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Behaviour/development

Talk to others about child development and behaviour stages here. You can find more information on our development calendar.

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Original poster

DD's friend has been abusing another classmate, her mum wants DD to stay at her house.

99 replies

suchAdilemma · 17/06/2008 21:14

I don't know what to do. DD is friends with two girls (all of them are 5 or 6). DD told me the other day that she saw girl A put her hand into girl B's private parts when she went to the toilet. When DD asked girl A what she was doing, she said 'nothing' and left the toilet. Girl B started crying and told DD that this girl kept playing mummies and daddies and pushing her fingers in and hurting her. This happens every day at school. She also said that girl A had told her that if she told anyone that she would 'hurt her hard in her tummy'. When DD told me this I was obviously shocked - I rang girl B's mum and told her this. She has found out that this all started when her DD was 4, and has been happening whenever they play together. Girl B's mum has confronted girl A's mum, but doesn't think she has spoken to her daughter.
I asked DD if girl A has ever tried to do this with her, and she says no. However, DD doesn't like going over to her house to play, but will only say 'because she doesn't play nicely mummy'. Now I have had a phone call this evening from girl A's mum asking if DD can go over for tea this week. I have made an excuse, saying that the girls have fallen out, but I really don't know what I should do - should I confront her myself and let her know that I know? This seems completely abnormal behaviour from a 6 year old girl, and I am worried sick about it. I wonder if girl A's mum thinks it is just a harmless game they have been playing, and is in denial about this.

OP posts:

Scuff · 17/06/2008 21:27

The childs' mother has already been informed.

"Girl B's mum said that girl A's mum didn't know how to handle it".

ravenAK · 17/06/2008 21:27

I would initially contact school - ask for the 'named person' for child protection issues.

I'd be very wary of saying anything to Girl A's mum - as Quintessential Shadows said, you can't predict the repercussions.

Sounds quite a bit beyond normal. experimental behaviour.

Sidge · 17/06/2008 21:32

Oh this is very sad.

Certainly rings alarm bells for me - that seems beyond normal exploratory sexual behaviour, especially the threats not to tell and hurting in her tummy.

I would make some excuse not to let my DD play at her house, however feeble it sounded, and contact the school in confidence. They will have a protocol for dealing with suspected abuse and then you can reassure yourself knowing that you have passed it on to people that can take action.

VeniVidiVickiQV · 17/06/2008 21:32

Ditto what Colditz and avenap said.

How very awful for all involved

Original poster

suchAdilemma · 17/06/2008 21:33

Thank you all so much for your replies. The thread is moving so fast, I am having trouble reading your responses. Unfortunately Girl B's mother has already spoken to girl A's mother. If I don't reply again until later, it is because I am going to ring girl B's mum again and discuss contacting the CPO.

OP posts:

VeniVidiVickiQV · 17/06/2008 21:35

I think you need to take action, but it would be courteous of you to inform girl B's mum before you do. A tough situation for all of you.

And there was me worrying about the girl in DD's class who according to DD "smacks" other children.......

bumpbumpbump · 17/06/2008 21:37

As many others are suggesting - this rings of abuse.
What about ringing Childline or NSPCC for another professional view on best course of action. They may have a strategy / advice that we're not aware of here on this forum??

Hangingbellyofbabylon · 17/06/2008 21:41

Not much to add that the others haven't already said - just for girl A and sorry that you are in this situation and I hope you are able to get in touch with the school and that they will follow it all up.

Hangingbellyofbabylon · 17/06/2008 21:41

Sanctuary · 17/06/2008 21:43

"but does`nt think she has spoken to her daughter"

CaN`t believe the girls mum A seems not to be dealing with this and phones you up for a playdate as if nothing is happening

tori32 · 17/06/2008 21:44

You need to speak to school and contact SS. As many people have said, girl A sounds like she is being abused. At this age it is not normal for children to be experimenting like this. She has either been watching inappropriate TV or had it done to her. It needs investigating.
I wouldn't tell mum of girl A why your dd doesn't want to come for tea. Just say she doesn't want to.

bossybritches · 17/06/2008 21:45

Agree with Avenapp this would ring BIG alarm bells with me having done some CP training.

Dreadful for you & everyone involved but as others have said PLEASE don't ignore it.

One thing I ALWAYS remember from my CP training days was the SW saying every little bit of information may help fit a bigger jigsaw together that you may never see but may help a Safeguarding children team take action to save a child/family from further abuse/harm.YOUR bit of info may be the linking piece that confirms lots of other pieces.

critterjitter · 17/06/2008 21:51

Child Protection Officer. NSPCC. Social Services.

