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Behaviour/development

Talk to others about child development and behaviour stages here. You can find more information on our development calendar.

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Original poster

Is she depressed? Or just very tired?

59 replies

MissM · 02/05/2012 09:56

DD (almost 6) is such hard work at the moment, mainly because everything seems to make her burst into tears. Mornings are horrendous - she spent over 10 minutes putting just her cardigan on today when we were already running late - and evenings are a nightmare. Everything you say to her - whether it's kind, firm, angry, gentle - makes her start crying. She won't do as she's asked to the point that I've asked her so many times that I start to get cross, then shout, which makes her cry again. She argues with me, answers back, shouts at everyone, and yet at the same time she looks so distressed by it all that I desperately want to help her.

I feel like I've exhausted all the strategies. I've tried to ask her what's upsetting her but she says she doesn't know (through tears). I've spoken to her teacher today to see if she's ok at school - teacher says she's very happy but is working incredibly hard. Yesterday I seriously wondered if DD was depressed, as all her behaviour seems to show symptoms. But perhaps she's just very tired and nothing more.

What can I do - I'm so exhausted by the constant battle!

OP posts:

Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

Set a reminder

mcfee · 02/05/2012 10:00

Just marking my place as have 7 yo exactly the same! Sorry no helpful advice though!

Original poster

MissM · 02/05/2012 10:02

At least I'm not alone!

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FunnysInLaJardin · 02/05/2012 10:08

Glad I've seen this. I could have written the same post about DS1 who is also 6. He seems to be acting strangely at the mo and has an answer for everything. At the same time he looks very tired and a bit bewildered. My CM who collects him after school says he seems fine and he says there are no problems at school. So I think it must just be down to him being tired and having to work harder at school than he ever has. He often comments that they do a lot of work and he wishes he was back in nursery! I think they are prob fine, just tired out. Plus he now does Beavers, karate and swimming as extra's, so thinking about it no wonder he's tired!

FunnysInLaJardin · 02/05/2012 10:10

oh and DS1 has been banned from all computer games, wii and DSI because he would not do as he was told. Writing this makes me seem like a very harsh parent............Maybe I am tired too!

foxeeroxee · 02/05/2012 10:11

Sorry no advice but lots of sympathy. im going through this with 5year old dd and would love to hear some ideas on how to best deal with it.

Original poster

MissM · 02/05/2012 10:21

I've banned CBeebies after school tonight because of her dawdling this morning. I feel really mean too, but I honestly couldn't think of any other way of getting the message through that she just had to do what she was told!

Somewhat relieved that there's a few of us out there dealing with this. Is there anyone who's got through it and can offer any tips?

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Original poster

MissM · 02/05/2012 10:22

'very tired and a bit bewildered' describes DD's expression perfectly too.

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igetcrazytoo · 02/05/2012 10:44

I had this at different stages when my dd was younger. I put it down to the strains and stresses of everyday life.

I think some children take school very seriously, and try and do everything right. Sit nicely, pay attention, share, work hard, listen up, concentrate etc etc, get lots of ticks on your work, earn reward stars, catch the ball, run fast
same for swimming lessons and other clubs. All those adults and other children to try and impress and please.

Then they come home and its the first time all day they can let go. You as the mum are they one person they can behave with as they feel (and they feel inside just like a little baby). So you get all the negative stuff they've been holding back on all day.

It is tiredness, but its emotional tiredness as well as physical.

igetcrazytoo · 02/05/2012 10:48

Sorry meant to add: If I picked her up from school and she seemed cranky - we would go straight home and eat buttered toast while cuddling and watching tv on the sofa for a while.

Often got told all the little worries as well.

However, I realise not everyone will have this luxury of time that I had as she was on only child.

Original poster

MissM · 02/05/2012 10:59

Igetcrazy I think that's very perceptive of you. She is the kind of child who tries to get everything right. She tells me very little about her worries - for example, she only told me the other day (in passing, and very casually) that for the first few days in Reception she wouldn't speak to anyone except one TA and one other child (who is now her best friend). I was really upset on her behalf that she'd felt that shy and anxious, yet no-one told me!

Sometimes I forget she's still only 5...

Feel even guiltier that I've banned CBeebies tonight!

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FunnysInLaJardin · 02/05/2012 12:40

Oh god, I'm feeling guilty now too. DS works very hard and is quite serious about getting things right and pleasing people. I agree too about him relaxing and letting off steam at home. He rarely tells me stuff and will only do so when in the right mood, but when he is we have some lovely chats.

Right, tonight I'm going to make time to sit and have a cuddle and a chat with him. It's so easy to let all the other stuff get in the way.

mercibucket · 02/05/2012 12:45

Does she take vitamin supplements? I'd also look at increasing her iron (spatone in juice?) And vit d (either in a multivit or by itself)
Ds1 was like this all winter but is low in iron n vit d. Can make them tired and cranky. He was tired at school as well tho
Can't hurt to try

Original poster

MissM · 02/05/2012 12:47

Have also decided to forego ballet tonight and read stories and cuddle on the sofa instead. Haven't considered vitamins merci - always assumed she was getting enough from her diet which is really good (one thing we don't have problems with!)

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ohanotherone · 02/05/2012 12:53

Set her morning targets! Explain that she needs to focus on tasks and do a star chart and then have a reward for when she does morning tasks properly!

Breakfast
Clothes
Teeth
Hair

Just keep repeating what she needs to do next if she forgets...

