Friends baby keeps biting my baby!!

[Nikki1stbubba]

Evening all!

Im new here and this is my first post (although if ever i've needed an answer for something i've always come on here and read other peoples advice).

I'm at a loss as to what to do and could really do with some advice.

My friend's baby is 10 months old while mine is 9 months old and they couldn't have more different personalities if they tried!

I'm really not being bias but DS is an absolute angel and has been since birth. He's always been a good sleeper / eater / communicator etc and is generally an absolute joy to be around as he is such a happy and loving little boy.

My friend on the other hand, seems to have had the 'problem child' out of the two of us (even saying that I feel guilty!) Her little boy has been a screamer since the moment he entered the world......and still is a screamer.

My MIL works with children that have a whole range of disabilities such as Autism, Asperger's, ADHD and so on, and she seems to think (just by what i've told her) that he may have a touch of either Asperger's or Autism.

I'll give you all a run down of his behaviour and see if anybody else could shed some more light.....

*He screams non stop

*Doesn't interact with his mum (although he is a bit better with other people, by that I mean you might be lucky enough to get a smile out of him)

*He flaps his arms about a lot

*Has no perception of other childrens feelings (10 months old is very young I know, but to sink his teeth into my DS over and over again, dig at his eyes, scratch him and just generally terrorise him causing him to cry for 4 hours solid one morning without batting an eyelid and just going about his business until he gets bored and comes back to bite DS some more) seems a little disturbing to me. He didn't even bat an eyelid when DS was balling his eyes out because he had attacked him so much!

*He doesn't say anything yet, not even mumbled 'mummm' or 'da da da', he just makes this high pitched screaming noise when he's playing

I feel really bad but its making me not want to meet up with my friend (of 15 years) anymore.

She popped round to me the other day for a 'play' date. They arrived at 11am and left at 4pm. The whole time my other wise sociable angel clung to me, sobbing and looking absolutely terrified. I was getting a little bit annoyed as I thought that if it was my DS that was causing such upset, I would have been mortified and made my excuses / apologies and left, but she never, she stayed and more or less told me that my DS needed to 'toughen up'!!!

I dont know what to do, do I mention to her that I think maybe she should get some advice (he viciously bites her aswell, she has deep scars all up her arms and legs and a fresh looking wound on her eyebrow now aswell) and risk offending her or do I continue to stay quiet and put my poor child through this torture at our so called 'play dates'????

Sorry for the REALLY long post, Its been on my mind for a while and its nice to be able to vent my frustration on here instead of chewing DH ear off :D

Thanks and look forward to your replys xx

10 months is far too young to assume that he has aspergers/ASD. At this age they have little sense of others. I'd put off the 'play dates' to be honest, make yourself very busy. Don't put your child through this.

Thanks for replying Lady.

I have been doing that, but then of course comes the gossips, I then get called a 'snobby' mum!

DOnt get me wrong, I like my child to have clean clothes on every day, eat 3 square meals and sleep peacefully at night but I'm far from a snob and really dont know how to shake the label that I now seem to have??

Is it just me or does parenting seem to have gone down the drain? Since when did it become wrong to try and be a good parent?

You need to care less about what people think. There's no compromise when your child's health and wellbeing is involved. If she can't control her child then you don't have to let them into your home. Babies this age are very rarely violent so she does need to get some professional support.

Your right, I feel that Im doing a good job and baby is happy and healthy so that's all that matters. I do need to forget what other people think, something i've always been a worrier about and about time I let it go :o

Thanks for you help.....

Not a problem Welcome to mumsnet

Thank You! :)

Nikki1stbubba just be careful......the tables could turn very quicky. Children go from one stage to another......yours may not always be an angel and a 15 year friendship is quite special.

I know and in no way am I thinking that I'm always going to have an angel, some days, when he's needy, I get just as stressed as other mums.

I do believe that basic foundations, genetics maybe, stability at home etc are all important factors as to how a child turns out. Then again not always, my own mum was a really good mum to me and my brother yet he still went off the rails so I suppose you cant always point the finger at the parents.

DS just seems to be a baby that has a calm temperament thats all.

I feel bad for her as shes a single mum and I know she struggles sometimes, yet after the fiasco the other day I wont be jumping to take him off of her hands for a few hours :(

My ds used to bite me and my bfs little boy. We nearly fell out over it but our friendship survived -thank god,. After 26 years she is as important to me as anyone. Ds is now a lively sociable boy.

um

If another baby was sinking his teeth into my DS over and over again, digging at his eyes, and scratching him I would move my baby away/pick my baby up and I fail to see why you would not have done. V odd

I'm just picturing her coming on here in 18 months or so saying that her lo is an absolute angel but her mate's lo is going through the terrible twos something rotten.

BoysAreLikeDogs

ummmm

Did you not see in my original post that I said he clung to me for 4 hours? He was on my lap the majority of the time, when he seemed to relax and was watching the other baby play for a little while I let him down again, only to pick him back up again when other baby flew at DS!

booge

Im really hoping thats the case as obviously i'm not going to fall out with her over it, it would just be nice to meet up and have a coffee without me having one very upset baby thats all :(

oh, my bad

COCKadoodledooo

I think maybe you've misread my post? I'm not on my high horse at all! Im just concerned for friends baby, worried for her as she is at her wits end and obviously I dont want my baby to be upset for 4 hours thats all!

BoysAreLikeDogs :o

At that age they have no empathy. They don't consider anyone's feelings, even their parents. They wont play together. They are in their own little bubble of "me me me" land. Everything is new to them and they are exploring the world in their different ways.
If you have a problem you need to remove your child from the situation.

