Dealing with difficult eaters...at what age do you say "that's your meal, you're not having anything else until you eat it" etc etc

[hattyyellow]

Would welcome any help.

We have twin girls who are 2.5 years old.

When they were weaned they were great eaters..everything I gave them they happily ate, all sorts of vegetables and fruit, fish pie, chicken, all flavours and styles of food..I thought I had it cracked..

Then they discovered toddler rebellion..I used to enjoy cooking something for us that they'd also eat but now they're even refusing pasta..They will quite happily eat a meal of "picnic" type food..some cheese, some toast, hummus, some bits of ham, sometimes cucumber and cherry tomatoes, most types of fruit, yogurt..They will also eat scrambled eggs, baked beans and fishfingers...

They will occasionally eat pasta with home made tomato sauce...other recipes which my friends cook for their children who happily eat it seem to fall by the wayside with mine...they won't eat spag bol, macaroni cheese, stew, risotto, chicken dishes, fish pie etc...

I don't think I'm that bad a cook that my cooking is putting them off...they just won't try anything that looks like a proper dish. I've tried putting in lots of cheerfully coloured foods, making the flavour not too bland but not too strong..

DH now thinks we should try the line of "that's your meal so eat it" rather than allowing them to fill up on yogurt/fruit/toast when they don't eat whatever "proper" meal I've prepared...but neither of us wants to see a 2.5 year old go to bed hungry..

What age would you start following this course of action? Any tips for getting them to eat? I try and stay pretty calm at meal times, sometimes I try and coax, sometimes I rename things "mr tumble pasta" etc but they're still not interested...

I'm sure I'm not the only one with toddlers like this with their eating - it's just I haven't met anyone in RL whose toddler seems to do the same...and whenever we go out/or I feel sad that they won't eat the dish that's there..

i dont know what others have said but my dd is a lot like this.

i try a variety of approaches, somestimes if i know shes not interested i say 'that's your dinner, if you don't eat it you go hungry' she normally goes hungry, although is never up in the night.

a lot of the time i make it into a game. we have penne pasta or 'pasta straws', that we suck sauce through then eat. etc etc. sometimes i tell her her grandad (the best thing since sliced bread) likes it and we can phone him after dinner to tell him she likes them too.

it's a lot of persuesion and co-ersion (sp?!?! brain has been lost today!) but it generally works and most of the time she eats something!

i'd say good luck. and they aren't too young to be told that's your dinner eat it, if not nothing else if my 1yo doesnt eat his dinner he doesnt get anything else except his bottle!

I have the same problem but my son is almost 5 and every mealtime a battle, i have 3 other children that will eat almost everything they are given, so i really cannot understand what i have done wrong!! The main problem we have is that he won't touch any fruit or veg and i have tried dried fruit, fresh fruit, tinned fruit, i've tried putting it in jelly with icecream, i always put the veg on his plate hoping that 1 day he might decide to eat it and have tried stoping treats after meal if he doesn't eat it and saying there won't be anything else you'll go hungary but he has always had a problem going for a number 2 and i think this is made worse by the fact that he doesn't eat well. I've had hv round and he's been at the docs but they just keep given him laxatives. So i have decided to give him what he will eat, which is pasta, noodles, toast, crumpets, pizza, even though i know i shouldn't because he is very small. I am taking him back to docs and i would like them to refer him to have scan of his bowels, because i still think there is more to this!! What does everyone else think sorry to hijack...

It's tough. DD (2) was like this and DW absolutely hated the idea that she was going to bed hungry. Although this sounds awful, and although I also hate the idea, if DD does go to bed hungry simply because she's chosen to turn down things that have been offered to her (and which she's eaten happily in the past) that is her choice. Really it is. Otherwise you end up in the situation where we got to in the past where you're bring a procession of foodstuffs to her for her to pick and choose from - couple of bites of beans, half a yoghurt, bite of biscuit, half a banana etc. in the vain hope that she fills her tummy. Then every day becomes like that because they know they can get away with it - toddlers are fantastic but they are staggeringly manipulative little things!

