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British name or foreign (Italian) name for dual-nationality child abroad?

89 replies

LeeMiller · 25/05/2018 09:34

Hi all, we're just starting to think about naming our first child. I'm British and DH is Italian, we live in Italy and are planning to stay here. Our baby will have an Italian surname. I would like a middle name (although it's not common here and should probably be short as child will legally have to include it in signature etc, so it will be used more than middle names usually are in the UK). We want a British element to be included in the name somewhere. My name poses problems here (loads of middle names so too long for forms, it's not spelled phonetically, lots of Hs etc) so we'd try to avoid those by choosing familiar/classic British names that are easy for Italians to pronounce.

We have a rough shortlist of names, both British and Italian, but we can't decide how to combine them. Our choices are:

a) British first name and Italian middle name

b) Italian first name and British middle name
c) 'International' first name pronounced the same(ish) in both countries and British middle name

DH prefers an Italian first name as it's easier for the child, whereas I have a common English name and would have loved something foreign and unusual growing up, so favour a British first name.

I'm curious, people bringing up kids outside your home country, what option did you choose and how has it worked out? If you grew up with an obviously foreign-sounding name, did/do you like it?

(Our current shortlist includes James, Joseph, Jude, Max, Cosimo, Amadeo, Leonardo and Lucy, Rose, Rosamund, Rosalind, Charlotte, Eleonora, Clara, Alida, Livia and Lucia - particularly if you're Italian, what's your perception of those names? )

Sorry that was so long!

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LeeMiller · 25/05/2018 21:42

Thanks bikerun and Isee, international names seem to be the consensus.

badpolicy it hadn't occurred to me that Clara might be pronounced Claira! Thanks for pointing that out...

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SeamusMacDubh · 25/05/2018 21:57

Carlotta? Not heard anyone with that for a while.

I've not heard of Clara being pronounced Claira.. I don't think I'd let it put me off.

More suggestions:

Diana
Teresa
Bonita
Bettina
Patricia
Ursula
Viola/Violeta
Rosita
Ramona/Mona

educatingarti · 25/05/2018 22:04

What about Luisa? Spelled the Italian way, but pronounced the same ( ish) in both countries.

fridaseyebrows · 25/05/2018 22:21

We are Irish / Italian and had the same dilemma - I insisted on common pronunciation in both languages for first names as I HATE the way our Italian family will always just ignore what the persons actual name is and just use the Italian version (so George becomes Giorgio Philip becomes Filippo Anne becomes Anna etc - we even had engraved gifts given to our children with the wrong spelling on it!) and to be fair my Irish family do the same (Marco becomes Mark!).

We are in the U.K. so easier to use common Italian names and they are still unusual - Francesco, Matteo, Luca my favourites for boys, Gaia, Chiara, Livia for girls. (Although Livia just makes me think of Montalbano!)

My impression is that in Italy they are generally less adventurous around names (especially boys) so there is a smaller pool of very common names used. Then there are names that are so local that it is immediately obvious where someone is from based on that name (Cosimo would be one, but also Gaetano, Gennaro, Nicola, Angela etc) personally I would also want to avoid that. Also names in Italian that are boys names but girls names in English (Andrea etc) also to be avoided! We also want d to avoid names that were just slightly different in each language as people would just be lazy and use the most familiar version (roberto vs Robert for example)

We have ended up with Italian first names and British / Irish second names and so far that has worked really well here. My DH really didn’t want to have second names for the bureaucratic reasons mentioned, but I won that argument!

IHeartKingThistle · 25/05/2018 22:27

The English/Italian kids I know are Antonia and Carla.

WitchesGlove · 25/05/2018 22:40

How about:

Christina
Sara
Carla
Tula
Chiara
Natalia
Margareta
Marcella

CafeAuLait7 · 25/05/2018 22:42

My daughters name is Alessandra Elise.

LeeMiller · 26/05/2018 10:12

Thanks for the suggestions Seamus, witches, IHeart. Bettina is pretty and Carlotta is growing on me, I wouldn't want it to be shortened to Carla though, as she was a mean girl at my school. It's so hard to shake off negative associations even if the name is objectively nice! Rosita and Bonita sound more like nicknames to me. I have always loved Viola (and Orsino!) since I studied 12th Night at school, but unfortunately it holds unpleasant associations for DH and his family.

Cafeaulait your daughter's name is lovely, but my nephew is Alexander.

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LeeMiller · 26/05/2018 10:31

Fridaseyebrows that is very good advice, how true that they tend to Italianise everything, something to bear in mind. I'm with you on pronunciation, my nephew has a 'dual' name with a different vowel sound in French and English and now only answers to the French version. DH has one of those names that sound female in English and got very fed up being called Miss and Madam when he lived in the UK so we'll definitely avoid that pitfall! If we lived in the UK then I'd go for Francesco/Francesca but we are tripping over them here!

It's hard for me to judge the regional aspect (or other connotations) but I have found a diffusione map on Nomix! I know DH (a proud Fiorentino) likes Tuscan names like Cosimo, Lapo, Michelangelo (too much for me!) but it's hard for me to judge perceptions elsewhere. I have liked Livia since I saw the garden frescos from Villa Livia in Rome, but I know there'd be a Montalbano association for many people, I actually like Salvo/Salvatore (sounds sunny and friendly to me) but DH laughed at that one!

