Is choosing NOT to smack undermining my authority?

[amyntomsmummy]

Hiya
dd (now 4) and to a certain extent ds(2) for some reason or the other, lately seem to be goin bonkers with me in the house despite firm convetional disciplinary tactics e.g. time out, bottom step, rational talking to (which all do sometimes work)...
Ive always gone by the thought that i'd rather die than ever see any of my kids go through pain, so smacking to me was a NONO! And this has been despite many times when the temptation to lay my hand upon a few little bottoms has been great! I would only beleive in smacking the bottom though, (never damagable hands, legs,arms...)
dh is a bit of a smacker when he needs to be but I feel this is sometimes the only thing the kids seem to respond to and dh has a MUCH bigger grip on the kids behaiviour than I do. I feel with me,
especially with my daughter, she feels that mummy is powerless because she never has a detering last resort. I.e. my authority is being undermined because I dont smack.
After long thinking I think that im right not to want to put my child through 'real pain' but I feel that a little discomfort on the cute, soft thing she sits on, is really not 'pain' but instead might probably be good for her in the long term.
Have others felt that they are powerless to their children unless they become as firm as I am thinking? Tell me your thoughts pls xxx
Jessica

If a child isn't in pain/fear it doesn't work, does it? Or does it? If so, someone tell me how!

I think that the recent NSPCC ad where a parent goes through the day they've got planned for their child is thought-provoking - the 'first we're going to the zoo, then we'll have lunch out, then a walk in the park, and then I'm oing to smack you'.

A parent who smacks has lost control IMO. Actually, not IMO - just fact.

hunkermonker - once saw a programme (think it was Oprah where, to prove they hadn't lost control, would tell their child, 'later you will be smacked', let the child go off and play, and then smack them in a 'calm' way!

Also heard a bloke talking about a 'loving smack' on the radio...

That's not calm, that's mental.

Tell me about it. But if it's wrong to smack in the heat of the moment, and wrong to smack after a delay as the child doesn't know why it's being told off, when is the right time to smack?

When you're smacking your own arse for thinking about doing it to your child.

Ionesmum, you are saying that the backside is not the suitable place to smack! That seems wierd to me!
I try to leave all smacking to the very last resort but isnt the bottom where you would normally be aiming for when you do have to smack? I mean, isnt it custom that the norm for smacking is the bottom? Obviosuely yes, because it is padded and well protected but i do understand that ofcourse it is a private place but a child probably wont mind if it is a parent that is doing the smacking ie the person who bathes, potty trained you etc.
Atleast with me growing up, I was always smacked on my backside when i needed it and i would have thought that for the parents that do smack, it would be the same for them.
Angel

My parents smacked us and when we got older we used to smack them during arguments, and each other but not friends. Make of that what you will.

I smack my children, very occasionally and my DH doesn't (possibly 1 a year). We have a different style of dealing with things. However we have agreed what is important to us and try to ensure the rules they have to live with are the same however the outcome may be different. My DD has just come out of a stage of trying to play 1 of us off against other and that was a very difficult thing to deal with because all it took was 1 incident where she got what she wanted(from DH) and I was the mean nasty Mummy who she didn't have a civil word (and some very rude language and unacceptable behaviour) for and Daddy was the best thing since sliced bread. That was the last time she got a smack and my DH got a big earbashing.

I tend to do other things first, like asking politely with a stern voise, a warning then time out. With my older daughter if a get bad behaviour a toy is given to me each time I have to tell her off. Early bedtime, or a rest in theire rooms is a very good one, especially as tiredness is nomally what causes the behaviour. It kills 2 birds with 1 stone.

Is the problem really a difficult method of punishment or different set of boundaries/rules for each parent?

Angel, what I am saying is that nowhere is acceptable to smack. I find the 'it's okay to smack but only on the bottom' argument pretty obnoxious, for the reasons I've stated. Just because something has been done 'for years' doesn't make it right.

No Ionesmum, im not saying that.
All i am trying to say is that it is unacceptable for smacking to go beyond the normal amount and it should include noting more than light smacking on the rear. I have explained why i should be the 'rear' and believe me, if you talk to other mums who do smack, you will find it is the exact same for them.
Im not saying that just becuase in history, smacking in this manner was acceptable means that it is acceptable now, after all, people used to burn other people alive, behead people etc in the past! All i was suggesting was that even then, smacking consisted of the things ive mentioned above because it is safe.
Beleive me, i understand where you are coming from and i respect you for that, and im not trying to convince you into doing something you dont wish to do, all i am doing is saying my opinion from this perspective.
xxxbye

I didn't have the right to smack other people's children when I was a teacher. I don't think I have the right to smack my own children either.

