Help me with DS2 who refuses to get dressed

[MummyDoIt]

Every morning we have the same argument. DS1 gets up and dresses himself for school, no problem. DS2 (aged 4) always makes a big fuss. Says he doesn't want to get dressed, refuses to take off his own pyjamas. Nine times out of ten it ends up with me forcibly removing them and him screaming. It gets the day off to such a bad start, with us all running late, DS2 in a temper and me completely stressed out. Plus the screaming is disturbing DH and I can't have that (some mornings, he's so bad, he's probably disturbing half the street as well). My usual method of disciplining him is to tell him I'll take away pocket money which works well at any other time of the day but, first thing in the morning, he takes absolutely no notice. Just screams. Any help gratefully accepted. I'm beginning to dread getting up because I know I'll have this little scene to get through.

Well I'm with Beetroot too. Either you continue to have these screaming stressed out episodes, or you give it no attention whatsoever.

He's unlikely to actually not get dressed if he knows you are serious abou just leaving him to it. I just say "it's your choice and your responsibility" to DS, abou tgetting washed, dressed, wearing shoes, carrying his lunchbox or bookbag to school etc. and it works fine.

Beetroot DS went through a phase of wearing pants on his head as a hat for a few weeks when he was three!

but cod English batsmen don't tend to have their helmets on for that long

My dd used to do this.

I told her "right, so you have to go to school in pyjamas"

She got dressed in 30 seconds.

Call his bluff.

Message withdrawn

have you tried no breakfast until he is dressed? My boys are always responsive to situations where their stomachs don't get filled...

I bet he loves the attention he gets from you every single day without fail mummydoit!

oh and ds1 wore a mixing bowl on his head to playgroup

think he was batman too
am pmsl

and and and - they all shower/brush hair and dress themsleves now did them no harm

at mixing bowl, that is classic!

DS likes to wear odd shoes. His problem, not mine.

My DD1 is 3 and a half, and I had a similar problem for a while a few months back. As soon as I said it was time to get dressed she'd have a tantrum and prevaricate and it'd tak AGES and eventually I'd have to force her and fight her into her clothes. It set the whole day off on a terrible footing and I realised I couldn't continue that way. She goes to nursery in the mornings and, like you, I didn't like the idea of the pjs option, mainly because DH takes her in a bike seat and I really don't think she can go on a bike in her pjs (especially in midwinter when this was!) What worked for me was simply ignoring her. We made sure we gave ourselves plenty of extra time in the morning, once we were up I'd say it was time to get dressed and if she refused or had a tantrum etc I'd tell her that DH, DD2 and I were going down to breakfast and she could stay in her room until she was ready to get dressed and join us and walk out and shut the door. This usually worked brilliantly, she'd cry and scream in her room and after a couple of minutes I'd put my head round the door and ask if she was ready to get dressed but if she was still tantruming i'd just walk out again. After about 15 - 20 mins of this and me putting my head round the door a couple of times she'd say 'I'm ready mummy'. I'd help her dress and we'd go down to breakfast without commenting on the whole furore we'd just been through. Over the course of a week the problem diminished hugely and I've never really had any problems since.

Mummydoit, have you asked him (at bed time for example) why he doesn't like getting dressed/likes to stay in pjs and whether he can think up any ideas for making it easier.

I have been using this on DS since he was four and he has come up with lots of solutions that have worked for him.

There's advice on this in 'how to talk so kids will listen' and it works for us.

Some great responses here. Pagwatch, you have absolutely hit the nail on the head. Children learn by negative consequences and I need to find a consequence that's worse than arguing with me. I really like your suggestion of no breakfast till he's dressed. That is so obvious - why didn't I think of that before!

Sorry if I've come across about being anal about having my kids dressed before leaving the house (Beetroot - glad I gave you a good laugh with my comment). I probably am anal about it, in the same way that I don't let my kids eat in the street or pee in the garden. It's just my way of doing things. It would be nice if people could respect that. Also, my personal standards apart, the key point here is that DS2 would not consider wearing PJs all day to be any form of punishment or negative consequence. On the contrary, he'd think all his birthdays and Christmases had come at ones. He'd absolutely love it. Going to nursery in them? Great fun! That's why I'm adamant that it's not a great way of dealing with the problem. If I take that approach, I might just as well chuck away all his other clothes and let him live in PJs.

Nelly, very reassuring to hear someone who's had the same problem and got a successful outcome. I think your approach, combined with Pagwatch's suggestion of no breakfast till dressed, might just do the trick.