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Melassa · 26/05/2018 11:29

Rosita is the hen on the Mulino Bianco ads! I would avoid...

willisurvive3under2 · 26/05/2018 12:17

Livia is really beautiful. I'm Italian and there's nothing wrong with it at all.

catalinablue · 26/05/2018 12:17

From your shortlist I think that Max and Leonardo would be lovely for boys. For girls, I like Livia and Lucia from your list. Some other names that I think would likely sounds lovely in both Italian and English are Stella, Serena, Vanessa, Valentina, Caterina and Elisa for girls. As well as Christian/Cristian, Enrico, Emilio, Claudio, Stefan and Thomas for boys. :)

CopONNotLinkedIn · 26/05/2018 12:21

I love Italian names! I'd like an Italian sur name and I don't think it is too strange to mix it with an English or French first name (for example) Each example has to be considered. No hard and fast rule.

Cosimo works but Lapo sounds short for a medical procedure to me. ''going in for a lapo tomorrow''

My friend dated a man called *Mike Piacentini. WE all swooned over his name.

CopONNotLinkedIn · 26/05/2018 12:24

I like the suggestion of Luisa

(works in Spain too)

LeeMiller · 26/05/2018 12:40

Thanks copONNotLinkedIn, Lapo is lucikly out as 2-syllable 'o' names sound funny with DH's surname - which if fine but not as beautiful as Piacentini. I know too many Louises (80s child) to properly appreciate Luisa.

catalina Leonardo is off the list today as my UK friend has just announced her newborn is Leo! Max could be a nice manageable middle name, I think. I quite like Elisa.

Thanks "willisurvive", right now I'm leaning towards Livia with an British middle name if it's a girl...

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Camomila · 26/05/2018 20:55

We're Italian/English living in England.

I like names that sound the same in both languages.

Boys:
Alex (Could be Allesandro or Alexander)
Sebastian/o
Nicholas (Nick or Nico)
Thomas...I know a few Italian Thomases.
Leo
Raphael/Raffaele

Girls:
Lucia
Clara
Matilda/e
Rosa
Livia
Elisa
Aurelia (seen as old fashioned in italy but i love it)
Alessia

LeeMiller · 26/05/2018 22:00

Thanks Camomila. Almost all your boys' names are close friends or family! I like all your girls' names except Alessia (horrible ex colleague) and Matilda (too popular here). Do you think Brits would pronounce Lucia Lu-see-a though? Some family members still struggle with DH's name 10 years later as they can't seem to get past the spelling.

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CopONNotLinkedIn · 26/05/2018 22:04

I love Livia. Also love Julia / Giulia

elQuintoConyo · 26/05/2018 22:26

Milena for a girl?
I have known:
Milena
Lina
Emmanuela
Rosalie
Alessandra (countless!)
Benita !
Valentina

Gianluca
Gianluigi (my favourite - plus he was ACE!)
Renato (one cool dude)

I'm a Brit living in Spain with Spanish DH, we went for an international name that has minimal pronunciation differences. We didn't bother with a middle name as they have 2 surnames here already, and any 'middle' name would be tacked onto the first name. So:

Max John Smith Jones

would be 'Max John' every day of his life.

Spaniards are stumped by middle names. But they think it odd i don't have 2 surnames and try and use my (laugh-out-loud hilarious 70s) middle name as my first surname Grin

Camomila · 27/05/2018 06:57

Re Lucia I'm not sure as I've never known an English one...but my nonna was a Lucia and no one struggled to pronounce her name the Italian way after the initial Introduction.

We (Italians) aren't very original with boys names I don't think. I really liked Luca but DS already has at least 6 cousin Lucas!

IfyouseeRitaMoreno · 27/05/2018 07:13

Livia is lovely!

LeeMiller · 27/05/2018 07:14

elquinto how funnny, I have two surnames, maybe I should have married a Spaniard instead!

I am slightly worried about the middle name issue but I've spoken to a couple of Italians with second names who said it's fine if it's just one (I have 6 names in total and it's a nightmare here!). DH has a very short surname and names sound incomplete to me without a middle name. I teach some kids whose parents are from Sri Lanka who have LOTS of long names and they're listed on the carta d'identità, but not used or written at school, for example.

Camomila yes, Lucas are everywhere. It's also a close family member's name so I'd avoid anyway. I I teach little kids and it's common for 80% of boys in the class to be Lorenzo/Francesco/Mattia.

I like Giovanni but English speakers often say the i and it sounds dreadful so I don't want a Gi name.

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LeeMiller · 27/05/2018 07:30

Right now I'm liking Livia best... Livia Charlotte/Livia Rose/Livia Rosalind/Livia Eleanor/Livia Kate

My favourite for a boy is Cosimo but DH has just proposed Ludovico... (Ludovic is a family name for me so there's a connection, which I like), nn Ludo. Is it too pretentious? According to DH most of the names I like tend towards pretentious and or/ancient!

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elQuintoConyo · 28/05/2018 08:33

Ludovico/Ludo is FANTASTIC Grin love it love it!

TatianaLarina · 28/05/2018 09:08

Love Livia. Prefer Cosimo to Ludo but both are very cool.