The thing with DD was we knew she could eat well because she'd eat regularly and lots at nursery at whatever was put in front of her but at home she'd turn down stuff she was eating a couple of weeks previously. What we do now is pretty simple - if we give her something she's had before and she doesn't eat it, we just move on and give her the desert/ fruit course and that's it for the meal. If she's not had it before and she won't try it, ditto. If she's not had it before and tries it but doesn't like it then fair enough, she gets another more familiar option.

I think the key thing is for everyone not to get stressed about it. Tell her what it is, how you made it, offer it, just chat to her whilst you do it, maybe have a taste yourself, wander off, get her a drink. All really low key. Praise her if she tries something new or if she eats well. Don't tell her off if she doesn't just accept it and move on. It's amazing, the less of a song and dance you make about it, the better it is. That's not to say, by the way, she's a wonderful eater now, but she's certainly a lot better than she was!

It is REALLY HARD! My 20 month DS has been a great eater but over the past few weeks has started to refuse dishes he loved before. One funny one is that he won't eat cereal with milk in it but will happily eat it dry and drink the milk from a cup - so I think the comment made about food being more acceptable if it is separate is spot on!

My DD is now 5 and always disliked some veg; broccoli for example. I just kept putting it on her plate and clearing it away without comment. She finally started eating it about 6 months ago and now asks for more!

I try not to worry too much, which is easier said than done, as it all seems to work out in the end.... as most other toddler problems do!

It sounds like you are doing a great job!

I am in the smae boat as you hattyyellow, although my Dt's are not the smae age as yours i do have a 2year old, who drives me frigging crazy!
One day she'll eat something, the next day she won't, (she asserting her self don't you know) I just tell her she is not having anything else to eat until her dinner is gone (or at least half of it), and if she does eat all her dinner I will give her a treat, like ice cream or something that she wants, it dosn't work all the time as she is just adament that if she doesn't want to eat something then she won't eat it.

I do however make sure that she has a least 3 cups of full fat milk a day as the fat in that alone can help sustain them, but only after her failed meals.
I do find that if she has not eaten her lunch she will be more willing to attempt her dinner , so I try not to giver her anything other than milk and juice between those times, it's hard as my dh always comes home and has something to eat and just can't help himself, he just has to give her some (drives me crazy)

Still haven't mastered getting her to sit at the table for her meals, but I think that if she is walking around and eating it is better than not eating at all.

I dread to think what my dt's will be like at this age with their food.

It's not a course of action I've ever taken. I make sure they are hungry-ish at tea time (limit snacks), if they don't eat it it's because they really don't like it. I offer bread and butter etc.

You don't have to do it if you don't want to.

Wow, thanks so much for all the responses. I'm heartened that so many people are also struggling with toddler mealtimes! Will read through all the replies carefully tonight..

Cestlavie, we use the same approach as you for dd 4. She eats great at school and grandmas etc, but at home her universe of acceptable foods shrinks and varies from day to day.

She is 4 and still fussy. But I cannot be arsed to work up a sweat over it.

pointydog- if they don't eat it it's because they really don't like it

If only that were true, it's not that they don't like it,it is them asserting themselves at this age, they have just discovered free will and want to use it as much as they can and in as many situations as they can, hence the tantrums etc.

If you just keep giving them something that they will eat along with something that they will possibly say no to, then at least you know that they will be having something to eat even if it is not what you would have wanted them to pick,
You say your dt's only eat fish fingers beans etc, then use those things in as many meal combinations as you can think of adding something different with it every time just to see if they will infact try something different.
If they don't eat it then they don't eat it, but it won't do them any harm to try, if you haaven't already.

I don't get this, cestlavie: "Then every day becomes like that because they know they can get away with it - toddlers are fantastic but they are staggeringly manipulative little things!"

Why would a child choosing to eat a particular food or not be a matter of manipulating their parents? Surely, left to themselves and offered food regularly of a kind they like, a child will eat when hungry and not when not?

"Manipulation" is only a relevant concept when one person is unable to have their preferences taken seriously at face value by another. Why would we not take seriously and at face value the food preferences of our children? It's their mouth, their body, their digestion. It's their cravings telling them they need more potassium (bananas) or more omega oil (oily fish) or whatever.

Fussy eater or arsey toddler? If arsey toddler whose favourite word is no, try giving them a choice. Scrmabled egges or fish fingers? They have a little control as they have chosen. Worth a shot?