Whilst me and dh don't smack, we have had a few arguments about our differing parenting styles and worked out that if we both adopt the same system, our two respond better.

Message withdrawn

Hi, Puff. I so agree. If dh and I do things differently, it's chaos. Consistency has been really important for us, which is why we also use the same methods employed by the prescool.

Bloss, how do you think smacking works? Through fear? Pain? Physical control? Would you like to be smacked if you did something wrong? Or is it only acceptable to hit a child?

Have skimmed through this thread really quick so forgive me if I repeat anything thats already been said.

I think everyone here is intelligent enough to know the difference between a smack on the bottom and hitting a child. Two very different things.

I have smacked my kids; I don't like it, do it only as a very last resort and after ample warning. Over the age of about 10-11 I don't think it works as alternatives can be brought in that have far greater effect such as stopping pocket money, not going to the school disco that sort of thing.

Parents who hit their children at the drop of a hat as a first resort, with a slipper or cane or belt as part of their normal discipline plainly need educating and in some instances, prosecuting. I don't see a problem with it if done in the way I said above - that as far as I can see IS part of a loving parenting style.

Smacking works by pain/fear/embarassment. Not able to equate that with love, sorry.

If I threaten to stop my dd from going to the school disco, that causes her far more fear and embarrassment than a smack might. Having said that I now don't smack my dd as she is a teenager and like I said different forms of discipline works on different ages.

yes, and as a discipline it's far more effective. My mum did a similar thing with me when I was a teenager. I was seething but I deserved it and it worked - unlike my friend who was smacked and was off the next day doing the same thing.

So how do you think smacking works in little children?

Very young children cannot always be reasoned with. I'm not advocating smacking as a punishment for all misdemeanours either. Things I would smack for would be downright dangerous activities and outright insolence and disrespect.

I have previously been a foster carer and never made a secret of the fact I would occasionally smack my own children.

I would never allow anyone else, not even grandparents to smack my kids, nor would I ever smack anyone elses child.

So how does smacking work???? If a child can't be reasoned with, how does it understand why it has been smacked?

With very young children it's cause and effect. A smack should be an immediate response to a particular behaviour. Whereas reasoning that going to bed early tonight was a result of bad behaviour that morning loses it's effect on children that young as they can barely remember what they had for tea, let alone what they did that morning.

I'm probably not articulating this very well, always find it hard to put what I mean in writing to get across what I mean but you get the idea.

I hope no-one is of the impression that I smack my kids willy-nilly, that's far from the reality. My kids have had smacks, probably will again, but they know that they have to have done something really bad to get one. Consistency in discipline is best, as is a united front from both parents whether that includes smacking or not. It's a personal thing for parents to decide what forms of discipline works best for them and be confident with it.

Yes, I know a smack should be immediate, but how does it work? Does it frighten the child? Hurt? Embarass? If none of these, how?

I always discipline my dd1 immediately but don't need to smack. I've used time-out a handful of times when she has done something dangerous, but that's about it.

No, I don't get the impression you smack all the time! . I'm just trying to understand your reasoning (and that of others here) as to how it works and why it's acceptable if other methods might be better.

Help I seem to be getting into an argument I never intended here! I guess children would feel embarrassed, humliated and fearful - but for severely bad behaviour isn't that the point?

I've just asked my ds1 aged 11 how he feels about smacking and it's his answer that might actually make me change my mind about future smacking!

Given the choice, I asked if he would rather have a smack or be sent to bed early. He replied "I'd rather have the smack cos at least then it's over and done with. If I have to go to bed early I would in bed before all my younger brothers and I'd miss out on whatever was going on downstairs."

So now I know what really gets to him!!! Bed early it is from now on then!

One area my children are likely to misbehvae is the supermarket, which I kow is boring but it has to be done. I have learnt this method through hard experience. My 7 year has a shopping list of her own and my 3 year old is to help her. When he is older he will have he's own shopping list but currently he is too dagerous with the trolley.

An advantage I feel I've had in my parenting is being sent on courses when I was a foster carer on how to deal with challenging behaviour. Excellent strategies, most of which I could probably benefit from a refresher course!!

Best strategy I ever learnt was knowing when something was going to escalate and diverting the child from a certain behaviour with distraction before it got to the point of no return.

The idea of s hopping lists for little ones in the supermarket is excellent, I let my 2 year old help to put the apples in the bag etc, although the shopping takes twice as long, at least we don't get tantrums.