Teeth.............................................................................................. teeth, have you done teeth????? (Don't shout)

Organise yourself and RIDGIDLY stick to this routine until mornings become pleasant again.

Honest, this will work!

softpaw · 02/05/2012 13:01

when my oldest DD was 6,there were 2 other DDs,2 and newborn.I remember so well,Miss M,feeling that she was just out of control at home. Her behaviour with me was awful,but school was going fine.Then, one evening,I shouted "what's wrong with you?"
She said"i don't know what i'm doing"
I still feel the total shame,when I remember her little face. Take the time to speak to her about how she's feeling. My DD felt usurped by her sisters,displaced,in the way.
Talk,talk,talk.

AgentSmith · 02/05/2012 13:15

How's she sleeping?

Original poster

MissM · 02/05/2012 14:06

Generally, she sleeps well. But the getting to sleep is really hard work. We have story time with her brother, then one of us does some reading with just her in bed which she really likes. If it's a weekend or early she can read to herself for 10 minutes, otherwise it's straight to sleep. But, she fights tooth and nail not to fall asleep, often calling out or coming down or telling us that she's had little nightmares and can't sleep. So even if she's in bed by 7.30 she can sometimes not go to sleep until almost 9pm when things are really bad.

Softpaw your post has made me all teary! I think a chart may be the way to go. It worked in Reception.

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FunnysInLaJardin · 02/05/2012 14:21

MissM that's exactly how DS1 is. His brother goes to bed at about 6.45 and he should be in bed for 7.30. Often he is up and down stairs, even though we tell him off, and doesn't sleep until 8.30-9pm. This morning he was up at 6 wanting to do colouring in.

softpaw that is so sad, but so good that it forced the conversation. I can imagine something like that happensing with DS1

FunnysInLaJardin · 02/05/2012 14:22

in fact DS1 came down the other night and said he'd had a nightmare and I said you can't have because you haven't been to sleep yet, and he said 'it was a daydream'

Original poster

MissM · 02/05/2012 14:27

DD says whenever she closes her eyes to go to sleep she has a nightmare. at 'daydream'!

I suppose the thing that made me think of depression is the continual bursting into tears. Everything is approached with such heightened emotions. It's difficult to know when the crying or emotion is genuine or not.

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FunnysInLaJardin · 02/05/2012 14:44

DS does cry more than usual at the moment, but only when he is frustrated or being told off. That is always a sign that he is tired. You watch, all this soul searching and they'll be fine tonight!

Original poster

MissM · 02/05/2012 14:45

I was thinking exactly the same thing Funnys! Was thinking how I could talk to her on the way home from school, and imagining her saying 'huh?' and remembering nothing!

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Somethingwicked · 02/05/2012 14:46

I was just about to start a thread about my DD1 who is 4 and going through a very similar sort of phase, except she is bad tempered, grumpy, answering back, critical of her younger sister and brother, fussy about her clothes to a pathological degree, aaaargh. She does tend this way as a general rule, but of late, I find myself exploding daily and being driven to the brink of madness by it. Yet outside of the private family context she is impeccably behaved, and if I said to anyone, friends or wider family, that I found her a very difficult and unlikeable person at present they would be really surprised. I know there must be some imbalance somewhere in her life which is causing this, but I am damned if I know what it is or what to do about it. I am totally at the end of my tether with her. I find that on a day when she is at home all day, we can both go the whole day with barely a smile or a laugh, just conflict conflict conflict. No matter how much I try to use all the arsenal of techniques for dealing with small people, she just seems to be angry with everyone and everything and towards me, particularly full of hate. Anyway, point being, you are not alone, and I wonder how many other people struggle with negativity at home with young children when all looks smooth on the surface outside the house....

lesstalkmoreaction · 02/05/2012 15:02

A few tips I can think of is to firstly break the cycle of arguing, give yourself and her extra time in the morning to get ready, focus the night before on what you want to happen and focus on the positives, really try to praise the smallest thing. Its so hard to not shout in the mornings but turn away and don't speak until you have calmed down. If you shout she will, i've been there and all it does is end in everyone being upset.
My youngest is ds age 7 and he can be quite tearful if things don't happen as he wants but if he knows the routine and knows what is expected it does run smoother.
I find punishments that happen after school for behaviour that happened earlier are a waste of time and just starts an evening argument. Much better to start agian, tell her that you don't like to shout and you must both try not to, get her to be part of the change. Instead of no tv after school have 10 minutes sat down together just being quiet having a drink together talking about whats going to happen later and reward each other for both getting through the evening with no tears or arguments. But focus on the positive behaviour and ignore the rest for now. and see if it helps the change in atmosphere.

AgentSmith · 02/05/2012 15:11

Re breaking the cycle of arguing:

Consider letting her set the times by which she should have done each thing (teeth, hair, breakfast etc) in order not to be late for school.

Then leave it up to her to actually do them by that time.

The first day, she won't manage it and she'll be late for school. She'll get in (a little bit of) trouble at school.

The next day she'll do a bit better and probably get there on time. You might need to agree together to make the times earlier.

That's the kind of thing that works for our (very independent) young lady. We then end up with her reminding me to be on time (!) - which I prefer to me nagging her.

It sounds like she's getting a lot of attention for bad behaviour at the moment ... this is one way to make the bad behaviour get less attention from you... (although maybe more from the school).

It only works if you really genuinely leave it up to her and allow her to actually be late for school at least once.

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