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Original poster

Could there be something wrong? 6yo ds3 in trouble at school.

64 replies

andlipsticktoo · 11/02/2009 17:45

Not sure where to start.
Ds3 in year 1 getting into regular trouble at school. I am very new to this as ds1 and ds2 have been 'model pupils' and now with ds3 (4 yrs younger) having to speak to his teacher daily.
He is doing things like; writing 'poo' in his book to make the other children in his group laugh. Then when he is reprimanded, saying 'we don't listen to teachers, they smell' - this happened today .
Not sitting still, rolling around on the floor, putting things in his mouth, being very fidgety.
Getting very angry and shouting when accused by others. Has pushed/hit other children during angry outbursts.
Refusing to do/finish work.
He is academically very bright and extremely able, but his behaviour is really worrying me.
Could there be something wrong, or is he just naughty?

OP posts:
lilolilmanchester · 11/02/2009 18:01

DS was a bit like this at that age and I know it's worrying. He too was very bright, and sometimes got teased about it. He was quite small for his age and got a lot of stick about that too. I think to some extent his behaviour was as a result of that. Would the teacher be prepared to give him a daily report, showing the good things as well as the bad things? Then if he gets a clean sheet, or if good outweighs bad, he gets a reward (for DS, it was an ice-cream on a Friday from the ice-cream van outside school, which we had tried to avoid, but it worked)Or 10p every day he'd been good at school if a week is too long for him?
What is difficult with a difficult child is to remember to constantly the good things they do at school and at home. Find good things you wouldn't have commented on with your others (walked home nicely, got ready for bed nicely or whatever). Also pick your battles, turn a blind eye to very minor wrongdoings and focus on the major.
Not sure if any of that helps.

Original poster
andlipsticktoo · 11/02/2009 19:06

Thanks lilolil! Yes his teacher is very good about pointing out the good things he has done in each day, but at the mooment it's the bad things that seem to outweigh the good!

I have been giving him a sticker each day for good behaviour at school plus a sticker each day for finishing work/working hard. He has a target of 6 stickers a week to watch a film he is desperate to watch (Indiiana Jones) and at the moment he's not on target.

He is such an absolute angel on a one to one basis, and alot of the time with his brothers at home.

He knows what he is doing is wrong, but just can't stop himself! He is also totally obsessive about routine,and any changes can throw him out. He is waiting for his nightly hot water bottle now, so better go!

Thanks for the advice.

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jabberwocky · 11/02/2009 19:14

Sounds like he may not be challenged enough. Very bright children frequently get labeled as trouble-makers for any and all of the behaviors you have listed. Ds1's teacher had the brilliant idea of putting him in a small group with 2 other children to work on a special project.

Original poster
andlipsticktoo · 11/02/2009 19:24

He is in a group of 5, all of them very bright too, but he seems to just want to make them laugh.
I do think his teacher recognises that he is bright, she taught ds2 who is also gifted and talented, and she always pushed him. He does seem to be ok when actually 'on task', it's the in between bits that he messes about in (mostly).

OP posts:
mouseling · 11/02/2009 19:28

I am at a very similar point with my DS1 in year 1. He is also a bright little boy (with a model pupil older sister) but his attitude and behaviour since xmas have been appalling. I am seriously questioning whether there is an underlying cause for his 'bad' behaviour. He is not deterred by any of the sanctions the school are using or motivated by working for rewards.

Original poster
andlipsticktoo · 11/02/2009 19:34

mouseling do you mind if I ask your dd's age?
I am wondering if the fact that my other 2 dss are older by 4 and 6 years is having any affect. (effect?) They do tend to ignore him when he is talking, and yabber away to each other....

OP posts:
mouseling · 11/02/2009 19:45

She is 2 years older and I have DS2 who is who is 3.5 years younger.

Original poster
andlipsticktoo · 11/02/2009 20:04

ah that blows my theory out of the water then!

Just dread picking him up from school every day and having to go up to talk to his teacher in front of all the other judgemental mums.

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mouseling · 11/02/2009 20:21

Exactly. I make a point of asking for a quick report at the end of each day. At the moment it is never good news. I just don't know where to go from here. I feel like he may not be in control of his own behaviour.

mouseling · 11/02/2009 20:25

Do you think persistently defying the authority of a teacher is outside the 'norm'?

ICANDOTHAT · 11/02/2009 20:43

andlipsticktoo has he always been like this at school or has behaviour started recently ?

jabberwocky · 11/02/2009 20:51

I was at a G&T talk last night and one of the things the speaker really worked on getting across to everyone was how often G&T kids are misdiagnosed as ADHD, oppositional defiant disorder, etc. I think it may be that your son is just much more gifted than anyone realizes.

ICANDOTHAT · 11/02/2009 21:08

jabberwocky that's interesting. My ds aged 6,5 dx ADHD is really bright and bored stiff at school and tells me often he's teacher is boring. It's so sad to hear him and I dread leaving him there every day as I know he just doesn't 'get it'. They love him as he is a great personality and plays a big social role in the class, but say he drives them crazy.

We don't have a really 'bad' child at home (we have him pretty much under control ) and this has often led me to question the dx

jabberwocky · 11/02/2009 22:44

Did he have problems concentrating at home as well as school when they dxed him? One of the red flags is that a gifted child will seem to have problems paying attention at school but can be absorbed in something they enjoy at home for hours. Also, sometimes they appear not to be paying attention but if the teacher asks them a question they can answer correctly as to the material she was discussing.

