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Behaviour/development

Talk to others about child development and behaviour stages here. You can find more information on our development calendar.

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Original poster

DD1 really hates, and I mean HATES DD2

22 replies

drivinmecrazy · 03/07/2009 10:14

DD1 (8) has decided that DD2 (3) is the spawn of the devil. Told me yesterday she wishes I had never given birth to her sister. DD2, meanwhile, asks Grandma (who is visiting from Spain) if she can take DD1 back with her when she goes.
The two of them are chalk and cheese. DD2 knows exactly what buttons to press with DD1 and can't stop herself. DD2 will wake DD1 in middle of the night, telling her to 'budge up, I'm getting into your bed' or will bite her/sit on her head until she wakes up.
Think DD1 has just had enough. She is very sensitive and sensible while DD2 is a jester who is just out to have fun for 20 hours a day (doesn't seem to need sleep)
DD1 is starting to retaliate and get quite vicious which is really not in her nature. Don't know what to do to broker a peace between them. Any tips??

OP posts:

Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

Set a reminder

ButtercupWafflehead · 03/07/2009 10:29

Are they in the same bedroom? If so, any chance of separating them?

If they're not, how about a baby gate across the door so DD1 at least has her own space?

HaventSleptForAYear · 03/07/2009 10:30

Have you read siblings without rivalry - it's great?

Original poster

drivinmecrazy · 03/07/2009 10:34

Haven't read the book but think i will. They are not in the same bedroom, but stair gate won't work because she can open them easily.
Would just be nice if they didn't spend their time plotting ways to rid themselves of each other.

OP posts:

BiscuitStuffer · 03/07/2009 22:50

It sounds as if DD1 is feeling tormented and needs help protecting her space a wee bit. I can get quite stressed if people goad me / persist in teasing me and for me, having some protected down time works a treat as I can then manage perfectly well with cheeky /naughty behaviour but not if it is constant. Could that be an idea? I think that 3 is old enough to learn empathy for others and to respect their needs a little.

siblingrivalry · 03/07/2009 23:22

I'm watching this thread with great interest, as I am going through exactly the same thing. So no advice, I'm afraid -but lots of sympathy!

Original poster

drivinmecrazy · 06/07/2009 00:03

Biscuitstuffer, what a good post. Think you have given me a really good insight into a seemingly dire situation. I am trying really hard to give DD1 time when DD2 goes to bed but DH works away so I really struggle to have the one to one time DD1 deserves. Just hope if DD2 starts sleeping well I might have enough energy to give a bit more time to DD1. Really miss time with DD1 'cos DD2 seems to take so much of my energy and attentions away from DD1.

OP posts:

thumbwitch · 06/07/2009 00:05

your surname isn't Addams, is it?

Original poster

drivinmecrazy · 06/07/2009 00:12

Think we make the addams family seem 'normal' Just wish we could stop this contant rivalry without violence and threats. Not good when they fight over who will leave the fanily and who will stay. as I said before, think I might walk away and leave them all to sort it out between them. Really thought I would give birth to 2 children who were vaguely similar

OP posts:

LovingtheSilverFox · 06/07/2009 00:13

This sounds like an impossible situation, and I can't speak from experience, as DD1 is 3 and DTs (girls) are 7 months, but I really feel for you.

Good luck x

ClaudiaSchiffer · 06/07/2009 00:31

I think both childrens behaviour needs addressing particularly your 3yr olds. Is there some way you can keep her in her room at night - having someone wake you up is a right pain, I'm not suprised your dd1 is pissed off with her. How about a latch on dd2's door?

Can you get a babysitter occasionally for dd2 and you and dd1 go out for an early supper? Do you go out as a family, and have happy family times together? Ever?

Also I think you need to come down hard on any viciousness, from either of them. It is not acceptable behaviour from anyone, whatever the provocation, but address the provocation too.

It is very difficult and wearing for you, particularly if you are doing a lot of the parenting by yourself. I do feel for you.

nooka · 06/07/2009 00:47

Could you put a high handle on dd1's door maybe? Something in her reach and yours but not dd2s? It does sound fairly horrible, and I imagine if not stopped fairly sharpish will result in permanent antipathy between the two of them. I'm not sure how much empathy a 3 year old has, but can she really not help being nasty to her big sister, or is it more of a needling type of behaviour? I think you need to come down very hard on both of them, set some really clear rules and then enforce them (easy to say mind you!) I imagine it must be very tricky with such a large age gap to be consistent with them, because obviously a three year old does not have the control of an eight year old, but an eight year old is probably not quite mature enough to really understand that.

Original poster

drivinmecrazy · 06/07/2009 00:48

yes, we do have alot of happy family time out side of the home, it's when we are at home that the problems occur. would love to get out with DD1 more, but if I try and get out with one and not the other all hell breaks loose. But Daddy can just walk out of the house to get his hair cut on saturday morning and no one will follow him or ask to go with him. They will constantly compete for my attention, not even having Daddy put them to bed at the week-end. Actually, writing this has made me realise it is more of an issue of me than them. They are (maybe) constantly fighting for my attention. but where the F**K is Daddy in all this?? Why don't they fight over who goes to the toilet with Papa??

