Is choosing NOT to smack undermining my authority?

[amyntomsmummy]

Hiya
dd (now 4) and to a certain extent ds(2) for some reason or the other, lately seem to be goin bonkers with me in the house despite firm convetional disciplinary tactics e.g. time out, bottom step, rational talking to (which all do sometimes work)...
Ive always gone by the thought that i'd rather die than ever see any of my kids go through pain, so smacking to me was a NONO! And this has been despite many times when the temptation to lay my hand upon a few little bottoms has been great! I would only beleive in smacking the bottom though, (never damagable hands, legs,arms...)
dh is a bit of a smacker when he needs to be but I feel this is sometimes the only thing the kids seem to respond to and dh has a MUCH bigger grip on the kids behaiviour than I do. I feel with me,
especially with my daughter, she feels that mummy is powerless because she never has a detering last resort. I.e. my authority is being undermined because I dont smack.
After long thinking I think that im right not to want to put my child through 'real pain' but I feel that a little discomfort on the cute, soft thing she sits on, is really not 'pain' but instead might probably be good for her in the long term.
Have others felt that they are powerless to their children unless they become as firm as I am thinking? Tell me your thoughts pls xxx
Jessica

Amyntomsmummy was looking for advice on how she can influence her children to behave well without resorting to smacking - that is her stated preference.
Any specific advice in response to her situation?

My only advice is that if she wants to stop smacking here children, she has to stop her husband undermining her, because if he is smacking them he will have the ultimate authority and they won't do what she says anymore. If they are used to being smacked they won't respond to anything else IMO.

I think the main thing remains, you must have some consistency in approach. So you and your DH need to sit down and discuss this, and come to an agreement on either smacking or no smacking. If you decide to smack, then you also need to decide WHEN a smacked bottom is appropriate.

We DO smack - but only for major defiance. And we use a very light wooden kitchen spatula to administer the punishment. And before all the bleeding hearts throw their hands up in horror, can I just point out that the force behind this very light "smacker" is factors less than mummy or daddy's hand would be. Yes, it stings, but that's about all.

Final question: Does punishing people by sending them to jail give out the message that it's OK for any citizen to casually imprison another? Children have more common sense than we think.

Lindymum, do you use your light wooden spatula only for smacking, or for cooking as well?

Lindymum, sending people to jail doesn't work either, if it did there would be no crime

Would you let someone else smack your child with the spatula, LM?

I smack my child. But only with a whip so they know it's not as bad with mummy or daddy's hand ...

Blimey! Heads and parapets spring to mind. To answer your questions:

• No, the spatula in question is kept just for smacking. That's rather the point.

• Would I let someone else use it? Well, their dad does sometimes. Who else did you have in mind? It would depend on their trustworthiness and relationship to my children, frankly.

• Whatever you think about jail, the threat of it keeps a lot more out than it keeps in. Whether you buy into the concept of punishments and deterrents, the fact is, that's the way the outside world works, the world we're supposed to be preparing our children for. Otherwise I'd drive my car at 80mph everywhere, wouldn't I?

Smacking my DS would cause me immense distress .My DS is 3years 2 months and going though a very willful stage. I found the naughty step is effective. I would hate him to go into preschool saying "mummy smacks me", it would break my heart. He is a small person growing up where boundaries are still to be found and extended... Smacking gives the child a perception this is acceptable when they disagree with something - next time the teacher will be asking why ds is hitting, Not for me I am affraid !

I can't believe you are smacking your child with a spatula. Sounds like something from Dickens, no?

That spatula hitting is just plain odd to me. I really think there are other ways of disciplining than hitting. Like I said earlier, I feel too big to hit a child. No matter how 'naughty' they may have been, I'd feel like a bully.

Well said, mummylonglegs. If I hit someone I'd expect to get arrested. If I hit someone with an implement I'd expect to go to jail. Children are no exception.

Sorry, the thought of this makes me feel sick.

Actually the smacking with an implement isn't that odd. Mummy's and daddy's hands are for loving, cuddling, caressing and nurturing, so I find that it's good to have a distinction between what is used to administer punishment and what is used to show love. There's a really interesting book by a James Dobson that talks about this issue with regard to the Bible and Christian parenting. My ds is only 4 months at the moment, so I'm not actually in a position where I can be pro or anti smacking - I think my attitude towards it will be different when my son is at that age, and when I'm in that situation. But at the moment, I don't see anything wrong with it in moderation and used correctly. Why play complicated mind games (exclusion etc) when a short, sharp shock can be all it takes to make a child understand?

Message withdrawn

So at what age should I begin to hit my child? Should I go out and buy a spatula, just for that purpose, so I'm ready for that time?

Doesn't that sound odd!

Ummm ... evansmummy, it's still mummy and daddy's hands holding the spatula though isn't it?

HM, yes that does sound odd! I didn't ever say I planned to go about it this way, just that it was interesting to recognise a distinction. And with regard to smacking, it obvioulsy shouldn't be started until a child cannot be injured by it, if that makes any sense. You wouldn't smack a 6 month old, but maybe an 18 month old? There's an age when babies start to understand what's wrong and what's right, isn't there? And the use of an implement isn't to make it hurt more, IMO, but just so that the hand that strokes hair to send their child of to sleep, isn't the same hand that disciplines.

That's true, and as I said, I'm not sure it would be my choice to discipline this way, just pointing out an opinion. Still, it's not actually the hand that makes contact. Maybe that's the point.

Well, DS is eighteen months old on 3rd October this year, so I guess I should have a spatula by then.

I'll mark it on the calendar.

Best you had! Apparently a wooden spoon's good too

Would a ladle be any good? I'm SUCH an amateur!

If, for example, I was assaulted (slapped) in the street by a stranger, I would be angry. If I was assaulted in my home by someone I live with, who is supposed to love me, I would be angry, hurt and confused.

If I see it that way, I don't see why a child would understand how hitting means love.

Domestic abuse is often justified by the abuser as love and concern.

And hitting a child with a spatula is no different to hitting them with a stick.

This Kitchen Implement Discipline isn't for real, right?

And anyone who would hit an 18 month old baby with a spatula should go to court for it,.