness I think I have lucked out with my 4 DCs, I have only ever put serving dishes on the table and they have always helped themselves (from about 2+) and whilst of course they don't all like everything I cook this is an area that has never caused a problem. Like some above I also really don't care if they don't eat everything and will eat it for my own meal rather than throw it away although there is rarely anything left.
Sometimes I sit at the table but often I use the time to get on with something else and just listen out for fights.
Stay strong and good luck for the future, my flashpoint is constant bickering so any tips welcome

[mathanxiety]

G&T worked for me . Also setting the kitchen timer for 30 minutes after which all plates and serving dishes were removed and dinner was officially over. I made them come and help in the kitchen and set the table, and also stopped serving any pudding at all except birthday cake. And also cut out snacks between meals. The fuss they put up was beyond belief, and it lasted a while so be warned. But it was sooooooo worth it. After a while they were the ones watching me instead of my attention constantly being directed at them at mealtimes. The dynamic shifted completely. And I liked them much more.

I felt like some sort of terrible, mean Victorian governess/dragon lady but nobody starved. It wasn't about food or what they liked or disliked, it was a power struggle between me and them, with me shooting myself in the foot by feeling guilty or worried about them starving, so of course I was losing badly. I too went the way of the staff buffet, gained so much weight from eating the leftovers, got indigestion from the stress of eating with all the whining going on, and deeply resented cooking for the ungrateful little &&%%$$!s to the point where I dreaded getting dinner started because it was such a thankless job.

[Slubberdegullion]

mathanxiety, your 2nd paragraph is pretty much verbatim how I was feeling last week. I dreaded mealtimes. You are quite right, it was all a power struggle, and not really about the food at all.

I can't believe that by making a few simple changes (serving bowls on the table, no snacks bar fruit, no pudding and NO rising (on my part) to food not being eaten) has brought about such massive changes.

I enjoyed dinner tonight. I really can't rememeber the last time I felt like this.

[Purplepanettone]

We tend to do fruit at breakfast for week-ends and holidays because then you start the day knowing they have had some goodness (though be prepared to do a 11am starchy snack). I try to ignore food fads, though they drive me potty too!

[mrshibbins]

This is one of the best, most useful and heartening threads on this whole forum. I believe it should be flagged up permanently. Well done all you lovely mums and Gawd Bless Us every one.

[Goldberry]

What a great thread. Haven't read it all, but some fab ideas. Thank you in particular to whoever suggested the serving bowls thing. I have finally cottoned on to the fact that the meal-time power struggles with my 4 yr old dd are exactly that - power struggles - and nothing much to do with food. I decided to give up getting cross and it's really working. She served herself 2 portions of dinner last night and ate it all. Thanks all!

[macherie]

Slubberdegullion, I just wanted to thank you for starting this thread

Thanks to you my dc are now serving themselves at mealtimes, they love the control it gives them and mealtimes have been so much more relaxed and enjoyable.

[Othersideofthechannel]

I sit with DCs through the entire meal even if I am waiting to eat with DH who gets home later.

What they eat not such a problem, but their behaviour towards other people can be. On the evenings when I sense they are too tired to manage to eat without bickering constantly, I read them stories while they eat.

I haven't really found a solution to 'up and down from the table like a bride's nightie' though. Sometimes they stay put no problems, other times they are all over the kitchen.

[Miggsie]

I have LOVELY plates...she objected to her pasta being served in a pasta bowl "at home we normally use PLATES," she says in a voice a Victorian lady might have used to the kitchen scullion. "And I do NOT like my sausages with the pasta." she continued...so I placed the sausage on a plain white square plate (IKEA finest).
"Plates ought to be round, and this is really boring," she says (I am NOT making this up). "At home I have princess plates". Then she told me it was the wrong type of sausage.

Anyway, a few weeks later same child is at another friend (whose mother is a close friend of mine hence me knowing this) and tosses her fork onto the plate she is offered saying "I'm not eating THAT" (pasta with tomato sauce).
My friend was mortified and thought she had done something wrong but is also horrified at this behaviour. She is nicer than me so she cooked a whole new load of pasta for the child.

