How do I help my 5-year-old to socialise?

[imaginaryfriend]

My dd seems to be getting more and more shy. She's always struggled socially but at parties would join in a bit with games like musical statues etc. We've been to a lot of parties lately and she seems to spend most of the time sitting as close to me as possible. I've thought about leaving her but she gets hysterical at the prospect and won't go unless I promise I'll stay. In any case I think she's just as shy when she's at school and I'm not there.

Today we went to a really sweet birthday party - just dd and 6 other girls, all from her Reception class, all really lovely girls. I watched her and, no exaggeration, she didn't say a single word the whole time to any of them. Not a word. Not during games, tea, anything. She didn't say hello when we arrived or goodbye when we left. And what worried me even more was that none of the other girls seemed to expect her to, like they're used to her being separate. They all chatted to each other about their dresses, what they were doing etc. and dd sat by herself fiddling around with whatever was at hand.

I understand shyness, being shy myself, but I do wish there was something I could do to help dd. I can't help but feel that the longer she goes without friends, the harder she'll find it to make them.

She does have 2 friends who she sees outside of school who are dds of friends and she's very friendly and chatty with them. We've known them since they were about 3 months old. However if we ever see the 2 friends at the same time dd doesn't even try to play with either of them. It's like she can only do one-on-one play with someone she knows extremely well.

Any tips on confidence building?

umm just a couple of little ones before the experts come along!!
Practice saying hello and good bye, I mean that talk to her about it remind her and practice in front of her, let her see you do it with others you get my drift

WOuld she like something like swimming, ballet? where you have to leave her (imagine yourself next to her at ballet )

But really wanted to say if there's only 6 there the girls must really like her or else she wouldn't have been invited!!

Have you asked her teacher?

I don't know but didn't want to read and run. Ds 1 is very shy and we had to take it very slowly. We talked about being shy and made him feel it was quite natural and normal to be shy. We laughed about how hard it is to talk to people sometimes and the silly things you can end up saying. Eventually got round to talking about how to approach other children if he wanted to join in etc. He did come out of himself eventually. But we still have those conversations. Perhaps you need to talk to her about how happy / unhappy she feels when she is alone in a group, and what it makes her feel like.

What doesn't work as I'm sure you know is "go on, join in, everyone else is"

Have you invited any of her class mates back to play on a 1-to-1 basis? Perhaps if she is able to familiarise herslf gently with one or two of her classmates socially in her own surroundings, that might give her the confidence to seek them out in other environments. If she is not forthcoming about which girls she would like to invite back, I would invite the ones whose mothers I like the best and who you think might be most sympathetic. That way, the entire situation is made more comfortable and you will find yourself with some added support.

Meant to say the mothers YOU like the best; you don't have to run them past me!

You mention you are shy yourself? How do you find these kind of situations? I'm just wondering if she is picking up any anxieties from you which may be making a naturally shy girl even shyer. This is not to blame you in anyway at all but I am wondering if anyone else has ever taken her to a social event and if she is any different?

I just ask because we had a little boy at our Mums and Tots group who sat with his Mum the entire time and could not be tempted to play with anyone but when his Dad brought him, it was like seeing a different child. He was much more independent.

I guess I'm thinking that maybe if you weren't there she would not see you as such an anchor and might be more able to mix.

I could be talking through my botty however. It is late! Also wondering what the teachers say about her interactions within school. I know a lot of children become a bit more clingy and shy after starting reception and she could be taking a little longer to find her feet.

Actually, Princess Buttercup makes a lot of sense. My friend made an historic effort inviting other girls for her dd to play with. Always on a one to one so that she did not feel overwhelmed. Sometimes it went brilliantly and sometimes not. But it definately made her more comfortable with her schoolfriends.

Sorry, just read my last post and worried that you might feel it implied that you were not making an effort. I didn't mean anything of the sort - it was just a bad choice of words.

Thanks for the replies.

Dd's teacher has told me on parent's evenings that dd doesn't mix with the other kids and tends to keep herself to herself, rarely puts her hand up to speak during carpet time and is reluctant to sing out loud. She also does rather sad things like sits for most of the lunchbreak in the lunch hall as she doesn't know who to play with if she goes out to the big playground.

In terms of her being invited to the party with just 6 kids, I think that's largely down to me being friends with the mum of the girl whose party it was!

As to my shyness, I'm not crippled by it at all nowadays. I have to make an effort sometimes but I'm usually very outwardly chatty and friendly.

In the summer I attempted some out of school playdates and they were all such a painful disaster I got put off. But I think you may be right, that's the way forwards.