RosaLuxembunting · 17/06/2008 21:55

You don't need to contact SS. The school are obliged to do that if you report the incident to them.

avenanap · 17/06/2008 22:02

The school are required to follow their child protection procedure, which may or may not involve ss. My best friends a teacher, a child has to tell her they are being abused for her to do anything. I don't know if this is normal across all counties.

Talk to the school first, ask them what their policies are. If they wait to contact ss, phone the NSPCC who will be able to advise you better.

I know that this may be really difficult for you and you are probably feeling confused. We are all here for you. The main thing is that you do something to help these children. It sounds like they are both at risk, one from someone else, one from the other. You are a brave person for helping them. You should be proud of asking for help.Just try to remember that they are both in need.

vInTaGeVioLeT · 17/06/2008 22:04

talk to the school about this - it needs serious attention, by professionals.

it sounds as if this child has been seriously abused and the girl she has abused herself will no doubt need some kind of help coming to terms with this too

tori32 · 17/06/2008 22:11

Avenap, this is why you should speak to SS direct. They can act on anything untoward that is reported, in complete confidence. They don't need to wait for the child to say they are being abused. A good job really since most abused children will not tell due to fear of reprisals from the abuser.

avenanap · 17/06/2008 22:21

It can be daunting for someone to do this. SS can initiate an investigation in days, it's better IMO to notify the people caring for the chid/ren as soon as possible as they will be able to document any behaviour/comments in the mean time IYSWIM. Some SS take time to get into action, this is time that child is still at risk. In an ideal world they will both start to get their act together from the start but I have yet to see this. I seriously would notify the school first then SS. It's the schools responsibility under every child matters to impliment the safeguards and procedures.

Original poster

suchAdilemma · 17/06/2008 22:47

I have spoken to girl B's mum. I told her that I am going to speak to the CPO tomorrow. She has asked me not to just yet, and says she wants to do it together, but is going to ask girl A's mum first, to give her chance to do something about it.
I pointed out that girl A's mum is behaving as if nothing has happened, and it is unlikely that she has said anything to her daughter or done anything about it, and most likely needs professional help to know how to deal with it - all the family will need support if girl A is being abused.

This is so sad. The poor, poor girl.

OP posts:

Yurtgirl · 17/06/2008 22:56

Will you go ahead and speak to the cpo anyway? I would 9am tommorrow if it were me

Original poster

suchAdilemma · 17/06/2008 23:01

I don't know yurtgirl - my daughter was a witness, not the one being abused. I want to let girl B's mum deal with it her way, but I also want this investigated asap.
I will speak to her directly after she has spoken to girl A's mum tomorrow.

OP posts:

controlfreakyagain · 17/06/2008 23:07

so what that she was "just" a witness. she told you and know you have the responsibility to act on what you now know....

Yurtgirl · 17/06/2008 23:07

Its hard isnt it

I am planning on having a quiet word with my ds teacher tommorrow about something far more trivial - feels like you are interferring etc but if it benefits the child, in the long run it has got to be worth it

Ds informed me today that basically the whole class are saying that G smells, his clothes I think. "Stay away from G, he smells!" Poor kid, he is only 6

It is beyond me to do nothing so am going to mention it tommorrow as ds is convinced the teacher knows nothing - if she did she would have stopped it so ds is probably right

Hope you sort this out such a dilemma

Do please let us all know what happens

avenanap · 17/06/2008 23:14

This must be hard for you and I really do feel for you. My work hat here tells me that you need to ignore what B's mother and A's mother are telling you here. Both children are suffering harm here, there's no if's and but's about it. Talking about it won't make it better and waiting isn't going to help. Your daughter was very brave in telling you this and she (and the other girls) are relying on you to do something. There is a big chance that the person who is abusing A is part of her family. Every day she is in danger and I dread to think about what could be happening to her. It pains me to even think of this. You have the power to help her. Even though your daughter was just a witness, she has done the right thing by bringing this to your attention because she knows that it's wrong. You should be proud of her. I have known children that have been abused, their parents have done nothing because they didn't want to admit that it was happening. It is unthinkable. The other mother shouldn't be speaking to A's mother. You need to do what is right, not what you think. You need to notify the authorities so that they can protect both of these children. They are both in danger of suffering unimaginable harm. I can't stress how much you need to do something about this. Please, please go to the school, then contact the NSPCC. If you don't feel as though you can do this then CAT me and I will do this for you. A and B's mothers won't be thinking clearly, I promise you that. The longer it takes for them to get their heads together the longer these children will be suffering. Talk to the school regardless. We all have a duty to protect children from harm.

Yurtgirl · 17/06/2008 23:17

Because of course girl B has been abused too

I would also be happy to report this to the nspcc myself if you feel unable to suchadilemma

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