Is she depressed? Or just very tired?

[MissM]

DD (almost 6) is such hard work at the moment, mainly because everything seems to make her burst into tears. Mornings are horrendous - she spent over 10 minutes putting just her cardigan on today when we were already running late - and evenings are a nightmare. Everything you say to her - whether it's kind, firm, angry, gentle - makes her start crying. She won't do as she's asked to the point that I've asked her so many times that I start to get cross, then shout, which makes her cry again. She argues with me, answers back, shouts at everyone, and yet at the same time she looks so distressed by it all that I desperately want to help her.

I feel like I've exhausted all the strategies. I've tried to ask her what's upsetting her but she says she doesn't know (through tears). I've spoken to her teacher today to see if she's ok at school - teacher says she's very happy but is working incredibly hard. Yesterday I seriously wondered if DD was depressed, as all her behaviour seems to show symptoms. But perhaps she's just very tired and nothing more.

What can I do - I'm so exhausted by the constant battle!

I think she sounds anxious. Try asking her about specific things that might be worrying her - at a guess, I'd try asking about 'does she worry if she thinks that she might not get something right', 'does she feel as if she has to get everything always right' 'does she worry about doing things wrong'. The dawdling might be related to a bit of worry about school - it sounds as if she is experiencing (maybe self imposed) pressure to perform at school.
She may be tired as well, which might compound how she feels.
book can be really helpful.

Link should be 'This book can be really helpful'.

reading all this,brings so much back for me.Please listen to an Oldie..they don't need all the stuff that you throw at them..classes,ballet,gym,whatever....children need your time,your face,your focussed interest in them.
Even 10 minutes will do.
just listen to them

I'm about to start the bedtime craziness, but thank you to everyone who's posted such wise advice or just 'you're not alone' comments - all is much appreciated! I will read back properly at my leisure when all is calm once more tonight. Just one thing - i think she's anxious too, just got to work out why.

Just thought i would add my experience. when my son started school we got him involved in Karate, beavers, swimming and it became a nightmare.

He just could not cope with after school activities and became so overtired that we had to pull him from his clubs as his behaviour became terrible and family life suffered.

Things improved immediately and we did not start after school activties again until he was in year 5. He was much older and didnt get so tired.

When they are so small school is about all they can cope with.

My ds is still only 2.5 so we have all this to come but I wanted to share a couple of thoughts from my experience. Emotional tears really are "cleansing". I remember crying quite often as a child, partly cos I had a bloody rotten temper and partly cos I needed the release from my thoughts. Brushing my hair used to soothe me. Our nanny has a soon to be 11 yr old and when she wants him to talk she sticks him in a deep, hot bubble bath. But don't assume you have to sit and chat, a pillow fight can be as good a release of tension as anything else sometimes!!

She sounds stressed out and tired to me

I prescribe 7.30pm bedtime with no "screen time" allowed after 5.30pm
I also prescribe some 1:1 palytime with mummy each day

Does she get enough physical exercise?

hahahaha@Reeny

Hi there,
I recognize this behaviour from both of my children (5.5 and 3.5). We call it "going wrong" and is what happens when they are exhausted, either physically or emotionally and often both. Earlier bedtime, opportunities to chat re any worries (for older one), good meals, cutting back on all extra things like after school stuff and playdates and you are a long way to solving it. Sometimes I think it happens when their brains are trying to take on lots of new stuff. Eg leaps forward with reading/any other development.
It's hard as behaviour at this age (5/6) has to have consequences but sometimes they are like toddlers (IMO) when exhausted and really have lost control of their behaviour. I think this is when the adult has to take charge and make the changes so they can get back on track.
Good luck!!!

My ds who is in reception is like this too and I have been getting o worried and frustrated about him. His behaviour at home has been so difficult, his temper tantrums unbelievable and lots of crying.

He is doing really well at school and seems to be making friends after a rocky start. He also has after school activities. I have spoken to his teacher a few times to make sure everything was okay and she reassures me that there are no problems so I have been racking my brains over this.