And there's no way your MIL can make any sort of "diagnosis" of aspergers when, from the sounds of things she's never even met the baby, or indeed even if she had met him. I'm no expert but doesnt it take a while to get an aspergers diagnosis from medical professionals?

I don't think so.

10 month olds have no empathy. They have very little cause and effect knowledge either. I remember my niece at a similar age tugging hard on her ear whilst yelling because somethin hurt, she just couldn't realte the 2 things together. Your friend's lo would probably have no idea that the noise your dc was making was as a result of his actions.

Wow.....I'm shocked! Ive been reading topics and advice on hee since I was pregnant and DS was born 9 months ago and have always been pushing myself to actually join, when I do.......I get slaughtered!

I know they have no empathy, i'm not expecting him to be concerned over my babys feelings, all Im saying is he doesnt even see that another child is crying. Im not saying he should feel bad for it, Im just saying he doesnt even notice it! When we are out and about and DS hears another child cry he watches them like a hawk in fascination, surely yours did that too? Thats typical baby behaviour right?

She never made any kind of diagnosis at all, again, my post has been mis understood. All Im saying is she has worked with children with these type of conditions for over 30 years, signs and symptoms come up and its just a possiblity thats all. She just said that if a child was presented to the doctors with those problems they would just keep an eye on him, in no way make a diagnosis.

I came on here for some advice and to fill my evenings with chit chat with other mums instead of staring at the TV, have I made a mistake? Is that not what happens on here?

Your child, and your friend's child will not feel empathy for at least another couple of years. He does not know that his actions cause your DS harm and if he did understand that, he would not care. He cannot have perception for others feelings at 10 months.

I also don't think that you can diagnose a child of that age with Aspergers or Autism, even if your MIL works in that field, she cannot tell you that. I would certainly not advise you to mention that to your friend.

As to the violence, it does seem excessive but all you can do is protect your child by keeping them apart. If necessary by not meeting with her until he is passed this stage. Some children go through phases of biting and scratching, and then suddenly grow out of it.

Your angel child may, I am afraid to say, turn into a biter in 6 mths or a year. It is not due to parenting.

Gah. 2yo been at my keyboard. 'Scuse typos.

Um, Nikki, I think you are reading too much into the posts.

No one is being nasty, we are just pointing out that a 10 mth old has no concept of feeling sorry for another child, or showing sympathy or being curious why a child is crying.

They may note that there is a noise, but they cannot process it further than that.

As to your comment about potential diagnosis of SN - I can see that you mentioned that as you are worried about your friend's little boy. Posters are merely pointing out that it is too early to tell if the child has some kind of autistic traits.

Oh my goodness, I'd say that 9 / 10 months is far too young to be making any assumptions at all about character or behaviour (do they speak at that age - I've got 3 and can't remember). You just can't tell how things will pan out (really - i promise). I'd say please keep seeing your friend, but maybe keep it for shorter times as clearly you don't want your DS to be having a horrible time. After a 15 yr friendship you really don't want to let that drop and if your friend's baby is difficult then presumably she appreciates seeing you and your support. Accept that when she is there you need to keep a close eye on your son and check everything is OK, keep it to an hour or so which you can cope with.

Things turn so quickly. My DD1 was so perfect, slept through 12 hrs a night from 8 weeks, happy smiley amazing..... then she turned into a high spirited, tantrum monster biter.... i'll never forget the look I got from her nursery school teacher (she was 2) when I was told 'there's been a bit of a biting incident', my heart sank... then she told me my daughter was the one bitten and I practically cried with relief and happiness that for once it wasn't my DD causing the problem, the teacher thought I was potty being so happy about my daughter being bitten! (DD now 6 and a model child). My beloved DC3 (now rising 3) went through a ghastly stage of pushing and shoving and hitting for no reason at all. I basically had to stop letting him socialise with other toddlers as it was so hard. I really appreciated those friends of mine who would put up with us (albeit hovering helicopter like over their beloved darlings the whole time we were there to avoid injury), and now it's all stopped and he is such a sociable little poppet.

So in summary, don't let your child suffer - keep it short, but don't cut off your friend altogether.

MmeLindor

I know nobody is being nasty, it just seems people are quick to jump on the band wagon and point out to me that 10 month old babies dont have the ability to understand their actions.....I know that, I'm really not silly. Maybe I didnt put that across enough.

NellyTheElephant

I'd love to keep it to shorter visits, but she just doesnt seem to want to budge! I cant blame her I suppose, she must go crazy at times being on her own with a high spirited child. In future I'll have to go to her ( Ihave suggested this many times before but she always seems to prefer to come to me) so that I can make my polite excuses and leave.

I totally understand your relief to know that yours wasnt doing the biting! I dread the day when I get a phonecall or a teacher / parent meeting telling me my child is bullying another child or being rude to teachers. We all have high hopes and aspirations for our children, and I think we focus so hard on how good they are, that when they do something naughty (as they are all bound to do at some point) our worlds come crashing down and reality hits in that angelic child is becoming normal child and going through the stages of childhood.

I shall keep my fingers crossed for now that the day angel turns to monster, is a long way off :)

smallwhitecat

I couldnt leave as it was in my house, I made every effort to make it obvious that play time was over by tidying up, saying DS was overtired and needed a nap, said I had to go shopping etc but none of the above worked and I'm really not rude enough to ask someone to leave.

AGAIN, she did not make a diagnosis!!! The baby really was as bad as I have said, hence my reason for coming on here for advice!!!