Def don't spend ages cooking for them. Make really simple things if you think they're just going to refuse it.

I think its very tricky

I don't think what they eat or don't eat is really much of my business, provided its healthy (I don't allow unlimited sugar or colourings etc, and anyone who thinks I should can have ds for the day...)

OTOH I have 2, nearly 3 kids close in age, and am not going to spend my life making different food for everyone. I do also think its good for people to eat broadly the same thing-eating is a social thing as far as I am concerned.

So for some meals, like breakfast and lunches out at the cafe and so on, the kids can choose whatever they like, I don't much care.

For meals that we are eating as a Proper Family (5/7 lunches and most suppers), we tend to talk together about what we will make and everyone has the option to object at that stage. Then everyone can pitch in and help cook if they want. And then we sit down and eat it together. And THEN we all clean up, or at the least, the adults clean up, and the kids have to sort themselves out til we are done.

I don't offer an alternative but there is always fruit and bread and peanut butter and milk, and they just help themselves to it as and when...I am not usually aware of how much of this stuff they have had really . They can make their own snack food fine, even my 2 year old can do peanut butter sandwiches (though we have to slice the bread)

But this is what my family is like, the kids LIKE cooking and they LIKE eating. I like cooking and eating, I would HATE to be making beans on toast for one kid while everyone else had salmon, I'd rather just make something that everyone would eat.

I dunno if its about saying "eat this or go hungry". What is IS about for me is making eating a pleasant family occasion that the kids want to participate in.

I would also never make them eat what was on their plate. And we don't have puddings, so there is no issue with the pudding-reward thingy. I don't think I'd actually stop them from getting up and getting themselves some peanut butter if they hated the food we had prepared, but I wouldn't interupt the family meal to get it for them (especially when they CAN get it themselves...)

(they are 4 and 2 if that helps)

I think what celavie means is that not eating food can be a great way to get the parents' attention if they are concerned about it. I did the 'pretend not to be bothered' and it absolutely worked - for me (important distinction). Now I really don't have to be bothered - it's fantastic. However, my sister's DD just cannot stand fruit, and I think she would be like this however she was treated. (Though my sister did get thoroughly stressed about it, which never helps.)

I am a little confused. If they want attention, why not give them attention?

I wouldn't turn it into a struggle over food. I'd get them helping me choose, cook and also wash up. I'd offer them attention, but not in a way that disrupted the meal for everyone else.

(but aaargh I am not making light of this picky eating thing, I HAVE never had a picky eater and I don't presume to know what its like)

haven't read thread but wanted to hijack to say OOOOOOOH WELCOME BACK FILLY!

filly, "I like cooking and eating, I would HATE to be making beans on toast for one kid while everyone else had salmon, I'd rather just make something that everyone would eat."

Reading your posts, I did not think you had fussy eaters. Making beans on toast would be a dream for me. The reality is that there ISN'T one healthy thing that dd or ds will reliably eat. That changes from day to day, sometimes meal to meal. And dd can ask for one thing, like ham sandwich, then stoutly refuse to eat it, asking for another, with tantrums if not forthcoming.

How far we go to accommodate (if at all) is up to us. But the reality of life with a fussy eater does not lend itself to rational rules. And dh and I love food and cook loads.

I have an incredibly fussy 5 yr old DS. There isn't a lot he will eat, but he does get most of the nutrients he needs thrughout the day, even if it is the same as the day before. He is imporving, but very, very slowly. When I did a roast I would have to make some of the roast potatoes look like wedges instead as this was all he would eat, but now he does eat proper roast potatoes (he wolfed loads down on Christmas day at MIL's!) He was fussy about sandwiches and always asked for butter sandwiches, so we replaced the butter with philaephia and he happily eats those. he loves milk, yoghurt, cheese. Another way he has improved is by eating proper fish instead of just fishfingers which is fabulous! We are now trying to convince him that chicken is in fact the same as you get inside chicken nuggets.

