At my wits end with 4.7yr old dd1 - what am i doing wrong?!

[madamy]

my dd1 is 4.7yrs and her behaviour since she turned 4 has been getting progressively worse .

She can be so lovely, thoughtful, fun etc but we never have a morning/afternoon/evening without her turning into child of the devil.

She strops, slams doors, hits out at us, dd2 (2.3) and sometimes ds (7 mths), is so rude verbally, throwa things around the room etc.
We've just been at my parents who she really likes and I was so embarrassed by her - calling them stupid, idiot, I hate you and almost spitting at them, kicking the furniture and so on. All of this totally unprovoked.

She can't cope with dd2 getting any attention and behaves like this then too.

We've tried telling her off, using naughty step, trying to reason with her/find out what's wrong, ignoring - all seem to have no effect at all. I've resorted to yelling at her and have been so near to smacking her - something luckily stops me!

I'm sure I'll hear that she's a normal 4 yr old - don't know if that will help or not, but just needed to get this off my chest!

She starts school full time next week - hopefully this will help as she'll have full days so get a bit worn out!

Also have dd of same age who has upped the ante on bad behaviour. We do n. step and put in bedroom if really ott. What she wants is your attention and a reaction of some kind. By explaining what is unacceptable and then excluding for a period denies her this attention. School may calm her down as they wont put up with thatkind of behaviour and if you work with teacher you can have consistancy of approach at home and school and present united front. Also try having a day or a morning when she gets you on her own and time just for her to go shopping, swimmig or to cafe. This will make her feel specil and not in competition with your other one. best of luck

If it's any consolation, she sounds normal.

She may be bored - in which case school will help but she is v likely to be completely knackered at the end of the school day.

Don't bother reasoning with her. Explain once in terms she'll understand and refuse to repeat yourself. Consistency is the key.

If she hits her siblings, scoop them up, lots of cuddles and sympathy, and ignore her.

Enjoy your quiet days next week - hope you don't miss her too much!

I took my dd2 out of the situation completly - if we were out at relatives she would be taken out to the car and I would stay with her but not in the car, I would strap her into the seat and then shut the doors and stand by the car. After 5 mins I would ask if she would like to come back into the house and go back in. If she started again then straight back out to the car.

This was all done without saying more than approx two words and very firmly calmly and with a face like thunder (my face like thunder)

It took her a little while to realise that she would m,iss out and not have fun like her sister. But I continued and soon she realised that it wasn't much fun in the car whilst her sister was in the house.

It wasn't much fun for me either but it worked and life became much easier when taking her out and about.

I should make sure that she has plenty of attention when being good and ignore her when she is in a strop.If at your parents, remove her to the car until she calms down and them make her apologise. When she is calm explain that she simply can't call people, especially those she loves,idiots or worse.School won't put up with that sort of behaviour and neither should you.

My DS us 4.2 and almost the same, which is why I have come upstairs to sulk. He can be so contrary and often ignores us completely when we are asking him to stop. I have noticed that he can be quite aggressive with other children sometimes too or not want to share, etc. He gets worse when he is over excited, tired or bored and has taken to saying things/people are "stupid" "rubbish" or "boring" "losers". He can be quite rude sometimes - he has the vocabulary of a child much older, but emotionally is just a 4 yo.

What we have done is to ban programs like Horrid Henry and other things like that, because we felt that he was mimicking the bad attitude from there and that has helped in the past week.

We also send him to sit on his little chair, which is in the same room as us, for time out for a few minutes, then get him to apologise afterwards and give him a cuddle. We have been doing that since last Saturday and it seems to work. All I have to say to him now is "if you don't listen you will get a time out" and he changes his behaviour.

But today (after what has been a busy and exciting week for him) he has been narky and annoying all afternoon. We took him to the park where he proceeded to moan about everything and be rude to other children. So madamy I fully empathise with you.

Reading it through madamy, I am perhaps making it sound too easy and I have been there so know it isn't.It is a long haul but you have to be consistent,remove and ignore-praise when they stop and get the apology. Don't forget to give individual attention when she is being good-it is easy to overlook that part.

Also, when you are visiting people, try bringing something for your child to do, so they can just go and sit with that and absorb themselves in a familiar activity while they calm down - we take a drawing/colouring book and pencils or take his Leappad. These are also things that other people can join into - adults and children and means that they can get attention but in a better way.

thank all - am just reading and going to run till later as getting tea! Will post more later

Yes she does sound normal, that does not make it any easier but normal it is!

Firm boundaries are what you need as in her being taken out of the room to the car if she's poisonous while you're out visiting.

Don't be worried into trying a million different things; just keep soldiering on, the age of reasonable-ness (for at least most of the time) is getting ever closer. My ds is five and the maturity he has compared to when he was four, is so different....hang in there.

oh and you may find her behaviour awful for the first half/term of being full time; they get SO tired and it's such an effort for them. Ds needed to let off steam big time when he first went full time. I also found he was really hungry and I took (still take) a snack for him to have on the way home. Might be worth a try, they are at least a bit less grumpy on a full tummy!

I think that the other thing to do is wait until you have her in a good mood and try some empathy. Remind her of some of the good things she has done with grandparents and ask her how she thinks they feel when she is rude to them. Also how she would feel if it was the other way round e.g. she fell over and Gran shouted at her and called her stupid and an idiot for not looking where she was going.