Moving from London to Australia

[muminwestlnd]

Hello everyone,
We are a young family and we are thinking of moving from London to Sydney. It is a big move and I want to do the right thing by my family. My priorities are for my children to be happy in life and performing well at school. We have stable jobs, we live in a lovely area in London and my children are both happy at their school. However, I am unhappy in London, the weather takes the life out of me and we have no family or real friends we can count on. Being in Australia means we will be near my husband's family and close to childhood friends. It sounds like Australia is an obvious choice, but when I started doing my research, it may be that I won't be able to secure a private school for them (Australian registers their children to school when they are born) or able to easily move if things don't work out. Also, it seems there is a lot of bulling on Australian schools too. We have friends at elite Sydney schools that are struggling emotionally. In London, we are spoiled of choice of schools (you will always find many good private schools). Sorry, I know it may sounds snobbish but do want to keep them in a private school as it is what their are use to. We are not rich by any means as our salary goes to the children's school and a mortgage, but also moving probably means that we won't be getting as much salary in Sydney. I would love to hear your thoughts (please be kind). How likely is to get a place in a reputable school in Sydney (registering a year and a half in advance)? Is bulling common thing in Australian schools? Is it really helpful being close to family or may be a pain in real life?

Australia has one of the highest rate of bullying in the world. https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/article/2024/may/21/australian-school-students-most-bullied-among-comparable-english-speaking-countries-report-finds?CMP=share_btn_url . Australia also has a very high rate of suicide , even in fancy suburbs .
As far as I know, it is not that difficult to get a place in private schools.

People here have very busy lives, way busier than continental Europe, so even if you are closer to family and friends, it doesn't mean you will see them much, People also go to bed insanely early. You wouldn't meet during the week.
Cost of living is also way higher, especially housing and fresh food and you should budget for that in addition to private schools fees.

I understand private school is important to you for some reason, but if you opt for a rich suburb, such as Mosman for example, you will find plenty of surgeons', uni professors' , diplomats' kids at the free Mosman High school without having to pay for that networking. I can think of plenty of good use for $300.000 of school fee (12 years ) that could go to help them buy a house instead of school.

For a non-Brit, this obsession for private schools is so bizarre. In France, it is quite the opposite. Private schools is for those too dumb to succeed in the public system, and religious schools is for those with behaviour issues. And single sex schools, OMG, don't get me started.

Why do you want to move to Australia? Sounds like you’re sorted in the Uk apart from the weather

I guess that your husband is Australian? And you, too?

I can't give you any advice about schools, but this thread has some info and discussion about moving from the United Kingdom to Australia.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/aussie-nz-mumsnetters/5275628-pros-cons-of-moving-to-aus-from-uk

Good luck!

Have you lived/worked/been to Aus before?
Where exactly in Sydney are you thinking of living? There can be a vast difference in schools, along with weather variants between the east and west of Sydney.
Have you looked at those shows like Wanted Down under?
What work do you both plan to do? Have you looked into the requirements if retraining/different certification is required?

We have friends at elite Sydney schools that are struggling emotionally. Which schools/areas are you referring to?

I’m in Brisbane but lived in Sydney for a few years. DH still works there but commutes every other week. The cost of living is stupendous relative to income. We have had Americans and Canadians who are gobsmacked at how much it is to rent in the nice areas (eg Eastern suburbs, Northern beaches or Turramurra/Wahroonga of Sydney).

If I were you I would make up a detailed budget. Check out realestate.com.au for a rental that you would like and see the price. Check out your weekly grocery list (Woolworths or Coles). I have electricity billls ranging from $1600-2500 per quarter in summer using aircon. Phone and internet (NBN) is about $150/month (check Vodafone, Telstra or Aussie Broadband).You need to pay for private health insurance for tax so even if you just paid for hospital only this will be at least $250/month (look at Medibank Private, Bupa, AHM etc). We have hospital and extras (silver level so not the top top cover and ours is $700/month). You will need 2 cars so factor in car expenses.

Schooling is tricky as good private schools are $$$. Say Knox is 24-30k per year for high school. Here’s the link to Better Ed so you can wheedle down schools and get an idea of costs. Yes, waiting lists apply especially for entrance at certain stages eg Y7 or Y5 but schools often have spots in the other years when other students leave. bettereducation.com.au/school/Secondary/nsw/sydney_top_secondary_schools.aspx

Also geographically it’s a big trip to go back and see family or have them come so you. You’d have to accept your kids might not see grandparents, cousins etc for years at a time.

The weather is lovely and Sydney city is beautiful with the harbour etc. During and after Covid a lot of people moved out of Melbourne & Sydney to Brisbane, Sunshine Coast, Gold Coast and Tasmania or Adelaide as unless you are making a lot of money (household income >$500,000 it’s a bit of a rat race. In saying that my DH has work colleagues with household incomes >$800,000 and they are still not financially comfortable as they have high mortgages, 2 x luxury cars and live in expensive suburbs where their houses are easily 3 million.

Sorry also just say you have young children. Another huge cost is childcare. In Sydney it’s around $130-150/day per child (sometimes that doesn’t even include food, nappies etc). It’s means tested so if your household income is over $533,000 you pay for all of it. Between incomes of $80,00 and $533k the subsidy decreases with the more income you make,Some people with high incomes and at least 2-3 kids can find it cheaper to higher an au pair or nanny rather than taking them to childcare.

https://www.servicesaustralia.gov.au/your-income-can-affect-child-care-subsidy?context=41186

We are away from family and friends and it can be quite lonely. Our kids are growing up away from family and we have no one we can count on. We are unhappy in the UK as the weather is so bad, you can’t spend much time outside with the kids. People with small kids will understand.