OP posts:

ClaudiaSchiffer · 06/07/2009 01:02

Good to hear that you have some good times as a family. Can you establish a routine ie 1st Sunday in a month is DD1's special time with mum and DD2's special time with dad and you both go separate ways for a hour or 2 - cinema or coffee/library/ice skating?? Anything. Doesn't have to be often, just to make each of them feel special. Then have 3rd Sunday afternoon a month dd2 time with mum and dd1 time with dad???

I see what you mean re daddy waltzing off. My dh does the same thing - I don't think he realises that it's not so easy for me. Maybe you need to also say that Sat mornings are YOUR time for getting some time to yourself. After all we ALL need a break now and again.

Have a chat with dh see if you can both work together to resolve your dd's issues. Do you think he would be open to that?

elderflowercordial · 06/07/2009 01:37

Ask your 8 y o what she thinks might work (reasonable, nonviolent)and then help her instigate any sanction base on a reward system.

Sit your dds down together and explain that you are going to put dd1 in charge (when you are otherwise engaged)and that if dd2 is kind to her or does something nice for dd1, then dd1 is allowed to dish out a reward (give her a 'goodgirl point' if you have a chart system building up to have a sweet, trip to park, a story read to her etc)

Then dd2 sees dd1 as a source of treats (if she's good of course)and then after a while their relationship should improve. I would not advocate empowering your dd1 if she is not sensible though. The nice thing about this is that mum no longer has to get involved in their fights.

Good luck!

thumbwitch · 06/07/2009 14:26

hmm, have just had a thought - I had twin sibs (B&G) who were ~4 yrs younger than me; although the viciousness you describe was absent, there was a lot of "winding up" that went on. My parents eventually let me put a hook and eye on my door to use when I was out, to stop them trashing my stuff. Perhaps you could put one on the inside that she could use hen she is in there - in the event of an emergency, it would be easy enough to burst through it but it would certainly keep a 3yo at bay.

nappyaddict · 17/07/2009 08:49

Was DD1 jealous of DD2 when she was a baby or is this hatred quite a new thing?

slowreadingprogress · 17/07/2009 09:29

I think one major issue would be to give your girls more time with their dad in sole charge of them. It sounds like he is quite peripheral to their lives and that's why they don't mind if he's off out like they would with you.

I think kids all need time in the sole care of their dads and it's amazing how often this doesn't happen. Think it's healthy for all; gives you a morning/afternoon off at weekends, gives them more trust and closeness to dad, gives dad a stronger bond with kids. No lose situation.

I think on the rivalry thing;

kids are absolute sticklers for fairness; if they see their sibling 'getting away' with something and not being picked up on it they will burn with resentment and anger; which of course just feeds the rivalry so it becomes an ever increasing circle like ripples in a pond
3 year olds ARE annoying even to parents who are genetically programmed to adore them. Think your dd needs some space of her own and a feeling that she has stuff that dd2 can't trash and also that YOU as parents understand how dd1 feels

Just thoughts, hth

slowreadingprogress · 17/07/2009 09:31

oh and also it sounds like your dd1 has lost patience with dd2 'getting away' with stuff; I mean, when dd2 pushes dd1's buttons as you describe, what consequence do you give her?

What consequence does she get for sitting on/waking up etc her sister?

morningpaper · 17/07/2009 09:37

I would stop the night-time thing - allow the older one to put a cabin lock on her door high up (that you can reach yourself from the outside) so she can 'protect' her space. When you hear the younger one rattling her door then get up and tell her to get to bed. If that does't work, put a cabin lock on her door so that she can't open it. I would REALLY crack down on the night time waking which sounds utterly horrible for your DD1.

Lots of good advice here also.

BonsoirAnna · 17/07/2009 09:38

You need to keep them apart as much as possible.

When siblings have very different temperaments (they would never choose one another as friends, for example), it can be immensely difficult for them to live together harmoniously. You need to give them both personal space.

Miggsie · 17/07/2009 14:32

I wasn't mad keen on my own three yr old to be honest (DD is now 5 and lovely) so I do wonder what 8 years olds make of them and their insanely annoying ways.

I expect I'd be pretty annoyed if someone sat on my head at night...this is not acceptable behaviour.

Reassure older DD that the younger one will improve, and that perhaps she could help this process? If the helping is not appealing separate them until younger child is more civilised.

I was a horrible child and my parent put a bolt and padlock on my brother's door so he could keep me out. I grew out of it by about 4.

fluffles · 17/07/2009 14:41

i had a lock on my door to keep my brother out when he was about that age. i'd have been about 10 when he was 3 and hated him.

i also got my own tv around that time as i couldn't bear to watch fireman sam one more time!!!

i don't think it was HIM i hated to be honest, it was just having a 3yr old around. i hated that you couldn't argue with him logically and that he didn't compromise or negotiate...

3yr olds are hard work and an 8 or 10yr old cannot be expected to be able to put up with them all the time.

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