Teacher needs to try a bit too I would say, does the school have afriendship bench?

maybe try some more informal playdates where you agree to meet up with another kid and mum in the park after school, especially if there's one where lots of other school kids go. sorry if this is obvious!

IF, my dd is v similar - but is your dd actually unhappy and alone or just content in her her own company? my mum says dd is just selective about who she plays with and will be the type to form a handful of string true friendships in her life.

I hauled dd in for hearing tests - I was concerned she ignored people as she couldn't hear them but she just isn't interested in 95% of her class, but LOVES a couple of them (though this has taken time, it's only now in Yr 1 she seems more settled). and then we're going to go and move her in 09 - argh!

just plug on with the playdates?

No experience as DS is only 2, but from my own childhood, I was a very odd child for quite a while - not quiet but strange, and fixated on teachers, distant from other children. I came out of it myself when I was good and ready.

If at all possible, I'd go softly softly and not make too much of a deal of it - rather how her friends sound to be doing it, if her party experience is representative. The trouble with pushing is you might give her the impression that it's wrong to feel shy. We all feel shy sometimes, but if she feels bad about feeling it, it will make it that bit harder to overcome.

Sorry! I don't mean it to sound like you have to have yet another thing to worry about, just to say this will resolve on its own. She knows how to play with children, is sociable in her own way and is perfectly fine, just taking her time at managing with more than one friend at a time. Society has this attitude at the moment that if you can't get something right in first year of school, you're sunk for all time, which is total sloblocks, of course. This too shall pass.

I agree with 1dilemma that teacher/school need to try a bit harder. DS2 is in reception and his school have lunch buddies - a Year 6 child is assigned to each Reception child to be their person to go to if not sure what to do (especially at the beginning of staying all day when the lucnh buddies took them to the canteen & sat with them for lunch).

The buddies keep an eye out & encourage the little ones to play with some of the others.

How is she if she goes to a friends house when it's just the other child? Maybe she's just overwhelmed when there are a lot of others - for DS2, 6 wouldn't be a lot, but DS1 prefers to be with 1 or 2 friends at a time.

Well, dinny, what you describe is very familiar to me. Dd isn't that interested in her class mates. She likes to observe them but it's almost as though she thinks she's not 'one of them' if that makes sense? As to whether or not she's sad ... I don't really know. Actually I just this minute asked her and she said 'none of them know how to play the proper games.'(i.e. her kind of games!!) She said she's not sad about it though.

I've asked her about the 'buddy' thing, which they do at school, and she was horrified that someone would 'look after her'.

GS it's useless doing that playground after school thing, it's never worked. Dd just sits with me and the other kid inevitably goes off to play with someone more sociable!

With her two old friends she plays the same game really, over and over. She's Tinkerbell and they're some other kind of pixie and they go on daring and dangerous adventures. She gets totally into it. She doesn't know how to play anything else with them so far though and is very reluctant to try.

However I do agree that the school should do a bit more to help dd. She's very bright and has a lot to say but I think she spends much of her time by herself, being quiet. We've got a progress day on 28 Jan so I'll approach the teacher about it then I think.

IF, yes, my dd always seems slightly set apart - my mum says it's very French (my mum is French) to be individual and it is something that will stand her in good stead in later life. she too gets annoyed that people won't play her games and says theirs are boring. I think there are so many dominant characters in her class that a couple control who plays what and dd is simply not a sheep so stands apart. she definitely isn't sad, just individual (I think!) but it is really traumatic to observes, isn't it?? have tried the playdate route but am not bothering this year - dd has good friends out of school and a loving happy family so just going to try and keep school in perspective! hard though, I know! I think this individualism will attract people in a couple of nyears' time - it is only while they are young all the kids let themselves be bossed around by bossy ones! sorry, long and rambling!

IF I feel for you DD as I was the same in school, I always used to sit on my own in the playground. I couldn't speak english very well & didn't know what to say, but stayed shy even once I'd learnt it. Sorry not helpful that's obviously not the problem with your dd...

Maybe try some out of school activities, if there's anything she'd like? Maybe something like Brownies where there's always activities but they can chat if they want to?

Dinny my mum is French too & never seemed bothered when teachers told her I was always on my own but it's true being an individual is a good thing later on, at uni etc.

how funny that your mum is of same opinion as mine! must be true, the French being v indivualistic!!