I could say to my friend that at least her plates had not been criticised.
Do either of us invite this child round to tea anymore????

Three guesses!!!!

[lou031205]

I made a delicious cous cous dish tonight. DD1 (3.8) & DD2 (2.0) both refused it. I told them that they didn't have to eat it, but they must wait until Mummy & Daddy have finished before they could get out of their seats.

They sat for a few minutes. Then DD2 started to feed DD1. DD1 reciprocated. They cleared both plates

[piscesmoon]

It is nice to know that a thread is actually helping! I wish advice had been around when mine were small-poor DS was the one I experimented with before I took the stress out of it. I think that people are right-it is nothing to do with food-it is a power struggle. I wonder how old the fussy DD will be, Miggsie, before she realises the consequences of her behaviour-sadly maybe never!

[Slubberdegullion]

I'm so pleased to hear that others are having succeses too . We are still going great guns here, although it seems that the 'need to feed' is very deeply intrenched in my dh and mother. There were several ahems and firm looks at dh yesterday as he advanced upon dd1 with a potato on a fork.

I'm playing the getting down from the table by ear. Sometimes the battle of keeping a non eating child at the table is utterly counterproductive, and seems a bit of a punishment for the other one who is actually eating nicely. At dinner I'm trying to sit with them now with a cup of tea, I can actually manage a normal conversation as my shoulders aren't up around my ears with tension and I'm not in cajole and bribe mode. Funnily enough they aren't in a terrible rush to get down when we are having a nice chat.
[more bingo]

Miggsie so pleased to hear that you are a nice plate owner and you are not inflicting terrible crockery upon your young visitors. Goodness me, what a little madam she sounds. I'm not suprised that she's not welcome back.

[mrshibbins]

so ... we tried the serving-bowl-help yourself-nothing until next meal approach here last night with food control queen DD 8 with mixed success.

i made a plain, basic spag boll - a family fave, and had the spag in one bowl and the sauce in another, with serving spoons.

i explained the new rules:

• help yourself, but whatever you put on your plate you have to eat. have seconds if you want to.
• there will be no snacks on demand between meals, and no fruitbowl grazing.

i then calmly reiterated my rules to myself:

• do not pass any comment on what she does or does not eat
• do not give in
• do not get angry

Admittedly she cleared her rather small portion, but only after 30 mins of her trying her best to get a rise through other methods - saying 'eurrr what's THIS', pushing food around the plate as if it had dead worms in it, saying she feels sick, pulling awful faces and retching etc ... BUT I DIDN'T SAY A WORD OR EVEN LOOK

20 mins later she announced she was hungry. I said hard luck, nothing until the next meal. She stomped off yelling that I didn't care if she starved to death

let's see how tonight's meal goes!!!!

[Othersideofthechannel]

Slubberdegullion, our children can get down from the table if they don't want to eat any more. If they want dessert (we always have dessert even if only fruit) they usually have to stay at the table until the others have finished main course but we have lots of exceptions, usually when you know that it is going to be harder work for everyone involved eg

one of those long French family meals that last at least 2 hours in which case they can get down in between courses.

school nights when DD is exhausted, she has to wait for a few minutes but if her slow eater brother is still on his main, she gets her dessert

[Slubberdegullion]

mrshibbins - God it's exhausting isn't it, the not rising to it and maintaining the calm disinterested look. It is paying off here I think. dd2 will always have a good stab at complaining and wailing dramatically but it doesn't last long now. I'm not prepared to put up with rudeness though, for that they get sent out of the room (in a non shouty headmastery fashion rather than the shreiking harpy of latterday).

Fingers crossed for you that tonight will be a bit easier.

Otherside, yes for long family meals I'm going to let my two get down too. They will just sabotage the adult conversation if they have to sit still and wait for an age between courses.
I've done away with pudding now (I'm giving them fruit now as a snack rather than pudding) so there isn't the 'treat' of pudding to keep them sat at the table anymore. My scintillating and witty conversation seems to be doing the trick until their sibling has finished .