My problem is DH. I opt for the calm, eat what you want to eat on your plate, but don't fuss. DH just can't seem to stop nagging. It makes for a very stressful mealtime. I have told him that I would actually not want to eat if he was scrutinising everything I was doing at mealtimes and mabe DS feels the same!! We had a stressful meal time on Saturday which I nearly walked away from, but he was sooo much better yesterday! And we had a lovely family meal. I do encourage DS, but not to the point that he is upset and stressed about what he needs to eat. I'm just hoping that very soon, DH understands that he nees to calm down at meal times! I sometimes am grateful DH works away Monday to Friday most weeks because we have calm meals then!

I would be dancing on the table if DS ate Beans on toast But I can see what Filly means, DH gives the wrong attention.

Mostly we offer what we are having with something I know he will et, whether it be bread and butter etc etc. He can then choose to try something if he wants to (which he rarely does, but has surprised us sometimes) he laso used to be a great eater but that changed when DS3 came along on his 2nd birthday.

I think the OP's children sound quite normal and I think the picnic foods they are eating are fine

i think it is ok to let them go on eating picnic style at this age and you can offer a wide range of healthy foods in this way - put them on their plate or on a serving plate from which they can choose - some children do enjoy helping themselves IME

at what age is it appropriate to send a child to bed hungry - as a discipline issue, never! why would this be an appropriate thing to do? however your job is to PROVIDE and OFFER a range of appetising foods, not to ENSURE the child eats it

if there are junk foods which you object to them filling up on instead of 'proper' meals, then don';t have those foods in the house. This way all food in the house is healthy, appropriate food that can be eaten at any time, according to appetite and preference. There isn't a need to get wound up about food if you can keep this in mind. I know it is hard - I have a pretty good eater and it still winds me up sometimes - but I try to keep this as my philosophy when I can

heck, ds1 is always having what you call picnic food

in fact most lunches consist of "bits and pieces" (usually cheese, cucumber, some raw veg - maybe carrots or sugar snaps, ham, possibly some bread and butter)

when i ask him what he's like for tea he often says "lunch"

no, I quite see that it must be difficult to have kids who are picky eaters. And if beans on toast is too fussy-god that must be seriously hard work. (though the OP's kids DO eat beans on toast). I am certainly not smug enough to think that non-fussy eating is all training, I think a huge amount of it is luck (I read somewhere that "fussy eaters" have either more or less-can't remember exactly-tastebuds).

I also think that if the kids are eating yoghurt, fruit and humous and so forth, that isn't much of an issue really. Thats all healthy stuff.

Re-reading the OP, the problem here seems to be that kids aren't eating the food that the dp wants. But they ARE eating healthy stuff. Actually, the food they are choosing seems to me to be healthier, more fun and less hassle than the food that the dp is suggesting...

I also note that the OP does at least have KIDS who eat the same thing. God that could be a nightmare otherwise.

I think, in the scenario described, I'd actually just give them what they wanted, and just as a family have picnic food for a bit-you could always have extras for those who wanted it. HOWEVER I'd also get them into cooking. My 2.6 yo year old can cut up cheese, wash cucumber, make toast, serve yoghurt etc. I'd also try to work out what food actually did interest them and go from there. Maybe they could have more weird and wonderful vegetables? Often kids need to try things, and see adults around them trying things, quite a lot of times before they will actually try it themselves, which is fair enough really.

I think what I was trying to say in my first post was that I think food is too important (and fun) to have a head on conflict over. So long as they are not subsisting on junk (oh I DO think that some foods are junk, sorry), this is a food preferance more than pickiness, I think.

I also think that developing a wide palate at this age is something really worth perserving with.

your 2.6 year old can make toast..? fillyomena, is that true?

Meely2,this sounds exactly like my 4 yr old DS. Fourth night in a row he has whinged over dinner. Promises of treats, threats to remove toys, even to go to bed, don't work. He likes bed actually, was singing there quite happily. I take him to nursery, they do cook-chill stuff, he eats it. At dinner time I can't bear to see him not eat good food when have gone to effort of serving/cooking (so tired after work) so I get cross. Doesn't help that hes skinny anyway. Meanwhile I like food so much am back on diet - fussy eater curious alien to my Scottish brain! DH says no milk tomorrow before nursery to make him know what hunger feels like but this seems harsh, but he's wearing us both out - a meal like this takes an hour while he picks and we get cross and its ruining our time in the evenings. I swear nursery could serve bugs and he'd eat it!