I was really stand offish at school. I couldn't get on with the other kids at all. part of my problem was that I had a really high reading age - 15 at 9 years old. I was given different work to the other children in my last 3 years of primary school and made to sit with a boy who was similarly advanced. Because I was musical I always had to play the recorder in the plays and such and never really got involved with the "fun" of it.

I didn't really understand the games that the other girls were into - skipping, elastics, handstands etc. I was obsessed by "The Lord of the Rings" which I read at 9 and later "Wuthering Heights" and "Jane Eyre" and lived in kind of a romantic daydream all the time. I enjoyed playing with my brother and couldn't understand why the boys and girls had to be segregated a break time.How does she get on with boys ? I hated being lumped with girls all the time and to this day find most of the stuff I'm supposed to be into "as a woman" mystifying.

My mum made things much worse by doing things like leading me by the hand up to groups of other kids ands saying "Can my little girl play with you ?" and then abandoning me. I had one "friend" that she was particularly keen for me to play with (she was a bit snobby) and I cordially hated her. One one occasion I pushed her head into our garden pond having got her to look for fish !!

Maybe your DD is just a bit more imaginative and sensitive and is bored by the other kids. I think you should try and establish if it makes her sad, and if not just let her be.

Snippety, oh that sounds so familiar! dd hates skipping and stuff like that, she can't see the point. she always wants to be doing something different and likes to stand out really, I suppose...

what job did you end up doing, out of interest? my dd seems really imaginative...

haven't read thread, sorry if repeating.

You could be describing my dd. It's agony watching them isn't it?

At first I thought it was something I needed to help to change. But now I think she is who she is. She is an individual. She enjoys playing and being by herself and really there is nothing wrong with that. She does have friends but they are not the focus of her school day. This has many advantages, for instance, she does not have a meltdown if XXX doesn't want to be her partner in PE or YYY wants to sit next to XXX and not her.

I would (and do) take dd to as many out of school clubs that I think she'd enjoy and that I can afford. I go out of my way to ensure the new friends she makes are invited round for tea.

I would also say that 5yo is still young, she will grow in confidence and the importance of friendships will grow for her I'm sure.

I was the same at that age and although I'll always be inwardly shy, I'm outwardly a very confident, chatty and sociable adult.

Good luck

My DD will be 5 in April and she also seems to get more shy... It was her first party this year and with the whole class on Saturday and I was really shocked to see how shy she was. She seemed to be fine at pre-school last year, had lots of friends... but at the party she did not seem to have any friends, seemed to be observing a lot but not talking at all, got very shy during the musical statue and just stared at her finger... it was hearbreaking and I wasn't expecting that... I know her class is with a majority of boy, quite boisterous and lots of dominant characters as well... I was quite depressed after in the evening, I am just wondering how she is at school... when I ask the teacher, she always says she is fine... I think she is OK on 1-1 but shy when in a big group... and by the way I am also French... so I just hope that it is just a proof of her being individualistic ...

Really interesting replies, thanks.

I was shy at school and tended to stick like glue to one friend at a time and be completely lost if they were off school. I still find it hard to socialise with more than a 1-1 situation although I've got all kinds of coping mechanisms now.

Dd would, I think, prefer not to be on her own. But she won't compromise and be with someone else if it means doing something she's not into. For her this is games like 'mummies and daddies' or anything that involves dolls or the home corner. She's mad on animals, mostly rabbits, and loves drawing and making up stories. I think even though she's very shy and socially quiet, that she's probably quite domineering to play with, she's not flexible, she wants to set the rules. It's a complex mixture to be - shy and domineering!

Her two old friends are total opposites in character. One is very sweet and passive and goes along with whatever dd suggests but in a very imaginative and enthusiastic way. The other is incredibly outgoing and popular and she and dd get along with each other largely on their mad sense of humour, love of words etc.

At school she's almost made friends with a couple of girls but it hasn't lasted at all. I don't know why, when I ask her why she doesn't play with xxx any more she just says 'I don't know'. I know she takes it hard the whole 'if you don't do such and such I won't be your friend any more' stuff that girls do. Dd's incredibly loyal. If someone's her friend they're her friend for life if they'll have her. So I tend to think she's maybe put the school friends off somehow with her spirit.

how mad, this French connection!!

must be something in it? dd has no links with French culture really, esp as my mum moved to London v young...

Imaginaryfriend - honestly, you could be describing dd to a tee! tell me your dd isn't a Taurean...????

dd is so loyal and choosy and selective too and, like your dd, is stubborn enough to want to choose the games but too nice and kind a person to be the class dominant meanie! that's why I feel, and have always felt, kind of a feeling that I can only descibe as "her time will come".
know what I mean?