I have relatives in Sydney. They say the weather is equally a problem, just the other way round. They don't go outside at all in summer, it's indoor pools and air conditioned soft play all summer. They only go outdoors in late autum, winter and early spring.

Sydney is very expensive, food is expensive, rent, houses, power, all have gone up loads. Sydney is a huge place though you would need to be more specific the area you were looking at. The weather can be abit all over the place there too. I live in Queensland and find Sydney pretty miserable in winter, cold rainy ect.

Ok - makes sense! Hope you’ll get everything sorted and be very happy there

Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I worry a lot about suicide as we have close family members going through this pain. I understand your point on free school, it makes total sense. However, having to go from 10-12 children in class to 30 in the public system it’s quite a difference and we want them to have a smother transition as possible. We were so happy to visit Australia a few months ago and it was always the plan to move as soon as the kids were born. However now that we have kids there is so much to consider.

Private schools in Australia have the same class sizes as state schools. I work in a private school, last year in my year 8 class I had 31.

Wow that’s a rip off. So I guess the only difference would be the facilities between state vs private? My husband went to a competitive university degree and 50% of pupil came from private schools, 40% from selective and only 10% from non selective school. My understanding is that nowadays is almost impossible to get into a selective school though. Of course it depends on each child, and it may be at that year/specific uni and it may have changed these days.

Sydney is not expensive comparing to London though. A coffee will cost you $10 and it’s not always good. In Sydney you can find good coffee everywhere for half of the cost. House prices … oh don’t get me started :)

Thank you, that’s very helpful!!

Yes, my husband is Australian and I’ve been to Sydney a few times and I love the weather, the people and spending time with family and friends (who says how crazy we are for living in London since Sydney is so amazing). That’s the reason I am looking for honest opinions rather than bias opinions from family and friends :) Quality of life seems great but of course I was there only on holidays. It seems much safer than London too, although I was surprised to see so many people on the north shore with cameras outside their houses. Is it really safe as people say?

However, having to go from 10-12 children in class to 30 in the public system it’s quite a difference and we want them to have a smother transition as possible

We had kids go to both public and private schools. Class sizes were always larger in the private system than we experienced in the public schools we used as essentially the private schools are a business looking to maximise $$. The money not benefit we found for private was behaviour management (they can throw kids who are disruptive out whereas public cannot), and pastoral care. The actual academic component was no more or less beneficial in either system.

As my husband is Australian we won’t need to spend money on flights (but we do currently as we live in London). We have no family in the UK. Private schools here re £35,000-45,000 +VAT! Basically most of our income goes to the children’s education. Houses are also very expensive here (more expensive than Sydney). Money wise we may be not much difference as salary likely to be reduced if we get new jobs moving to Sydney. The big pro in UK is that kids are settle at school and we have stable jobs. The big cons are: weather, been away from family and friends, healthcare in crisis, safety, the cost of living, …. The list goes on and on… I only been on Sydney on holidays so I wonder if I have the real picture. The school research demotivated me as it seems so hard to get and lots of billing going on.

In the UK we enjoy outside in summer only so I guess they have three terms to enjoy in Sydney compared to UK. Plus safety, been cose to family and friends, eating out much cheaper, ….

London is much more expensive though and the weather is much worse

Thank you, very kind :)

Wow, such negativity here! I live in Sydney, my three kids all went to private schools when we emigrated in 2007 which we could never have afforded in the UK. Top tier schools are still half the price of UK schools (DD’s last year in 2021 was $38k Aus so around £20k?). My kids went from pre-school to Y8 on arrival and none of them or any of their friends have ever had an issue with bullying, our experience has been one of kids being kids for longer and a much more outdoor focused lifestyle. Much easier for all your kids to have their mates around when you have a pool. Mine have had an education we couldn’t have dreamed of if we had stayed in England (where my eldest was assaulted by a teacher in a “nice” SE England state school). Yes Sydney is expensive and your experience will depend very much on where you live but North Shore Sydney has been a pretty amazing lifestyle for our family.

Talking to my brother, Australia is not immune from the cost of living etc. He moved several years ago and it hasn’t always been smooth sailing.

However, as your family are there but not here, best to go when children are still young.

We moved over from London in 2017. My kids are in a public primary school and they only have 18-20 in their classes. The private schools in the area all have 30-32. If you pick the right area, public schools can have better provisions than their private counterparts.

Cost of living is definitely higher here. Food, health insurance, medical expenses (GP/imaging often not covered by Medicare or insurance), transport etc can be significant. Driving a car is cheaper....that is basically the only thing that I've found to be cheaper so far!

Thank you so much for sharing, I am glad it worked well for you. How far in advance did you register your kids at schoool? All our friends have their children registered at birth and it worries me that I won’t be able to get them in now. I want to move to Sydney, I am not been negative about it. I have not been in holidays so it’s hard to tell. We didn’t school visits last year and I was surprised there is so many school psychologists at schools and the necessity of them saying they are very strict about bulling (since we haven’t asked). I get you had a bad experience in SE, but we are in a lovely private school in SW London and it’s so lovely that it is THE thing keeping me here. Also, last time I’ve been to Sydney I’ve noted there is so many houses with cameras. I hear Sydney is very safe and I wonder why people in the north shore have cameras outside their houses? Sorry, It’s a honest question, I am trying to get as much as information as I can before making such a big move.