What is it all about???

[NAB3littlemonkeys]

DS1, 6 and 9 months just got in a mood because I asked him to tidy up, etc etc. Said he wanted to be killed, said he didn't care if I went, refused to listn, said he would wee all over the floor when I said he had to wait to use the loo and called himself an idiot boy.

DD now crying and has an attitude as well. DS1 has turned the light off and left her in the dark.

Have come downstairs after telling them to put themselves to bed.

All I want to do is cuddle DS but I know he will push me away or tell me to go away.

Can't work out DD at all.

I think you need to see a doctor about yourself and very quickly. You sound so sad and worried.

If you think he doesn't believe you love him, tell him more and show him until he does.

THIS is what I need. People to tell me what I am doing wrong and how I can fix it. I have no clue as to what I am doing and no clue as to how to be a parent. It's not like I had a mother to watch and learn from.

THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH.

Have to go to school shortly but will be back later to answer questions.

Just a quickie - I suppose I was hoping for a smile or something to show that he was acknowledging my praise and that he was happy too.

I don't think my DC's really think about how much I love them tbh. At their ages love is a very big thing to comprehend.
DD thought I was mad when I cried the other day at a song that was on lots when she was in SCBU. She thought I was even madder when I hugged her and said 'I love you so much you know' her reply? 'i'm ok now mum, stop being silly'

NAB, I think you're expecting too much of yourself personally and are so desperate not to repeat your own past you get overly concerned about it being perfect iyswim.

I bet if you took just one day where no-one got dressed, no tidying up was done, you sat on the sofa and ate crap, watching shitty films and made a conscious effort not to care about the mundane things, just for one day, you'd see the difference in them.

Was a bit concerned that your DH would tell your DS that you had gone .

I think I would probably sit down and say to DS that I was sorry that it had happened and ask him if he was scared when that happened and say you would not leave and that you just needed a rest or something. He must have been worried about it and I think it might be worth talking to him to put his mind at ease. Say it wasnt his fault at all - you werent feeling well.
I would get DH to back this up later on too.
We all shout and say things to upset our DC at times (well I do anyway) so am not trying to make you more upset but unless you have already made this clear to him he could be worrying about it. Well I imagine my DS would be so am just thinking your DS could be as well.

There's lots of things you can do at the moment just to spend time together at home even with other DC around - making cards for his teacher; cards for Daddy; making or choosing and wrapping gifts for DD/Daddy; doing all the cards for friends at school and for relatives - all these things have kept me occupied with mine after school the last few days. But then maybe you've done all that and I'm running late as usual. I've also printed off some Xmas wordsearches and stuff and we've done those. And we watch DVDs if he's too tired for other stuff. I havent bothered much with getting them to do any tidying lately as they are all quite tired - but I've tried to keep them occupied so they cant fight/make a huge mess too late in the day.

I hate to shine my torch on someone else's life/parenting, especially as I am a depressed and mixed up parent myse;lf, but sometimes we can project our own worries and feelings onto our kids a little bit too much. I guess that he is behaving how he feels he is expected to behave. He is somehow playing out your feelings as a child, in a funny way - being abandoned is something you suggest happened to you and now it is 'pretend happening' to Ds, in the conversations you are having with him.
I think you might be able to use some counselling about what happened when you were a child, because Ds is not you, as you say he is in a normal family with parents who love him, this I think is in your mind, the whole problem is something being 'created'...I think once you have some closure or understanding of your traumatic experiences as a child, you will be free to live in the moment and be the great mum you obviously are to them, without bringing all this abandonment and drama into the picture.

I really hope that doesn't sound harsh, I am simply saying that I suspect the problem lies in your past, and once that is untngled a little bit you will start to see Ds for what he is, and he will behave as he should. He is carrying something, some burden, trying to help you in some way...
This is merely an observation from an outsider and could be wrong.
Sent with much love though x

...and yes, I do it myself which is how I know.!

(((NAB))))... Have you had a look on the toxic/abusive parents thread ? There are some lovely ladies on there who had some bad childhoods who are trying to not repeat patterns with their own kids etc. Not sure if you've had any counselling for this and/or your depression

You are not a bad mum and you are not making a pig's ear out of things. FWIW, I don't think anyone has critisised you as such, just told you how perhaps they would deal with it ..

I agree with incentivising (a.k.a. bribing ?) children.. Its something that I thought I would never "resort" to before kids - but I do - regularly - and it usually works.. Its only like adults .. if we think we will be rewarded (say at work with a bonus) it will make us work harder. Is it such a bad thing ?

Finally, I know this is about so much more than tidying up - but just as a general rule, my motto is very much "Choose your battles wisely".. Children can go through a stage where they fight everything you ask them to do - if you take issue with every single thing, then you'll spend most of your time arguing/fighting your child. Obviously they have to learn discipline and how to do as they're told - but don't turn everything into a battle of wills. My dd refused to put her coat on this morning - I told it was cold and she should put her coat on. She didn't want to and I let her go out without it on. She made the decision, she dealt with the consequences of being cold. Sometimes you just have to give children some power and control. So maybe there is tidying to do and some other chore - offer him a choice to do one or the other and then maybe a further incentive if he "decides" to do both. You are then giving them some decision making power rather than dictating what to do.