I know, as some posters have pointed out, that I need to chill over this but I've got DH poorly in the other room trying to sleep, and I'm really, really conscious of the noise DS2 is making and I guess I just overreact because I'm trying to get him to shut up quickly. This thread has been really helpful in getting some perspective back and I think I'll be able to handle it more calmly tomorrow.

Thank you, lovely MNetters, for your support (but I still won't ever let him go out in his PJs ).

Well it would solve the problem of battling to get him dressed wouldn't it!

Obviously you need to find some other solution though id that isn't an option for you (which I respct). The no breakfast thing sounds like a good plan. Try to give it very little attention though. Just state in a firm but normal voice that he has to get dsressed before breakfast. Don';t enter into arguments and begotiations, that will give you the upper hand. Do the whole broken record repeating thing too:

"Here are your clothes. Get dressed and then you can have breakfast"

DS "no I'm not getitng dresed"

"Get dressed and then you can have breakfast"

DS "NO NO NO"

"Get dressed and then you can have breakfast"

DS"I'm NOT GETTING DRESSED. You are STUPID. NO NO NO"

"Get dressed and then you can have breakfast"

I'm sure you get the poiint. Your DS will get bored and hungry and hoepfully problem solved.

God luck.

Put him to bed in pink pjs. I'll bet even the threat of having to wear them to school will get him dressed in 10 seconds flat!!!

Just been giving this a bit more thought and was wondering about all the posters who advocate letting him wear his PJs for as long as he wants. I'm genuinely curious to know how that could work. Yes, it would stop the tantrum but wouldn't it be just giving in to him? Surely the fundamental thing about tantrums is that you don't give in to them? I know I'm definitely at fault in our situation as I'm shouting back at him when he has the tantrum. I can see I'm going wrong there and I need to calm down and handle it better and I've been given some good advice here on how to do that. However, backing down and saying 'yes, darling, you can stay in PJs all day' would be teaching him that he can get his own way by having a tantrum. If I were posting saying he wanted to watch television all day and not play with toys, would you be saying 'let him do it, he'll get bored eventually?'. The whole 'is it okay to go out in PJs?' is irrelevant, it's handling the tantrum that's the issue.

I think you need to make the consequence a pain for him and not for you. So if he would be embarrassed about going to nursery in his pjs, fine (I like the suggestion about pink ones a LOT). If not, think of something else.

I would recommend that How to talk... book v highly - lots of removing the 'battle' element from parenting

need to re-read and start applying to DS...

They never last longer than a day - if that

mine always got dressed as we were leaqving.

once they knew I didn't care and would go thorugh with it

Its not all about giving in to tantrums. With my two its more about picking your battles. If I said No/DO this with regard to everything I'd like doing by my adult standards then we would get nowhere. All they would ever here is instructions and they would just tantrum about everything or tune every instruction out. So I have to stand back and think. i.e. personally (and it is a personal thing childrearing so I don't disagree with you on the pj thing if it is something you've decided is a no back down thing) for me If they don't say please/thank you they don't get it (whatever it is) They always say please/thank you. If they want to wear something stupid to go out in I let it go but in extreme weather they have to compromise ref coats/hats etc. Meal times they eat what they want to own their plates within reason. If they're genuinely not hungry then they can leave it but they have to agree if they're not hungry enough for dinner they get no afters. If there is one new thing on their plate they have to at least try a bit. If they don't like it they are more than welcome to leave it (that's a rare one though - they eat just about everything) I don't lay down the law too harshly on the odd broken toy/cat fight, but wanton acts of destuction or violence are not tolerated. biting is always a no-no. So yes I would let them go to school in pjs because its not a battle that I find a big deal - But if its raining its pjs and coat and hat. Any rigidness/tantrummyness will be ignored. I can force a rigid child into clothing if necessary (but me and them know its unpleasant so half way through I'll stop and ask if we want to do it calmly and nicely and generally they will calm down) - That sounds a bit harsh, I'm not saying I hurt them in any way. I just don't get them dressed in the nice chatty way - Its all no nonsense no smiles.
None of this is in any way me saying I do this, its right. Far from it I think I am a very very imperfect mom, I'm just answering your question to the best of my ability

It's about picking your battles mummydoit. I don't think parents have to have the final say on everything their children do, I believe children should be given responsibility for themselves. To my mind, wearing your PJs all day is no big deal as it doesn't actually hurt anyone, it's not vital to a child's safety or health that they are in 'day clothes'. Children like to fit in with societal norms though, so if left to their own devices would get dressed every day. The reason your DS isn't is because it has become a battleground for you both, and a guaranteed way of getting your attention.