Reading this post has opened my eyes and I so want so help him

EssentialFA she doesn't watch TV after Tree Fu Tom finishes at 5.45 (I'm very mean with TV watching - they're only allowed Octonauts and TFT after school), and she does get exercise as we walk almost a mile to school and back each day. 1:1 mummy time sounds like a good prescription. She's only 18 months older than her brother, and I often feel sad that she didn't get the exclusive time with me that he's getting now before starting school. I was also made redundant last year so he's had less time at nursery than she ever had as I went back to work after she was 12 months.

Anyway, we had a big cuddle after school yesterday and I told her that I loved her and that I wanted to make the mornings better. She suggested that I help her get ready more, and I suggested that if she was ready by 8.15 we'd have a story before we left. It worked quite well this morning - much less dawdling and only one threat of tears. I also had them both in bed by 7 last night and she was asleep by 7.30 - definitely helped!

MissM both DS's were in bed for 7.30 here too and both asleep by 7.45. It was bliss! Plus neither woke until 7am today. This morning was much better, besides I felt better because I'd had a full nights sleep

Me too! Clearly a lot to be said for a decent night's sleep.

So have we solved it then? They just needed more sleep?

If only it was that simple - sigh.

Although I do think more sleep is definitely part of the answer. It's easier said than done though - if DD won't go to sleep (see nightmares and daymares above), then what? It's finding ways to manage the tiredness and the anxiety isn't it.

Do you know the book Playful Parenting? It has some great advice for helping your child to relax and to deal with their worries. One of my favourite books ever!

At times like this, I really think its worth babying them. I sometimes dress my nearly 6 yr old dd. Of course she can do it herself, but the path of least resistance is a good one to follow if we're all feeling tired and stressed (and late).

Loads of fantastic practical advice up thread - if only I could remember all of it all of the time...

I haven't read that book, will have a look for it. We had a chat in bed this evening about how much happier she seemed today, and I wondered why she'd not been happy recently. She told me that she doesn't like it at the moment if she's anywhere away from me, which could explain why she's dragging her feet over getting ready to go to school. She said 'I never ever want to be away from you mummy' .

She has been quite clingy recently - a friend's mum had to ring me during a playmate cos DD had started crying that she wanted me. It's really unusual for her - she's usually very confident and happy to go off and do things without me. I'm wondering why she's feeling insecure at the moment and what I can do. I can't spend my life with her wherever she goes!

Selks could you link to your suggested book again? The link doesn't work for me.

Bless your dd, what a cutie! You won't need to spend your life doing everything with her, believe me!!! There will cOme a point where you atenot welcome to join in huge swathes of her life!
But more one on one time in the short term sounds like a great idea.

We once when we were all at the end of our tether for no discernible reason had an 'activity free' week.

No afterschool activities, no friends for tea, nice hot baths and early bed for us all, and it really settled us.

The DCs knew they weren't being 'grounded' but that we just needed to back off from the world for a bit and take a breather.

School can be really hard work, especially for the littlies.

We have similar problems with dd1 (8), mornings are hard work.

I can highly reccomend making her a chart using pictures of what she has to do in the morning (for us its: go to the loo, shoes on, cardigain on, coat on, get in the car), she can then be reminded of what she has to do without being nagged (its very tiring having to continuesly remind them and shout at them). Doing dd1's hair is often what triggers her off so i save this until last (she gets dressed first). Once we are in the car the dd's get a biscuit as a reward for getting ready without mummy getting angry .

Luckily her school has a training day tomorrow so she has a day at home. Perfect timing. Timetosmile - we've had two evenings now of no TV and in bed by 7, and I feel a whole lot calmer as a result! Interestingly enough, neither of them have protested at all.

I will have to print off this thread as evidence for when the time comes that she can't bear to be seen with me!

I wonder whether there is a problem for her at school.Whether there is a staff member for example that is upsetting her.I think something or someone may have upset her.