I found some really useful bits in Kaz Cooke's Kid Wrangling book (for the record, I am on the thread I referred to earlier and have no decent parenting "example" from my parents either)

Good god I've waffled ...sorry

Pick your battles is actually the best advice I have ever been given. My dd went to nursery in a football kit with stripey tights, knee high boots and a pink cardigan the other day, a friend commented and then could not stop laughing when I told then that was not todays battle. Not being flipent just thought you could do with something a bit lighter.

Lol cherryred, Ds has been in shorts and t-shirts all day

Brrrrrrrr

Me: How did you feel when Daddy said I had gone?
Him: Nothing.
Me: Were you worried?
Him: No.
Me:I would never leave you. I love you so much.
Him: Anyway Daddy said you had left so he told a lie. Anyway did you know Sydney Opera House has been nuiilt 5 times?

Yup - last week she decided she wanted to keep her pj top on for nursery - they were new pj's she had for her b'day and she loved them.. I could see some of the other mums thinking "why on earth has she allowed her to wear her pj top ?" but I don't care, she was happy, no harm was going to come to her AND we had the whole morning routine without a single argument - result !

I know I am harsh for want of a better word with DS1 as I am expecting him to make everything all right as I don't know how too.

Will look at the toxic thread, thanks.

NAB I think you should be relieved that he didn't feel anything, although I doubt this is actually true. I would stop trying to get him to talk about his feeling at all. Let him know that it is ok to feel however he feels about things and focus on trying to have some fun and move on. I think you are expecting hime to make you feel better and they just don't do that. It is thankless and I believe it gets worse when they hit the teens. You need to find a way to move forward rather than going over the same thing.

and get Daddy to apologise for lying and saying you had gone... Lead by example and teach your ds that admitting they are wrong and saying sorry is the right thing to do...

As a pp said - sometimes talking to them whilst doing/talking about something else could help.. Maybe the one on one discussion seemed to "intense" and that's why he changed the subject. Perhaps just dropping things (like I love you, I would never leave you, you can talk to me if you're unhappy about anything type thing) into conversations about other inane stuff might get the message across without making ds feel uncomfortable... And - has the SOH really been built 5 times - wow !

NAB, I think him saying aboutt he sydney opera house shows that he wants some form of interaction with you, I agree that the whole leaving him convo may have seemed to heavy, but he didn't try and escape talking to you. He just tried to change the subject so I'd be heartened by that.

NAB, how tillyscoutsmum just reacted to the SOH thing is how you should try to react to the things he tells you iyswim. I think that was a better example than anybody could poss explain. how is today going?

I agree with Cherry and think you need to stop expecting him to have conversations about his emotions.I think the whole thing is too emotionally charged already.

have a duvet day. Eat popcorn in bed. tell him you love him and tell him all the reasons why he is a fab little boy.
(and it really isn't his job to make you feel better)

Re the previous questions. Are you getting help with your depression and, as a previous poster asked, have you had any suggestions on here that you think may help?

NAB, i know you are having a heard time with your little tyrant just now (im sure he is the cutest littel tyrant in the world though ) but i want you to re read this, bearing in mind that your DH also told DS you were gone.
Me: How did you feel when Daddy said I had gone?
Him: Nothing.
Me: Were you worried?
Him: No.
Me:I would never leave you. I love you so much.
Him: Anyway Daddy said you had left so he told a lie. Anyway did you know Sydney Opera House has been nuiilt 5 times?

I dont want to criticise you, because i actually think you do a really hard job, really bloody well, better than i could thats for sure. But i think that your DH was wrong to say you had left and i think it is wrong to play on these things. He is six years old and probably can;t explain his feelings so well anyway, he probably wouldnt let himself believe you were gone, or didnt let his feelings show. I think there are two problems with this, firstly your DH DID tell DS a lie so thats not a great message to send that it is OK for adults to lie, so it must be ok for him to do it. But more importantly, if something were to happen and you did have to leave for an extended period your little boy might blame himself. I know this is unlikely, also, it may just play on his mind.

You definately did the right thing by tellng him you love him and would never leave him though Christ, i dont know how i would cope and really i think you do a great job, but i just wanted to make my point that i dont think this particular idea was a great one.

I don't think it was a great idea either, but from how I read it NAB didn't know this lie was going to be told. It's down to her dh to sort it.

I totally know it was the wrong thing to say but we were desperate. We never get a break. I have no family at all and my inlaws can only do so much. They have a lot on at the moment with BIL being poorly and GN just recently passing away unexpectedly.

Goodness, I know DS1 isn't here to make everything all right for me. I never knew how to be a child never mind a mother!

All calm at the moment. I am trying to say yes as much as possible and the fact he has just dropped half his pudding on the floor really doesn't matter.