The point is, I bet for most of the parents here who have told their children that if they don't get dressed they will be wearing pjs to school, those kids quickly get dressed.

I'm not going to waste time and energy battling with DS on a matter that doesn't actually matter to his health or safety just on the 'principal' of not letting him 'win'. Life's too short.

What mistypeaks said too.

Parenting works if it is consistant. So if you have certain rules (and as the parent you get to decide on these rules) you stick to these. Kids learn quickly.

Because I don't have a rule about getitng dressed, DS isn't going to throw a tantrum abou tnot wanting to get dressed, so it's not like I'm giving in to anything. It has never been a battleground, that's all.

I have a rule that he carries his own coat/lunchbox/bag etc. he has in the past tried to refuse to and shout at me to carry them, I simply say "no It's your responsibility, if you don't want to carry it leave it on the pavement" and continue walking. He always then picks it up and carries it, but if he where to leave it there I wouldn't then go and pick it up and carry it for him, so he wouldn't be winning, he'd just be responsible for loosing his own belongings. His choice. His loss. Not worth battling over.

My DS1 used to do exactly the same thing - when he was 4. Its just a power thing I think. In the end I used to just put his clothes by the front door and whipped all his clothes off 10 minutes before leaving. Then when it was time to go I announce we were leaving. Then made a big funny scene of 'eeek, we forgot to get you dressed!' Quick put all your clothes on otherwise everyone will see your bum!'. Another thing I did was pretend there were different animal noises in his clothes and made a different sound when he put a leg/arm in. Better to turn it into a joke than battle - they will always win the stubborn little buggers. Also a clothes treasure hunt helps, but they have to put on the found item of clothing before finding the next one.

DS1 now 5.5 and putting all his clothes on himself (albeit needing help with socks). I just ask him where I should leave them for him to put on. I've made up a rule that all 6 year olds have to put all there own clothes on so we need to practise at the sock thing before then.

He will grow out of it - and probably soon! The trick is to try to stay sane in the meantime.

MummyDoIt on Mon 02-Jun-08 12:26:07
"Just been giving this a bit more thought and was wondering about all the posters who advocate letting him wear his PJs for as long as he wants. I'm genuinely curious to know how that could work. Yes, it would stop the tantrum but wouldn't it be just giving in to him?"

The point would lie in the hope that the other children would tease him mercilessly or that his nursery teacher would tell him off. So he would have to take the social consequences rather than you protecting him from them and that would be his punishment. If he is too little for this to happen, then yes I agree there is little point.

It might just work (if he is old enough to be embarrassed) because the consequences would be immediate. Letting him watch TV all day is a totally different kettle of fish as the consequences (growing up uneducated and stupid) are far too far away for him to have any chance of understanding.

Personally, I would probably just carry on dressing him forcibly without arguing or paying him much attention. If you don't get upset it's not half so bad a battle.

Mummydoit, in my opinion the thing is not to let it get to the tantrum stage so you don't end up giving into a tantrum.

You say 'it's time to get dressed'. He says 'no'. You say, 'ok, I'll guess you'll be going out in your pjs' He is either horrified by the idea and says 'no, no mummy, help me get dressed' or he thinks it's a great idea and he goes out in his pjs.

Of course you can't always avoid the tantrum because you don't know what is going to spark it off. When this happens with DD and am happy to do things her way, I wait until she has calmed down and say something like 'Gosh, you really don't want to do xxxx' but I don't like the way you just showed me that. You need to tell me in a calm voice'.
We are getting more and more expressing her desires in a calm manner and less and less tantrums but it's a slow old process (she is 3).

I don't think it's just two options as in doing as you currently are and bodily making him dress with the resulting screaming OR letting him remain in PJs.

I just think you need to ask the question differently.

As someone suggested earlier, making it a game or competition is almost BOUND to work; kids this age are so competitive and can't resist a challenge. DS and DH used to have a dressing race every day (DS always won )

Also we used to use role play alot, make his clothes part of his play (as in train drivers uniform, superhero pants etc)

Withdrawing attention doesn't have to mean letting him wear what he likes, it can mean giving positive attention to another aspect of the whole sitation, eg the fun part of it rather than the power struggle.