It's also VERY common for gifted children to drive their teachers crazy. Is there anyplace where you could get him tested? If he does test as gifted you might consider trying to wean him off his medication and see what happens. It makes me so sad to think of kids taking meds that they may not need. I think if you have questioned the diagnosis you should follow your mother's instinct and investigate other possibilities.

frustratedsuperhero · 12/02/2009 09:09

YOU ARE NOT ALONE! Bright kids are often a nightmare at school - and schools are often really bad at seeing beyond 'good = bright'. I have an 8-year-old son (sorry about the lack of abbreviations - I'm new here) who sounds very like yours, and I can identify with that feeling of tension when you go to pick him up. Hang in there.

ICANDOTHAT · 12/02/2009 14:55

I haven't gone down the medication route as it wasn't felt he needed it and to be honest, it would be a last resort and he would have to be climbing the walls frankly. This is why I have questioned the dx.

Yes, he can concentrate on things at home and really enjoys taking on long and detailed arts and crafts projects. He has stated he hates writing and maths (but, apparently is quite capable in the classroom) however, loves to read. He is fairly hyper and has bundles of energy, a social animal and is popular with his peers. The dx was mainly as a result of school report rather then our own. They said he was mild, but surely many 6 year old boys are 'mild' ADHD !

I have actually started the ball rolling with a private dx, so maybe I'll get a different aspect from them. I'm just not convinced. Surely, we would be having a terrible time at home and hating every minute of him, but we aren't.

jabberwocky · 12/02/2009 15:00

You are absolutely right. This was a point that the speaker made Tuesday night. If a child is truly ADHD it won't be just at school and s/he won't be able to concentrate for long periods of time on anything.

Sounds like a normal, bright, energetic 6 year old to me

Original poster
andlipsticktoo · 12/02/2009 17:40

Sorry have been hectically busy today.

Ds can concentrate for long periods of time at home playing (though usually with an older child, not for long on his own), drawing and making things and absolutely LOVES anything computerised! He loves being outside the most, but not on his own.
However sometimes he does find it difficult sitting still, mealtimes for eg. he eats well but fidgets about on his chair - legs up, legs down etc.
Today he was in trouble for drawing on his knees instead of doing his maths in the morning, in the afternoon he had a supply teacher and she said he completed his maths then very easily.

After school I always let him run around with his friends in the playgroung before cycling home. This evening a teacher from KS 2 opened her door and shouted at him for swinging on the (low) branch of a tree! His feet barely off the ground... I was right there and would have stopped him if it looked at all dangerous. It made me wonder if he was getting a bit of a name for himself at school amongst the staff.

OP posts:
ICANDOTHAT · 12/02/2009 17:47

I'm afraid that is the reality. Sometimes, I think my ds doesn't stand a chance now as he has established the 'naughty' boy reputation and he can't breath without someone being on his case, including the other children. That's the way of the world, I'm afraid

Does he have friends in his class? Has this behaviour started recently or always been there?

Original poster
andlipsticktoo · 12/02/2009 17:58

He had a few 'episodes' in Reception in the second term. This calmed down and he pretty much managed to stay under the radar until a few weeks ago...

He is very strong willed and does have the occasional tantrum at home, but nothing that has worried me at all.

OP posts:
Original poster
andlipsticktoo · 12/02/2009 18:00

Yes he does have friends in his class, his favourite 3 boys all have a tendancy to be 'silly' and they are often in trouble at school too, just not as often as DS3!

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ICANDOTHAT · 12/02/2009 20:46

A magnet to the spirited kids, just like my ds .... won't do him any favours, but to hell with it. I think they all add to the diversity of human nature and just because they can be a pain in the a* at times, doesn't mean they are bad people. Blimey, my mum never told me it would be like this!

The friends are a positive sign that he is able to socialise and attract other kids. He will mature and I bet you by the end of this academic year, they are telling you he is a different child.

Leo9 · 12/02/2009 21:35

I think if the daily 'reports' carry on, ask for a meeting with the teacher and discuss what strategies they are using to try to curb what he's doing. They should IMO have a very clear and organised system of consequences which your DS is clear about so that he knows where the boundary lies. The teacher needs to be able to be very firm and clear with him to enforce any boundaries so you need to know exactly what they are doing IMO.

Also IMO I would ask for an Ed Psych assessment if they are thinking his behaviour is a real problem because this will tell them just how bright he is and may then explain why he is disruptive, he may well be nowhere near stretched enough. And he may need to be on the SEN register/G & T register to ensure they are meeting his needs.

And finally I personally would totally bin your sticker thing with him. At this age, for me, it is healthier to let school deal with school stuff. He doesn't need the same stuff dealt with twice, eg at home and school; that's too much pressure at this age, and unfair IMO, will just lead to resentment. At this age and stage I think what they need is a clean slate at home and their own space....shame to bring the school probs home if he's such a good boy usually at home. Just my approach, anyway.

ICANDOTHAT · 12/02/2009 21:46

andlipsticktoo - is your son in a private school? just wondered ....

mlm19 · 12/02/2009 21:48

ICANDOTHAT a school can't say a child has mild ADHD, that must come from ED Psychologists.

Having taught Year 1 for years, most young boys struggle. The free play is greatly reduced and time is far more structured. Teachers' teach very hands on in a highly play based approach but it is more formal with longer period of sitting. Not ideal I know!

I agree with Leo9 about the home school links however he needs to know you are in full support of his teacher.

Does he know his teacher thinks he is bright?